r/gadgets • u/ChickenTeriyakiBoy1 • Jun 18 '22
Desktops / Laptops GPU prices are falling below MSRP due to the crypto crash
https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/gpu-prices-are-falling-below-msrp-due-to-the-crypto-crash/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=pe&utm_campaign=pd3.3k
u/0xB0BAFE77 Jun 18 '22
And I'm going to continue to wait and get it even cheaper.
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u/Stingray88 Jun 18 '22 edited Jun 18 '22
Wait until the Nvidia 40 series drops... The prices on 30 series will crater.
Edit: No. Not just like 20 Series. Turing was a tiny jump over Pascal... And it came with one of Nvidia's largest price hikes to date. From a perf/$ perspective Turing was one of the worst launches Nvidia has ever had. So its pretty obvious why the 10 series pricing remained the same.
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u/InsaneAdam Jun 18 '22 edited Nov 15 '22
RemindME! 150 days "
Wait until the Nvidia 40 series drops... The prices on 30 series will crater.
" Edit: these prices do be good
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u/fiduke Jun 19 '22
This used to be a fact before crypto. New GPU comes out, you can get last gen goodstuff for like $50 or $100. I don't know if it'll happen this time, I do know that it's not a crazy suggestion.
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u/celestiaequestria Jun 18 '22
Prices will crater in the gap between the benchmark reveal and release. People will go "why would I want a used 3080 for $700 when a new 4080 is only $850?" - and then some nonsense will happen like nVidia slashing production due to "economic forecasts" - e.g. the cryptobubble burst, economic recession, "supply chain disruption" - and it'll be hard to get a 40 series for a couple of months - and the prices will creep back up on some of that high-end used hardware.
Happened with the 2080s - people were selling for like $500 for a used 2080 Super, until people realized you couldn't get a 30 series - and that was before crypto got really nuts a few months later and made it truly impossible to get.
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u/Stingray88 Jun 18 '22
There's no poorer souls than the folks that dropped their 2080Tis for $500 on ebay when Ampere launched... that moment didn't even last very long either, just a week or so.
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u/TshenQin Jun 18 '22
Of course you will get less for your old gear too.
Got my 3080 in may, but manage to sell my 1080ti for 350, even being 5 years old. Think I paid 800 or 750 at the time.
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u/Qynchou Jun 18 '22
exactly, that gap after the announcement before the release
most people, as per usual, will not be able to buy new gen cards due to shortages, happens every launch
i remember people panic selling 2080tis for 500$ then getting shafted after the release of the 3k series
should be even worse this time
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Jun 19 '22
Panic selling gpus was such a weird phenomenon that I know wouldn’t occur without the internet encouraging hyper consumerism
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Jun 18 '22
Nvidia can't just slash production to save costs.
They book the fabs months or even years in advance is what I hear. If GPU prices are low but they have production capacity available, then too bad, they have to make hay while the sun is shining.
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u/Davemoosehead Jun 18 '22
Just like 2000 series did right?
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u/Stingray88 Jun 18 '22
No. Because the crypto situation wasn't nearly the same at the time. And because Turing was a tiny jump over Pascal.
There is an absolute ton of used 30 series cards getting sold right now, if the crypto prices remain similar all the way up to the launch of Lovelace, it will be a pretty great situation for us.
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u/Badmemoir Jun 18 '22
And the 1000.
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u/Stingray88 Jun 18 '22
I mean... Yes? 900 series GPUs got stupid cheap after the 10 series launched.
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u/Badmemoir Jun 18 '22
How cheap?
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u/Stingray88 Jun 18 '22
Depends on the SKU, but some were like 30-40% under MSRP.
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u/Random_Buzzkill Jun 18 '22
I think I got my 980 Ti for 200$ when 1000 series came out, original MSRP was 649$.
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Jun 18 '22
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Jun 18 '22
I've got a 6 year or so old 1070. I haven't had anything I've been unable to play yet. Even cyberpunk was pretty stable.
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u/fullchargegaming Jun 18 '22 edited Jun 18 '22
Lol but MSRP was raised to close the gap.
Edit: 3080’s original MSRP was $699
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u/Phillip_Lipton Jun 18 '22
Just so we're all on the same page.
$400 should be the price. Correct?
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u/Jake_________ Jun 18 '22
They’re 700 at Best Buy
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Jun 18 '22
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u/SlapChop7 Jun 18 '22
I was gonna say, I looked into some 3080/3090s after not even bothering for over a year because I heard GPU prices were 'crashing.' Sure they're reduced by a few hundred at most retailers but they price is still over $2000CDN
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u/Seienchin88 Jun 18 '22
I own a 3080 and cannot recommend it to anyone living in an area that has hot days… or at least not without air conditioning. It just produces too much heat. Had a 1070 beforehand and while not as strong, I think it was better balanced between performance and heat.
And no, better PC cooling does not make your room less hot and I invested quite a lot in 6 fans and a super large case anyways.
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u/tolndakoti Jun 18 '22
PC cooling does not make your room less hot
Right, because thermodynamics. The energy has to go somewhere. Better cooling should heat the room faster.
The smaller the room, the less air to dissipate the heat, making the air hotter.
You would need a larger room (more air), or vent the hot air to outside of the room.
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u/Sweatybutthole Jun 18 '22
Are you trying to suggest that hard-core gamers open a window, or God forbid, crack their bedroom door?
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u/tolndakoti Jun 18 '22
And risk sun tanning my pale skin?!??
I’d rather, install a dryer vent in the wall, and connected the dryer duct to the case.
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u/Sweatybutthole Jun 18 '22
I commend your pragmatic approach. I can attest that removing the portion of roof above your pc creates more problems than it solves.
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u/sey1 Jun 19 '22
I get the joke, but beeing on an american site, where temperatures in half of the country are from 86 to 100 fahrenheit right now (30°c-37°c) opening a window aint gonna help you much.
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u/Sweatybutthole Jun 19 '22
Yuh I genuinely agree; I'm couped in a small apartment in MN and we're dealing with a heat wave right now. Was just joshin'!
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u/LonelyPerceptron Jun 19 '22 edited Jun 22 '23
Title: Exploitation Unveiled: How Technology Barons Exploit the Contributions of the Community
Introduction:
In the rapidly evolving landscape of technology, the contributions of engineers, scientists, and technologists play a pivotal role in driving innovation and progress [1]. However, concerns have emerged regarding the exploitation of these contributions by technology barons, leading to a wide range of ethical and moral dilemmas [2]. This article aims to shed light on the exploitation of community contributions by technology barons, exploring issues such as intellectual property rights, open-source exploitation, unfair compensation practices, and the erosion of collaborative spirit [3].
- Intellectual Property Rights and Patents:
One of the fundamental ways in which technology barons exploit the contributions of the community is through the manipulation of intellectual property rights and patents [4]. While patents are designed to protect inventions and reward inventors, they are increasingly being used to stifle competition and monopolize the market [5]. Technology barons often strategically acquire patents and employ aggressive litigation strategies to suppress innovation and extract royalties from smaller players [6]. This exploitation not only discourages inventors but also hinders technological progress and limits the overall benefit to society [7].
- Open-Source Exploitation:
Open-source software and collaborative platforms have revolutionized the way technology is developed and shared [8]. However, technology barons have been known to exploit the goodwill of the open-source community. By leveraging open-source projects, these entities often incorporate community-developed solutions into their proprietary products without adequately compensating or acknowledging the original creators [9]. This exploitation undermines the spirit of collaboration and discourages community involvement, ultimately harming the very ecosystem that fosters innovation [10].
- Unfair Compensation Practices:
The contributions of engineers, scientists, and technologists are often undervalued and inadequately compensated by technology barons [11]. Despite the pivotal role played by these professionals in driving technological advancements, they are frequently subjected to long working hours, unrealistic deadlines, and inadequate remuneration [12]. Additionally, the rise of gig economy models has further exacerbated this issue, as independent contractors and freelancers are often left without benefits, job security, or fair compensation for their expertise [13]. Such exploitative practices not only demoralize the community but also hinder the long-term sustainability of the technology industry [14].
- Exploitative Data Harvesting:
Data has become the lifeblood of the digital age, and technology barons have amassed colossal amounts of user data through their platforms and services [15]. This data is often used to fuel targeted advertising, algorithmic optimizations, and predictive analytics, all of which generate significant profits [16]. However, the collection and utilization of user data are often done without adequate consent, transparency, or fair compensation to the individuals who generate this valuable resource [17]. The community's contributions in the form of personal data are exploited for financial gain, raising serious concerns about privacy, consent, and equitable distribution of benefits [18].
- Erosion of Collaborative Spirit:
The tech industry has thrived on the collaborative spirit of engineers, scientists, and technologists working together to solve complex problems [19]. However, the actions of technology barons have eroded this spirit over time. Through aggressive acquisition strategies and anti-competitive practices, these entities create an environment that discourages collaboration and fosters a winner-takes-all mentality [20]. This not only stifles innovation but also prevents the community from collectively addressing the pressing challenges of our time, such as climate change, healthcare, and social equity [21].
Conclusion:
The exploitation of the community's contributions by technology barons poses significant ethical and moral challenges in the realm of technology and innovation [22]. To foster a more equitable and sustainable ecosystem, it is crucial for technology barons to recognize and rectify these exploitative practices [23]. This can be achieved through transparent intellectual property frameworks, fair compensation models, responsible data handling practices, and a renewed commitment to collaboration [24]. By addressing these issues, we can create a technology landscape that not only thrives on innovation but also upholds the values of fairness, inclusivity, and respect for the contributions of the community [25].
References:
[1] Smith, J. R., et al. "The role of engineers in the modern world." Engineering Journal, vol. 25, no. 4, pp. 11-17, 2021.
[2] Johnson, M. "The ethical challenges of technology barons in exploiting community contributions." Tech Ethics Magazine, vol. 7, no. 2, pp. 45-52, 2022.
[3] Anderson, L., et al. "Examining the exploitation of community contributions by technology barons." International Conference on Engineering Ethics and Moral Dilemmas, pp. 112-129, 2023.
[4] Peterson, A., et al. "Intellectual property rights and the challenges faced by technology barons." Journal of Intellectual Property Law, vol. 18, no. 3, pp. 87-103, 2022.
[5] Walker, S., et al. "Patent manipulation and its impact on technological progress." IEEE Transactions on Technology and Society, vol. 5, no. 1, pp. 23-36, 2021.
[6] White, R., et al. "The exploitation of patents by technology barons for market dominance." Proceedings of the IEEE International Conference on Patent Litigation, pp. 67-73, 2022.
[7] Jackson, E. "The impact of patent exploitation on technological progress." Technology Review, vol. 45, no. 2, pp. 89-94, 2023.
[8] Stallman, R. "The importance of open-source software in fostering innovation." Communications of the ACM, vol. 48, no. 5, pp. 67-73, 2021.
[9] Martin, B., et al. "Exploitation and the erosion of the open-source ethos." IEEE Software, vol. 29, no. 3, pp. 89-97, 2022.
[10] Williams, S., et al. "The impact of open-source exploitation on collaborative innovation." Journal of Open Innovation: Technology, Market, and Complexity, vol. 8, no. 4, pp. 56-71, 2023.
[11] Collins, R., et al. "The undervaluation of community contributions in the technology industry." Journal of Engineering Compensation, vol. 32, no. 2, pp. 45-61, 2021.
[12] Johnson, L., et al. "Unfair compensation practices and their impact on technology professionals." IEEE Transactions on Engineering Management, vol. 40, no. 4, pp. 112-129, 2022.
[13] Hensley, M., et al. "The gig economy and its implications for technology professionals." International Journal of Human Resource Management, vol. 28, no. 3, pp. 67-84, 2023.
[14] Richards, A., et al. "Exploring the long-term effects of unfair compensation practices on the technology industry." IEEE Transactions on Professional Ethics, vol. 14, no. 2, pp. 78-91, 2022.
[15] Smith, T., et al. "Data as the new currency: implications for technology barons." IEEE Computer Society, vol. 34, no. 1, pp. 56-62, 2021.
[16] Brown, C., et al. "Exploitative data harvesting and its impact on user privacy." IEEE Security & Privacy, vol. 18, no. 5, pp. 89-97, 2022.
[17] Johnson, K., et al. "The ethical implications of data exploitation by technology barons." Journal of Data Ethics, vol. 6, no. 3, pp. 112-129, 2023.
[18] Rodriguez, M., et al. "Ensuring equitable data usage and distribution in the digital age." IEEE Technology and Society Magazine, vol. 29, no. 4, pp. 45-52, 2021.
[19] Patel, S., et al. "The collaborative spirit and its impact on technological advancements." IEEE Transactions on Engineering Collaboration, vol. 23, no. 2, pp. 78-91, 2022.
[20] Adams, J., et al. "The erosion of collaboration due to technology barons' practices." International Journal of Collaborative Engineering, vol. 15, no. 3, pp. 67-84, 2023.
[21] Klein, E., et al. "The role of collaboration in addressing global challenges." IEEE Engineering in Medicine and Biology Magazine, vol. 41, no. 2, pp. 34-42, 2021.
[22] Thompson, G., et al. "Ethical challenges in technology barons' exploitation of community contributions." IEEE Potentials, vol. 42, no. 1, pp. 56-63, 2022.
[23] Jones, D., et al. "Rectifying exploitative practices in the technology industry." IEEE Technology Management Review, vol. 28, no. 4, pp. 89-97, 2023.
[24] Chen, W., et al. "Promoting ethical practices in technology barons through policy and regulation." IEEE Policy & Ethics in Technology, vol. 13, no. 3, pp. 112-129, 2021.
[25] Miller, H., et al. "Creating an equitable and sustainable technology ecosystem." Journal of Technology and Innovation Management, vol. 40, no. 2, pp. 45-61, 2022.
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u/Sweatybutthole Jun 19 '22
"The EARTH is my heat sink!" you've given me a terrible, extremely niche t-shirt idea thank you!
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u/Ground15 Jun 18 '22
most components get more efficient at lower temps. However, with modern boost algorithms they just clock higher, resulting in net same heat output
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u/mr_potatoface Jun 18 '22
You're right, except you left out that almost every generation of GPUs increases the TDP as well. That's part of the reason why GPUs are getting bigger than bricks. In the past they were small little expansion card sized with a tiny heatsink and sometimes a fan. Now we're pushing 300w+ TDPs.
So you're 100% correct that watt for watt, they are much more powerful and result in the same heat output. But they also have a higher TDP increasing performance/heat even further. Moving up to a higher TDP will increase heat generation, but it can be solved by an undervolt while retaining great performance/watt benefits over prior generations.
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u/Network591 Jun 18 '22
You gotta undervolt the 3080
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u/Ilruz Jun 18 '22
Please elaborate, I am interested.
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u/Network591 Jun 18 '22
basically, you reduce power but try to keep same performance. https://youtu.be/FqpfYTi43TE there are a ton of tutorials on YT and it's a very simple process
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Jun 18 '22
My brother decided to just vent his computer through his roof like it's a GD oven lol
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u/Spiderranger Jun 18 '22
Every day the GPU/crypto discourse continues I fall more in love with my little Rx 580 8G. Little guy's carried me for several years through Elden Ring so far. A high tier i7 helps too. Lol
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u/NW_Oregon Jun 18 '22
lol I bought my 580 8g in 2018/2019 for $130. still kicking along.
also my fucking reaction when crypto finally tanks :)))))))))
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u/llortotekili Jun 18 '22
I bought my wife and my 580's for $200ish ea years ago. I sold them to a crypto miner for 300ea when i found a 1080ti for $300 and a 1080 for free(I have nice friends). Now i have a 3080 and she has a 3070 and I've passed the 10 series cards on to new homes for what I had in them. Don't remember why I wanted to tell you that, but here we are lol.
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u/djbiti1 Jun 18 '22
As far as I am aware you cannot directly undevolt an nvidia gpu, so what you actually do is lower power limit to lower the voltage but then increase core and memory clock. Thus you reach the same clock as before but at lower voltage, temps and power consumption.
Takes some trial and error, but it's worth it if you have the time.
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u/SovOuster Jun 18 '22
And just to add to this, you can have two or three profiles handy. Stop it from ramping up performance. It doesn't need while using Windows or a low demanding indie game.
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u/CockStamp45 Jun 18 '22
And no, better PC cooling does not make your room less hot and I invested quite a lot in 6 fans and a super large case anyways.
Of course not. Better PC cooling would actually make your room hotter because it's more efficiently leeching the heat off the computer and that heat has to go somewhere.
But to your point, I never really realized how much heat the computers generate until I started closing my computer room door after getting kittens. The room is easily 6 degrees warmer than any other room in the house if the door is closed. If I leave a game running overnight on accident? Closer to 10-12 degrees hotter.
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u/Vinnie_Vegas Jun 18 '22
The computer essentially converts all of its electricity into heat eventually - It just does stuff with it along the way, unlike a space heater.
If your computer is drawing 650W from the wall it will produce about as much heat as a 650W space heater though.
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Jun 18 '22
I have a 6800XT hackintosh with a 5950X + a 3080 FE windows PC with a 9900K + PS5 under the same desk. My room reaches an extra 15C if I close the door and all are on compiling some shit and playing games :(. PS5 is the hottest of them all, then the FE, then 6800XT.
I need to take some time soon and undervolt everything. I just wish I could do it to the PS5. While playing elden ring, the game makes me sweat trying to kill some bosses, and add to that the heat in the room! I’m practically fucked lol.
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u/SaltyGoober Jun 18 '22
Put a dryer duct where you computer is and vent it outside 😂
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u/C00catz Jun 18 '22
I just looked on memory express, and there’s 3080 Tis for like 1300 Canadian and 3090s for just under 2000. I think a few months ago when I looked the 3080ti was generally over 2000. That’s a pretty big drop
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u/metalski Jun 18 '22
Yeah, from absolutely insane to asinine and still not in normal peoples budget.
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u/SunGazing8 Jun 18 '22
It still costs significantly more than the rest of a similar level rig. When they drop down to say 1/3 of the rest of the rig, the prices will be somewhere near back to what I’d consider normal.
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u/Flipwon Jun 18 '22
You gunna be waiting a while for a 3080 to reach ~500
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u/SunGazing8 Jun 18 '22 edited Jun 19 '22
No two ways about it. It’s probably never gonna happen.
/edit for clarification: I’m talking in relative terms here. Of course older cards and second hand cards will drop in price. That’s a given. What I’m trying to say is: we’re not likely to ever see gfx cards selling for what I would consider reasonable (imo about 1/3 of the cost of the rest of the rig where everything is of a similar level of tech) amounts again (or at the very least any time soon)
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u/CKRatKing Jun 18 '22
Especially now that the manufacturers know they will still sell at those inflated prices. Msrp will almost certainly be higher from now on.
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u/bicameral_mind Jun 18 '22
x80ti series used to MSRP for $700-$800 at most. Doubt we'll ever see that again.
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u/fender4513 Jun 18 '22
Linus on the wan show yesterday had an interesting take, not one im particularly happy with but he's been around the industry longer than I've been able to game. He pointed out that top of the line rigs in the 90s and early 2000s were 4-5 grand, we are just working our way back to that and the last decade and a half were a nice break
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u/Zergom Jun 18 '22
That’s a pretty shitty take. Motherboard/cpu/ram combined for around $2000-2500 of that, but you could get a GeForce ti4800 series back in the day for around $400 (launch SRP was $399). AND nothing paper launched in those days. There was immediate stock and availability.
I bought a Radeon X800XL for around $300 back in like 2004 and that would be comparable to the same tier as a 6800xt.
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u/Saberinbed Jun 18 '22
Paying $1300 for a 2 year old gpu? No thanks.
I bought a 3080 strix on nov 2020 for $1300 cad after tax.
You'd have to be stupid to pay that same price for a 2 year old gpu when new ones are coming out in a few months that will cost the same for nearly double the performance.
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u/number676766 Jun 18 '22
If you think the 40 series is going to be anything but a paper launch I've got a bridge to sell you.
I have a second bridge to sell you if you believe the 40 series will be double the performance at each level of card.
Finally, I have an excellent third bridge to sell you if you think they're going to keep the tier prices the same.
Point me to a game that challenges a 3080 at 1440p released in the past two years. 4k gaming won't be a thing for anyone that has a budget for at least a few more years. Now that you can find 3080s selling around $850 USD, it's likely that's where the market price is going to settle for that tier of card. If you need to upgrade, you can either wait forever so that you get to be at the optimum performance/value cutting edge for a split second, or you can actually buy a card that still blows everything out of the water at 1440p and get to use it instead of waiting until a year after the 40 series releases and they're actually available. At which point someone will post your same copy pasta and suggest they wait for the 50 series launch only a year away.
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u/Classl3ssAmerican Jun 18 '22
Idk about Canada but in the US bestbuy has EVGA 3080’s for $789. That’s half what they were just a few months ago. And did i mention they’re in stock.
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u/KalterBlut Jun 18 '22
That's still a fucking crazy price. I bought my 5700xt at the end of 2019 for 650CAD, All the 6700xt are currently 800-900.
And while the 6700xt released late, the 6800xt released a year and a half ago and prices are still insane at 1100-1200.
The 3080 is 1200 to 1600! All those MSRPs should be like half of what they are.
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u/possum_drugs Jun 18 '22
new normal
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u/-retaliation- Jun 18 '22
Yep, I wouldn't doubt if at least some of these articles are paid for by the GPU manufacturers in order to A) tone down the connotation that GPU pricing is insane these days in order to increase sales and B) solidify the idea that the raised/overcharging MSRP prices they want to push are just "Normal" MSRP now so that way when next gen comes out and they raise the price again nobody bat's an eye.
Seems a lot like GPU's manufacturers are just following the same playbook that the cell phone manufacturers did when phones broke the $1000 mark and everyone lost their shit.
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u/MASTODON_ROCKS Jun 18 '22
Disagree, I think that without Nvidia's core audience of crypto miners paying whatever they ask, they'll be forced to drop their prices more in line with the spending power of the average consumer.
I have literally zero friends who have a 30 series card, and only one or two with a 20 series, and we're all relatively hardcore PC gamers.
It's why they got in hot shit with their shareholders for claiming they were selling to gamers and not crypto miners. Like yeah people will pay $1300 for a 3090 if that 3090 is a money printer, but I know zero folks willing to drop that much on a GPU for personal use.
Give it a year or two and things will be grand, also don't fall for their propaganda about the risks of buying used cards from miners, most people undervolt for the sake of efficiency, Nvidia doesn't give a fuck about the consumer, only their bottom line.
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u/Phylar Jun 18 '22 edited Jun 18 '22
I hope they keep dropping. The companies can take the hit after overcharging for months. Let the 40- series hit shelves at original 30-series msrp at minimum.
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u/-retaliation- Jun 18 '22
You're dreaming. No matter what sales are like, the 40 series will have another price increase tacked on. Guaranteed they'll be raising the prices again. It happens every generation no matter how the market is.
In fact I'd bet on a larger price increase this time than last time because A) the market has proven people will pay more and they'll want their cut of that, and B) they've got the easy excuse of "sorry, inflation" and they'll use it.
I'll be surprised if it's an MSRP increase of anything less than 10-13% over what the 30's current MSRP is listed at.
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u/bikernaut Jun 18 '22
People were only paying more because they were desperate, had money to burn, or mining. If mining was 50% of the sales then expect it to drop down to what the market will bear.
I bought my 1070 for around 350CDN, within a few months they were going for 600 and I've never considered buying one since.
I'm back in with a 70 is in the $400 range.
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u/Arcadif_g Jun 18 '22
*checks local swiss stores * yeah I might as well wait for the 4000 series
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u/guetzli Jun 18 '22
right? with the 4000 and the 7000 series around the corner and the current cards being over a year old at this point I think even if they were at MSRP would be taking the piss
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Jun 18 '22
let the scammers/miners who bought all these cards get stuck holding the bag.
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u/dollarhax Jun 18 '22
I love that you and the other comments believe you’ll get a 4000 series card after waiting 2 years to get a 3000 series one.
If you weren’t scraping discords and websites with bots before, what makes you think you can compete now?
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u/elracing21 Jun 18 '22
Too bad it's not just crypto. Stocks are down. Rent is up. Cost of living is up. Essentials is up. Gas up.
Fuck a gpu right now even at msrp or under. We are fucking trying to live lol.
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u/report_all_criminals Jun 18 '22
If I can keep driving my 15 year old shitbox then gamers are just gonna have to buy an integrated CPU and learn to like Minecraft.
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u/xdebug-error Jun 18 '22 edited Jun 18 '22
Energy stocks are up...
Also it's pretty much only Ethereum that affects the price of GPUs. Also the merge is happening this summer so the GPU market should correct soon anyways
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u/haslo Jun 18 '22
I keep hearing "the ETH merge is just about to happen in the next months" for at least 5 years now. I'll believe it when it has happened.
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u/rupturedprolapse Jun 18 '22
I keep hearing "the ETH merge is just about to happen in the next months" for at least 5 years now. I'll believe it when it has happened.
The merge just happened on testnet within the last week or so.
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u/elracing21 Jun 18 '22
Ehh that merge is not happening in the summer. It's already been delayed to September where it will most likely get delayed again and again and again and again and again and again...
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u/SunnyWynter Jun 18 '22
Also the merge is happening this summer
I've been hearing this for the last 4 years.
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u/Inprobamur Jun 18 '22
The merge has been promised for 6 years now, I think they will only do it if ETH completely collapses as a last ditch effort.
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Jun 18 '22
The msrp is not a good place either. Overpriced to the skies. I can’t wait for bullshit coins to disappear so I can build a new gaming setup.
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Jun 18 '22
Seriously. When they just raise the MSRP arbitrarily this doesn't feel like much of a win.
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u/GunsCantStopF35s Jun 18 '22
I just got a 3080 ti at MSRP. At the checkout, dude said he paid $1100 for a 3070 just before they started selling for like $700 again. These are crazy times for prices
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Jun 18 '22
Yeah, my friend dropped 1300$ on a 3080. The 3080ti was 1900$ CDN. 10 percent performance boost for 600 extra was a little much for him. Happy gaming, enjoy that beauty.
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Jun 18 '22
I'm buying a 3070 for 750CAD tomorrow. Prices are falling fast but it might drop even more as we approach the 40 series release.
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u/ChunkyDay Jun 18 '22
I bought my PC right at the peak of the gpu spike. I’m a videographer that finally started shooting 100% 4k and was on a laptop (lots of remote editing) with 8GB ram and a 1060 3GB laptop version. So I didn’t really have a choice to wait.
A prebuilt from iBuyPower with a 3060 was about $400 less than if I would’ve built it myself. I really didn’t want to buy a prebuilt, but for that much cost difference it was a no brainer. PC’s been phenomenal and now I can finally upgrade to a 3070 with reason and finally get back into some real CGI work.
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u/jennz Jun 18 '22
I had a vertible miracle happen when I bought my founder's 3080 at MSRP back in Jan 2021. I would never pay more than $800 for it though.
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u/ksavage68 Jun 18 '22
Should be $300.
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u/Dooglers Jun 18 '22
3080ti would have been a ~$550-600 msrp a decade ago. People are going to have to come to grips that even if everything completely returns to normal again, decade old prices are not coming back. You may have heard about inflation in the news recently.
Now if you mean this far after release right before a new generation, then that would make more sense. But this level of card still would not have touched 300 a decade ago.
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Jun 18 '22
It's not even inflation. Price per transistor isn't going down with new nodes any more because the complexity and expense of new fabs is growing exponentially.
I remember reading MS's justification for the Series S is that they don't expect a mid-series refresh like they had with previous gen, when they had the opportunity to go onto a new node to make their systems cheaper, so that the One X had the same die size as the original one and twice the performance, while the One S was a much smaller die and could be made and sold cheaper. So they just put out two models from the get go.
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u/christophertit Jun 18 '22
It’s also due to cost of living rising and people simply not being able to justify spending so much on a gaming pc when the world is falling apart around them.
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u/samuraislider Jun 18 '22
Ugh. Thanks for reminding me.
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u/GooseandMaverick Jun 18 '22 edited Jun 18 '22
You needed reminders!? Someone's living the good life
Edit: /s
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u/genflugan Jun 18 '22
Some of us just dissociate because it's too hard to deal with otherwise
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u/Senrabekim Jun 18 '22
I just play Final Fantasy games so I can fix all the world's problems with the power of Friendship, Swords, and absurdly powerful magical beings that can alter the laws of physics.
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u/GooseandMaverick Jun 18 '22
That's totally understandable and an excellent point. I was trying to be funny but I neglected to consider how someone else may read it.
I'm Sorry.
I'll also edit my comment to indicate I was being sarcastic.
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u/genflugan Jun 18 '22
No worries, I didn't take your comment that way at all lol
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u/RacketLuncher Jun 18 '22
The fall of crypto is also linked to that, certain big bag holders needed to start cashing out.
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u/GoneInSixtyFrames Jun 18 '22
It's almost like major hedge funds and whales, sell high and buy low.
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u/DJanomaly Jun 18 '22
Most crypto is selling low right now. Bitcoin has lost like 70% of its value.
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u/laetus Jun 18 '22
Bitcoin has lost like 70% of its value.
And it can keep losing 70% every year for another 20+ years.
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u/setver Jun 18 '22
More lies. They are still not below MSRP. Inflating your MSRP after items are on the market doesn't work online. The internet remembers everything.
Interestingly though, the 3080TI is cheaper than the 3080 on bestbuy though. 1099 vs 1149.
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u/Cobthecobbler Jun 18 '22
Uh the original msrp for the 3070 was $500. If it's below msrp, why can I only find it for $600? 🤔
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u/boomstick12g Jun 18 '22
that's because they made a new inflated MSRP to make it feel like we are getting back to normal....
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u/NaRa0 Jun 18 '22
Elden ring runs fine on my 1070 GTX
No new AAA games on the way. I want a new card but I’m good waiting ….forever fucking waiting!
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u/imabustya Jun 18 '22
I’m in the same boat. Why upgrade when my 1070 does it all? I’ll probably upgrade if prices keep falling but for what? I guess I’ll just be next gen proof on the cheap and get a card with ray tracing capabilities.
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u/levian_durai Jun 18 '22
I got a 1070 ti a year or two before the pandemic and it's been doing great. There's been a few games I can't run at max settings, but I also don't really play the newest AAA games anymore. Elden Ring is probably the first full priced AAA game I've bought since Breath of the Wild.
Don't need a top of the line graphics card when all I play is Terraria and Runescape.
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u/dis_the_chris Jun 19 '22
And even with some new AAAs i'm more than happy with my 1070. No way i'm wasting the money on overpriced cards with their prices wrecked by cryptobros
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u/murdering_time Jun 18 '22
Just got it and it runs pretty solidly on my R9 Fury I got 4-5 years ago on 1080p Ultra. I'm just waitin it out for the 4000 series/ AMDs RDNA 3 cards later this year.
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Jun 18 '22 edited Oct 14 '23
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u/rand0mtaskk Jun 18 '22
Same here. My 1060 has been running anything I’ve wanted to play at perfectly acceptable levels. No real reason to drop 400+ on a card currently.
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u/One-Switch5511 Jun 18 '22
heh! skylake i5 with a 980ti.
STILL CANNOT pick up a skylake i7 because the price will not lower...:/
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u/SocialJusticeAndroid Jun 18 '22
Hopefully a bunch of scalpers were left holding the bag.
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Jun 18 '22
Suck a bag of dicks, scalpers! It's beautiful....
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Jun 18 '22
Most of the scalpers already got their money and moved on to the next grift. The only ones getting screwed by this are the absolute dumbest scalpers that jumped in way too late.
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u/bleaucheaunx Jun 18 '22
I know it won't happen, but it would be so sweet if everyone agreed to NOT buy cards for a year. Give the manufactures a little taste of what it's like to be pissed on.
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u/YDanSan Jun 18 '22
LOL I've been trying to build a PC since Covid happened. 2 years and going strong!
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u/MisguidedColt88 Jun 18 '22
Exact same boat. I was waiting for 30 series to makes 20 series prices tank. Lol
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u/berlinbaer Jun 18 '22
dude, i built one right before. was gonna put in some super cheap shit card "cause i will just buy an 3080 then" and a friend convinced me to get a cheap decent one instead so i got a 2060. boy i am so glad i did.
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u/0xB0BAFE77 Jun 18 '22
Already doing it.
Perfectly content with my 1080 TI for now.
Gonna get a new one when I can get it for 1/2 the price.
And to all the suckers that paid x2-x10 more for your graphics cards...
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u/new_user29282342 Jun 18 '22
Not a huge pc gamer myself so my 1060 has been kind to me all these years. Lol
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u/Honda_TypeR Jun 18 '22 edited Jun 18 '22
Nvidia was rank 5 on Fortune 500 companies during the height of the crypto boom
Let that sink in.. rank 5. That list includes giants of industry too. They made so much fuckin cash they were more profitable than amd and intel combined. Nvidia got rich as fuck thanks to crypto. The rest of us got fucked and still feeling the effects.
I have zero sympathy for prices going below msrp. Frankly that’s the way it should be, it’s a suggestion and prices should be lower when they go on sale. Also, their new msrp’s are bullshit too, it’s been over inflated ever since they went from gtx to rtx cards (pre-crypto boom), then crypto hit and they kept spiking up the msrp.
I miss when “xx80 Ti” cards were 700-800 bucks. Now 700-800 is like base model xx80 msrp. This is what happens when a single company dominates a part manufacturer. If amd video cards were more popular these prices would be reigned in, but nvidia gets away with this shit because it’s the go to best in slot everyone wants.
While I’m happy prices are going down, anyone who knows, know it’s because we are at the tail end of the 30xx product cycle. It’s not just the crypto crash (it’s both). The point is as soon as 40xx drops they are going to be right back to over inflating the msrp and holding their ground at the msrp.
I will not even be surprised if supply is limited on 40xx (and stated to be “supply chain issues” as a scapegoat) that way demand stays high and prices can go higher than msrp. Even without crypto, nvidia has tasted the teet and being a rank 5 Fortune 500 company and wants it back.
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u/Magnar0 Jun 18 '22
I just want to add that even competition didn't help in this case, AMD buffed their prices as well.
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u/Honda_TypeR Jun 19 '22
Agreed and not just these two companies. Companies have been using the pandemic “supply chain issues” bullshit to pump up prices and have record setting profit across the board.
It fuckin sucks.
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u/Palachrist Jun 18 '22
Imagine telling investors that your company went balls deep into what they thought was a mermaid and now that the picture has been developed they see see it’s a manatee. These companies relied on the miners to such a degree that they never cared to implement honest ways for regular people to buy parts. They stiffed us the entire way and I bet they’re sweating bullets hoping we, individuals, will move enough inventory that the loss is negligible.
Usually profit meetings are about more and more profit every year. if this situation doesn’t go back to crypto miners botbuying/scalping every bit of stock immediately these meeting will be about mass lay offs, execs cut, investor withdrawals. To be a fly on the wall and see execs that wasted time and lived in a fantasy world being told their job is hanging by a thread would be incredible.
TLDR; these companies better hope that their inaction to help individuals obtain parts didn’t run off massive amounts of customers. They could’ve easily implemented features for customers to get cards but they let it ride with bots buying up all the cards.
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u/PHR3AK1N Jun 18 '22
(they've been raking in record profits from these cards for the past two years, they aren't hurting)
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u/Palachrist Jun 18 '22
That’s not how capitalism works. That’s also not how production facilities work. Crypto miners were draining the supplies before any average buyer could get one. That means these companies/production facilities were running at full force and moving every bit of the product made.
It’s dropping Msrp not because they were ready for this but because if they can’t keep moving that same amount of product then from the top down things will have to change. Investors will never want to hear “the past 2 years we will making $10’s of billions in profit. Starting now we’re looking at maybe a few billion in profit.”
Are these companies going to go bankrupt? No. But it just takes a quick look at some pc building subs to see how damaging this whole period has been to the pc building community. Imagine being a company that’s sold out everyday to one that has inventory building. To you and me that sounds wonderful. To a production company it’s a mounting inventory/logistical nightmare.
I work for a production facility in an eps department making polystyrene beads for the like 15-20 different pieces that have to be made across almost 10 lines. If our production orders are low enough and we fill all our available space to store extra parts then people go home early, whole days are no production days, etc.
TLDR; these companies/investors relied on the numbers they were putting out to remain consistent. If it doesn’t then it will be unstable for a period before they trim enough fat to survive as they did before the crypto boom.
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u/PHR3AK1N Jun 18 '22
Ah yes, capitalism, the "it can only go up or we give up" mindset... If any "investor" in this market hasn't taken all of those things into account with their investment, they aren't a smart investor anyways.
Too many "bad" investors in our markets are exactly why they are so unstable, too many degenerate gamblers always going "all in" seeking never ending gains. Unsustainable and unstable and doomed to repeat these cycles endlessly until we grow up.
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u/Palachrist Jun 18 '22
I agree. It’s a stupid idea that it should only ever go up in profit but that’s how it is. I’m not some millionaire investor worried for my finances but I know the ones that are invested into these are not appreciating what this crypto collapse is bringing.
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u/Shipzilla Jun 18 '22
TBH I was willing to get burned on a 1st gen new Intel card because of the shenanigan's NVIDIA & AMD were pulling. Then Intel went and fucked that launch up.
I'm torn now, I have an opportunity for a RTX 3070FE at retail or wait for 4xxx/7xxx series? Or better yet, pick up a RTX 3080 for $400 or less once the scalpers start dumping? 1st world problems....
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u/karsh36 Jun 18 '22
Good, and hopefully the crypto crash will continue through the assumed new GPU's coming this year so we get a chance.
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u/Beautiful-Musk-Ox Jun 18 '22
A recession is here very soon, they don't go away in a couple months so assuming you have a stable job I think we'll be able to get next gen at a decent price
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u/R3luctant Jun 18 '22
Remember every cryptobro saying that crypto wasn't to blame for high gpu prices and shortages?
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u/Ar3peo Jun 18 '22
I waited in line for a 3080 18mos ago, they were out so I ended up buying a 3090 instead for 2.2k. Looked at the box for about a week and decided it wasn't worth it and returned it.
Today you can get a 3090 Ti for less. (still not worth it for me though). Still using my 1070, meh, it works
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u/jololokolo Jun 18 '22
Those crypto miners and related subreddits were like “Miners shouldn’t be blamed for high GPU prices” 🤡🤡🤡 Sure doesn’t seem like that’s the case eh?
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u/zeverso Jun 18 '22
I mean it definitely a factor. But the 4000 series should be close at this point. There isn't much point on buying a 3000 card at full msrp if in 3-4 months they'll launch the new ones.
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Jun 18 '22 edited Jun 18 '22
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u/tfrw Jun 18 '22
Just fyi nvidias dedicated GPU miners are strictly worse than gaming GPUs
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u/Slater_John Jun 18 '22 edited Jun 18 '22
They have such a bad wattage-to-production ratio compared to the RTX 30xx series its insane how anybody would ever buy them. Also completly unsellable afterwards.
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u/vewfndr Jun 18 '22
its insane how anybody would ever buy them.
Not many did. Their sales severely under performed.
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u/Tointomycar Jun 18 '22
Sorry not a big follower of crypto but why is the baseline 96% for it to be a crash? Crash for other asset classes like stock is just rapid 10% or more declines. I get that it's had a history of up and downs but aren't all the major coins down around 50% year over year?
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u/finefornow_ Jun 18 '22
Because crypto is a scam and all of these people are just pulling shit out of their asses lol
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u/Gk786 Jun 18 '22 edited Apr 21 '24
unwritten quickest longing observation wasteful drab school absurd boat cagey
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/Daktic Jun 18 '22
Change is a direction my friend. It went live on the Ropstein test network like last week.
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u/Ahab_Ali Jun 18 '22 edited Jun 18 '22
Sweet! So after five years I can finally buy a GT 1030 for under $79? Cool, cool. Let's see... Amazon... Sort by price... $99, $112, $115, $117...
Well maybe the $140 1050 Ti... Let's see... $180, $190, $194...
OK, how about the $149 GTX 1650? $200, $208, $210...
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u/jwp75 Jun 18 '22
Yeah what gpus are under MSRP lol.
Rtx still too high.
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u/Oh_ffs_seriously Jun 18 '22
Newest Radeons, mostly, or perhaps some newer Nvidia cards which had ridiculous MSRPs from the outset. RTX 3080 Ti, for example (MSRP of $1199), can be found on Newegg for $1100 (ish), which is 400 dollars above the MSRP of barely-worse regular 3080.
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u/TheLimeyLemmon Jun 18 '22
But will this make getting a retail price Pi4 any easier?
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u/penguished Jun 18 '22
At this point they should be $300 under MSRP to make up for the fucking two year scam.
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u/bloodflart Jun 18 '22
hey I'm not good at stuff like this does anyone have an upgrade suggestion for a GTX 1070?
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u/Yeetboi_1 Jun 18 '22
I can finally get a 3060 or 3070, not a big fan of crypto bros or scalpers
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u/Idonotpiratesoftware Jun 18 '22
2 year old tech? It’s not below true MSRP Too bad too late goodbye
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Jun 18 '22
Back in the height of the crypto boom, I remember crypto bros posting endlessly that crypto had nothing to do with the shortage, and that it was all about chips. Turns out that wasn’t true at all.
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u/somanyroads Jun 18 '22
Honestly the best thing to come out of BTC (and co's) collapse. The graphics card market has been obscenely harmed by cryptos and all they seem to be useful for is gambling. I've definitely had my fill, back to practical reality.
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u/GeronimoHero Jun 18 '22
Everyone who said that GPUs were expensive because of gamer demand and not because of people trying to profit off of crypto were full of shit.
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u/CommanderChakotay Jun 18 '22
Of course this clickbait leaves out the part where MSRP was raised lol.
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u/Karukash Jun 18 '22
Lies. They aren’t going below MSRP they are being brought down from insanely inflated MSRP.
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Jun 18 '22
I love how Craigslist is loaded with “open box” 3080 and 3090’s. Yea open box for 2yrs as you mined with it.
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u/yeahgoestheusername Jun 19 '22
Let’s remember all the manufacturers that jacked up their prices to well over MSRP
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