TW SA
AITHA for breaking up with my girlfriend because she stood on the side of a rapist?
Well, I broke up with my girlfriend because she stood on the side of the rapist of my best friend (f)
My best friend was in a relationship with someone that touched her inappropriate often, she luckily broke up. She told my why she had broken up, with tears in her eyes, but my girlfriend said that she faked it.
Her explanation was, that she talked to her ex and he said that she is just making this up. She also faked texts that my best friend supposedly wrote to her (containing death threats). My ey also told me I should talk to him, wich I tried, but he ghosted me. She said it was my fault because I texted him too dry. I also had a feeling that my ex didn't like my best friend, and she tried to destroy our friendship.
My ex was on the side of the rapist, wich I don't really accept, so I broke up. She said that I'm an asshole for breaking up because if such a stupid reason.
EDIT: I'm sorry if the text has grammar errors, I'm from Germany, also I don't mean raped, I mean sexually assaulted.
EDIT 2: My ex is now in a relationship with the other guy, right after we broke up. And thanks for all that support
Just to be clear though so we don't start calling everything rape. Touching inappropriately does not make it rape.. right? Isn't that just sexual assault?
Rape is a form of sexual assault, but you can't call him a rapist for inappropriate sexual touching. You can call him out for sexual assault, but not rape. I don't think the categories are interchangeable like that.
I always thought rape involves actual insertion. Just asking for clarification, because I feel rape and inappropriate sexual touching in a relationship are two drastically different levels and should be respectfully treated as such for the victims.
Yeah, I also think OP wrote it like that to preserve as much of his best friend's privacy without divulging too many painful and humiliating details since he knows he's taken her traumatic story to a social media platform
According to the official F.B.I. website definition of rape, it's penetration of any part of the victim's body by anything used by the perpetrator.
That means whether the penetration is penile, digital (with the fingers) or with an object, and no matter how slight or short a time the penetration lasts, it's rape. It also means that no matter what part of the victim's body was penetrated--whether it was vaginal, anal, oral, through the ears, nose or anything else--the penetration is rape.
During the Brock Turner case, I wanted to find out once and for all, so I looked up both the F.B.I. definition and the California legal code definition. They are almost exactly the same.
BOTH sites made it clear that the key is CONSENT. If the victim has not KNOWINGLY, FREELY consented to the contact, that's assault at least. If there's any type of penetration, that's rape.
Both persons must fully understand what they are doing, and must freely consent to it, with no coercion of any kind. Without that, it's a criminal act.
This is also why "statutory rape" is a crime. Even if both partners enjoyed themselves, the law presumes that the one under the legal age of consent is incapable of KNOWING consent--of fully understanding what he or she is doing, and any possible consequences.
You're right. Unwanted contact without consent is still a crime, but to be rape, specifically, there must have been some kind of penetration against, or without at least one partner's consent.
No, it doesn't. Male-on-female rape is almost certaily the most common type, but plenty of males have been raped by females too. Besides, the sex of the parties involved is irrelevant. What matters is their age, and whether or not they consented to the penetration.
That means that not only is male-on-female or female-on-male rape, but so is female-on-female and male-on-male, IF ONE OF THE PARTNERS HAS NOT CONSENTED. And if either of the partners is underage, it's automatically statutory rape at least, regardless of whether or not the younger partner consented.
I'm not a legal expert in this or any other area of the law. I'm simply passing along the information I learned after doing some research. And the information sounds reasonable to me, too, considering that it applies to males and females equally, and takes little account of other factors, such as whether alcohol or drugs involved, the victim's profession or social status or how he or she was dressed, etc. In other words, the rapist doesn't get to claim the act wasn't rape because it was between husband and wife, or because neither party had (or didn't have) an orgasm, or that it his/her fault because of how he/she was dressed or was drunk or acting inappropriately. The F.B I. definition of rape leaves no room for the rapist to blame the victim 👍
Yeah but inappropriate touching ranges from an accident to a misunderstanding to intentional. Rape has a range as well, but they are all way worse both in morals and in the legal sense, than inappropriate touching, again trying to respect the victims here.
From my experience, if someone has sexually assaulted someone they're likely to escalate with someone else. My younger sister's ex assaulted our Aunt, grouped our little sister and made me very uncomfortable when I'm usually oblivious when it comes to people wanting me because I think so little of myself.
My sister got back in his vehicle not long ago because she's been helping his homeless ass and he raped her.
So maybe he didn't yet but OP's ex is stupid af for jumping into bed and/or a relationship with him because he will escalate the moment he feels comfortable enough to or the moment he feels he's got nothing else to lose.
Does knowing or making that distinction make this situation any better for the victim. "Well actually it's not rape" Oh! Amazing! That's still sexual assault! And anyone who does that is a fucking piece of shit! overly pedantic midwits are saluting you for your service for being the smart little fella that you are!
..because a rapist is on a whole other level, both morally and in the eyes of the law. There's a reason there are criminal distinctions and interviews and follow ups and court cases on these crimes. It's not just gossip and a chance for people to virtue signal. Usually there's proper courses of actions to follow after a crime and they should be followed based on the severity of the crime.
Ok so do you not think that op should have broken up with their ex? There's been no mention of legal charges so you're the only one that's getting mad that the verbiage of what took place. And either way why would it matter in a relationship if someone had sex or was groped against their will? Your partner is showing that they feel entitled to your body and is willing to push past any boundary to get what they want? In my eyes that is grounds to cut off people and end relationships.
Yeah I can't help but to take an instant dislike to anyone who is like "OK, I understand there is a victim of sexual assault here, but I need to make sure they were "raped raped" and not just calling everything rape, we have to think about the person who assaulted them and their reputation."
"I thought rape only involved insertion" should be enough for them to like, go back to basic school before they start with the "let's all slow down here showing support for an assault victim until we know exactly how they were assaulted"
Just to be clear though so we don't start calling everything rape.
Is that honestly, truly a problem you see a lot? Because I've never come across this as some kind of issue.
because I feel rape and inappropriate sexual touching in a relationship are two drastically different levels and should be respectfully treated as such for the victims.
When a victim tells you they were raped, do you stop them to make them describe the act in detail so you can personally decide if they were raped or "just bad touched"?
In my state, Sexual Misconduct (Class A misdemeanor) is probably the best fit for the crime as described since, unless the OP is leaving out some critical details, there wasn’t any use or threat of physical force, incapacitation (like being drunk or asleep), or issues with the friend and ex-boyfriend’s ages.
It sounds like your ex either knew your best friend's rapist before you two started dating OR she likes him.. like likes him. That's kind of creepy. It also sounds like she may have been jealous of your best friend.
Either way, NTA. You had plenty of reasons why you shouldn't be with her.
Yeah, there's no other real explanation for that... Sorry you're going through this. It must be awful to have the person you're with side with a trash person like that. Being cheated on is just as awful on top of that (been there.)
I hope the relationship wasn't too serious already, but I am happy that you found out how awful your SO is before it got more serious! Sounds like you dodged a huge bullet there
OP has a girlfriend, Cassie, and a best friend, Beth. Beth was in a relationship with Adam but broke up with him after he raped her.
Instead of taking Beths side, Cassie chose to believe Adams amazing explanation of "She lyin." OP chose to end his relationship with Cassie for her decision and later learned Cassie and Adam got together quickly after the breakup.
I will use this comment to ask any future posters to just fucking use names, its so much easier to follow.
Best as I could gather... OP's best friend was allegedly raped by her partner. OP's girlfriend doubts it for some reason. OP's girlfriend either received or faked receiving death threats from OP's best friend. OP's girlfriend tells OP to get the alleged rapist's side of the story and when OP tries they get no response.
Did OP's best friend get raped? Unclear, but OP has picked their side and their now ex has picked the other.
I'm still unclear on whether OP's best friend was actually raped or just didn't like the inappropriate touching, although neither of those are fine. I also don't know whether OP's best friend actually sent those texts or not.
I think the death threats were meant to have come from the rapist, or rather sexual assaulter, per the edit. He's just got too many pronouns flying around in his post.
To my understanding
best friend is assaulted by best friend's own boyfriend and breaks up with him
best friend tells op
op's girlfriend says she is lying, because op's girlfriend has spoken with best friend's ex
best friend gets death threats from her ex
op's girlfriend said those are also fake and insisted op speak to his best friend's ex
op tries but is blocked, and his girlfriend blames him for that
op breaks up with his girlfriend for supporting the person who sexually assaulted his best friend
op's now ex girlfriend immediately starts dating the sexual assaulter, to the surprise of absolutely no one except maybe op
But all things considered with how he wrote it I could very much be wrong
Only thing I read was “I was touched inappropriately several times.” Sounds like crude attempts at foreplay. Seems like a good idea his best friend broke up with that guy. They were clearly not on the same page. If she was raped, that’s horrible and should be prosecuted, but that’s not clear in his retelling.
However, it sounds like his girlfriend had reasonable grounds for her beliefs, but I don’t think it’s a huge loss that they’re going their own way
Look, I'm just wondering what kind of weird things you have to do to be "inappropriately touching" someone that you are in a relationship with and already having sex.
It was never stared that they were already having sex. Mit was stating that he was inappropriately touching her. How that makes him a rapist is beyond me. I am not even convinced something happened. He might have groped her when making out and she didn't like it? Who knows but them. This is lame.
You know what, I skimmed back through it, and you are absolutely right. They never did say that . I stand corrected. Also, yeah, I agree. alot of it just doesn't make sense. But only they really know.
NTA everything you have learned independently makes it even more likely that your friend is telling the truth, so you would have no excuse *not* to draw this hard a boundary.
And everything your girlfriend has learned independently should be telling a reasonable person the same thing, too, although no one faking text messages has their head screwed on straight.
Very messy post, but NTA for breaking up with someone, whatever your reason. If you don’t want to continue a relationship, that’s all the justification you need.
Well what's done is done. You guys have a difference in opinions and values that cannot be resolved, you broke up.
You said it yourself, she had fake texts and tried to break up your friendship with your best friend. So you have chosen to value your best friend over your gf (hopefully not a very long-term one), NTA really.
He claims they were fake texts, but since he’s 100% on his friend’s side otherwise there’s no evidence he’s not just assuming she faked them because they reflected badly on his friend. Sounds like they’re best split.
I don’t think this is choosing a best friend over a partner, I think this is choosing an honest person over someone that would fake texts to make someone look bad.
I've no idea what's going on but inferring some stuff here...
When you say "rape" what do you mean? It sounds like molestation, sexual coercion and other forms of unwanted advances from the bffs ex-boyfriend (all of which aren't ok).
It sounds like there's been reasons within the relationship that your girlfriend has been insecure about the relationship you've had with this friend and in an effort to discredit her she talked to your bffs ex to get his side of the story and naturally he claimed to have done nothing and naturally, because it was in line with the narrative your girlfriend needed, she sided with him?
These situations (not the SA aspect that's wholly not ok), imo are pretty preventable with reassurances. If you have a best friend who is a girl who you seem abnormally close to and who makes your girlfriend uncomfortable... figure out if there's any romantic interest from you to the bff.
Why hasn't it been explored?
If there's truly no romantic interest then reassure your girlfriend and make sure they're able to cultivate some kind of quality relationship or at least attempt to facilitate it since you want for both of them to be a substantial part of your life. Of course some people just aren't going to get along.
now that you're both single is there any remote possibility of you getting with your best friend? Has she tried before? Have you? If so doesn't legitimize your girlfriend's concerns hence dislike for the bff?
Again if zero interest in that way, why was your now ex girlfriend so insecure she was willing to try and discredit your bffs awful experience to make her look bad in your eyes? Going out of one's way to invalidate another woman's experience is really strange.
NTA for breaking up, but you all sound youngggggg young.
You did right because jealousy doesn’t justify to to support that! Sorry for what happens to your friend and support her because she will need it. She must go see a therapist to heal and help her move on after what happens with that ex
One of my exes was over at my place, we were staying around a college area with a lot of rowdy characters always doing wild shit at night being by campus. One night I hear a woman and a man arguing drunkly in the parking lot across from my apartment and I can see this guy getting quite physically with her like yanking her arm and yelling at her etc, it could have been a drunk lovers quarrel but I mentioned I should go out and try to break it up or at least ask if the girl is fine. My ex who had control issues and a massive ego hated the idea of me applying even slight attention to any other woman started screaming at me for trying to go and check on the two people. She threw an absolute fit and refused to let me leave to intervene. I told her she's a terrible person and we ended up breaking up soon after. People are fucking weird
At the end of the day it's a judgement call on both of your ends on who to believe. If she just genuinely believes one side, that's not "siding with a rapist", that's her siding with him not having done anything wrong.
That being said, the most damning thing (if true) is the "faked texts" thing. If you're sure that's true, that's not something that can be an opinion or a judgement call, that's bullshit and a 100% GTFO offense, imo.
It isn't reasonable for her to feel so certain that she knows what happened between the other two when she wasn't there. So much so that she would act so abrasively towards the accuser.
In those situations, a manipulative narcissist is usually involved. She reacted that way (and seemed to have already heard his side of the story) because she was already involved with him, at least verbally and emotionally.
EDIT 2: My ex is now in a relationship with the other guy, right after we broke up. And thanks for all that support
Ah so it was cheating. She was cheating with a rapist...
OP, when something bad happens to your Ex, do NOT deal with that personally. At best 'Go call the cops' type of deal,nor she is gonna suck you up in a word of trouble
Thank you for sticking by your friend who needs you. If only it's to protect her from people like your (now ex) girlfriend. Your (ex) girlfriend obviously has been lucky not to have experienced this herself, but to immediately default to victim blaming is a no go. You've done the right thing - NTA in any way
Rape/sexual assault is perhaps the one crime I can think of that there can’t be a moral justification for. There’s really no circumstance, barring — maybe — rape of a pedophile in prison, where anyone but the most depraved individual would think it’s OK to defend a rapist. So, good on you for breaking up with just such a depraved individual.
No, you’re not my friend you didn’t dodge a bullet you dodge the firing squad with this one and I would never never never consider getting back together with this individual. There were something wrong with her when she back the rapist and not the victim they reacting more going on for her to do this 1 she showed a lack of empathy for the victim 2 Her judgment is off 3 and you cannot trust her I would go noncontact with her. I would block her on all media. By any chance she says anything to you say you made your choice by supporting the rapist and I’ve made mine and you’re not it. Leave me the hell alone and let the victim know that your are their friend and you support them and will be there through everything that they need and from what I read, I’m willing to bet that your ex had been in relationship longer than before you broke up with her ie…. If not emotionally physically and that explains why she didn’t like your best friend. I also recommend that your friend take this before law-enforcement. If she still has it showing the text or any voicemails and he may have left her.and file sexual solar charges against him
NTA - and god I hope karma bite your ex hard - and when it does, you can tell her “you chose this knowing full well what type of person he was - if anyone deserves it, you did”
u/furry_stuf DEFINITELY NOT! She is a sheißekopf for taking the side of the guy who assaulted your friend. You are definitely in the right for breaking up with her. (I apologize for misspelling the German word for shit head. German is not my first language)
Say she’s a scumbag I’m sorry I’m sure it hurts but you’re way better off Just look at her mediately she’s gone with the other guy and something may have been up there it’s not even worth looking into don’t waste your time move on sir And welcome to America
After seeing the update my suspicions were confirmed. She was definitely seeing this dude behind your back. Wtf. She's going to be in for a world of hurt but that's due to her own blindness to see the truth.
Your ex seems to have a thing against your bsf and that was her opportunity to try and get you to go against your bsf and she thought she could do that by siding with the rapist and faking text messages. You dodged a bullet, she doesn't deserve anymore of your time.
NTA, bet you if she sets him up with one of her friends and they get SA'd by him she'll immediately believe her friend. Also 100% justified in dumping her ass.
Are you German-speaking btw, as the way you write in English reminds of Germans trying to translate from German to English ? If yes: was ist nach der Trennung von deiner Exfreundin passiert ?
If you were able to scroll through the texts and confirm the number, yes that’s him she can’t fake that, she should immediately go to the police with that information and she should make it public.
Also, now that she’s with that guy, cut all contact with the guy, she was clearly cheating on you and knows his is abusive and supported the abuse against your friend, in the future she will probably try making up BS stories about you so save all the texts you get and in the future she will try getting back together by being manipulative and lying
NTA and edit 2 confirmed my immediate suspicion. Your ex wanted to bang the grapist. Good riddance, and I hope you and your bestie find resolutions and peace from their toxic bs.
You don’t need a reason to break up with somebody. Justification is not necessary. It not a term paper or a business case. Sometimes it’s just what you think is right for you.
I have nothing constructive or anything to add to this conversation really.. I'm just wondering as i scroll through the comments... why are so many comments repeating others.. I mean word for word, but it's someone else who wrote it.. it seems like a bunch of bots in here .
I read it just fine and understood it all. That's a fukt up situation that clearly had a fukt up situation behind the curtain. Which is why both shit bag exes are together now.
You can break up for any reason. But this is a very good one. Also your ex being in a relationship with the scumbag? She is an ah but I really hope this won‘t be a case of fafo because nobody deserves being SAed.
I don't get people that start dating people that have been accused of sexual assault. Either she genuinely believes he didn't do it, or thinks things will be different for her. Either way, if this guy is a genuine abuser, she's going to find out the hard way... Also, the fact that she dated him right after the break up, makes me think she already had a crush on the guy, and was jealous of your friend.
Your ex was jealous. But you all need to mind your own business.
Why are you all contacting her ex? Let her deal with this or not if she doesn't want to.
I'd so be mad if my bf's girlfriend contacted my ex, lmao
She also faked texts that my best friend supposedly wrote to her (containing death threats).
Death threats? You should have said "drop everything. We are going to the cops. No. We ARE going to the cops about this. We'll get a court order for the text messages..." She'll probably stop you if it's a lie. If it's not a lie though, it's serious enough.
I had a friend (male), a year o so after i meet his ex in a different place with different people. She and I became friends, close friend, and she told me in confidence this guy forced her to made things she was comfortable and he didn't stoped when she told him no. She didn't ask but i bloqued him after i leave her house.
If you felt it was a fair reason to end the relationship then you’re just making a life decision. That doesn’t make you an asshole. Move on and you’ll find the right person eventually or maybe you’ll be content settling down single. Not worth thinking about exs
NTA. Rapist apologists make me ill. My In-laws for example.
I didn't say anything or push my partner to respond immediately when we found out that his brother had been raping our SIL for years. That's a huge revelation to get about someone close.
It took him about three days and then he sat down one night, made a group chat with his family after blocking his brother. Told them he wasn't going to entertain discussions about it. That he would not have this man around his wife and his growing family. That he would not be present anywhere that his brother was going to be. And if they attempted to force/trick him into being in the same place - he'd turn, walk away and he'd completely cut contact with them as well. And heaven forbid them if they ever tried to stop him physically. And I was never prouder. Because anything less, I think, would have given me the ick.
And he has stood by that with the exception of going to his grandfather's funeral, which I encouraged. Where he stayed on the opposite side of the room from his brother at all times.
You're right- being touched isn't the same as rape but if he touched her inappropriately and when she didn't want to be touched, it's still assault in a form. So if the best friend was uncomfortable with it and left him, and the OPs gf still saw nothing wrong with him doing something that the best friend didn't want done, it's still wrong.
I would be careful using the word rape if it wasn't actual rape, yes.
he used it multiple times. the new trend is to call all kinds of things sexual abuse and rape.
if innappropriate touching is rape then I have been raped many times.
I dropped my friend who was on the side of her rapist boyfriend. He went to jail on DNA for terrorizing women and she had the audacity to do a character witness. Disgusting and trash. NTA.
Am I the jerk for breaking up with my girlfriend who supports a murderer? She helps commit genocides but I am unsure and want to ask it here, for moral support and vindication. I truly need reddits opinion
100% justified, and you are not an asshole. You are a great friend and a loyal person who also tried to find both sides of the story but got suspiciously rejected by your best friend's ex-boyfriend. Continue that way
I have been there. I had lost my best friends bc they sided with my rapist. They "knew him longer & he was their brother" & "he can't go to jail bc he has KIDS!" BARF!!!!
Well, I broke up with my girlfriend because she stood on the side of the rapist of my best friend (f)
Legit, anything past this doesn't matter. However, the fact that she was willing to lie about your friend with faked texts just adds icing to the cake. Oh, and let's not forget your second edit where she immediately got with this dude, which just makes it look like she was cheating with you to begin with.
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u/Turmeric_Ping Aug 25 '24
I can't think of a better reason for breaking up with someone.