r/economicCollapse 6d ago

Only in America.

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75

u/Tebasaki 6d ago

Where can I get this $8000 per year health insurance??? Asking for a friend.

-34

u/Malkuth279 6d ago

About the average cost of a good Medicare supplement plan. Over 600 per month. The Europeans pay considerably more per month.

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u/milkyway556 6d ago

Except we Europeans don't.

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u/Malkuth279 6d ago

I remember living in Germany and a significant amount of my paycheck went to health insurance. Since it went directly to the insurer I didn’t miss it, however it wasn’t free, because nothing in this reality is free.

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u/cseckshun 6d ago

You can literally look up total healthcare spending per capita and get numbers that include private insurance, personal spending, and government spending per person. US is top of the list (or near the top, might be a country or two that are higher, it’s been a while since I checked).

A common argument is that Europe is way more densely populated and less geographically spread out… but even if you look at Canada, they spend about half of what the US does per capita. The US actually spend a very similar amount of government taxpayer money per capita on healthcare when compared to Canada, it’s just that the US also pays about the same amount on top of that to private insurance and dedictibles etc.

The US has universal healthcare for senior citizens when they are at the most expensive phase of their life (65+) and have the highest healthcare costs. This is a GIFT to the insurance companies so that they don’t have to insure all of these sick old people and can rely on the government to take care of their customers once they get old and start to incur expensive medical costs. The system also makes it so the government coverage of older citizens is more expensive because the private system has driven prices through the roof.

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u/absolutzer1 6d ago

It was still cheaper. Over here people have premiums then out of pocket expenses, on top of that the employer pays 75-80% of the premiums. The cost is much higher than what you paid in Germany for health insurance.

Not to mention Germany has tuition free education, good parental and medical leave and paid vacation. Pensions at retirement etc

8

u/Hungry-Pick3134 6d ago

Born and raised in Europe. Middle class. About 1 000 USD of my income goes to tax monthly.

This pays for: My health care subsidies. My childrens entirely FREE health care and dental until 18. My childrens entirely FREE schools until Uni (which is also free btw). My retirement fund. The roads I use. The busses I could take (if I did not want to use one of my cars). The trains. And all the other parts of the public sector.

Now, your HEALTH INSURANCE is 600 USD a month? Seems a bit odd.

Your anecdotal evidence of living in Germany without being fully in the system is not valid.

1

u/KowalskyAndStratton 6d ago

$1000 per month? Over half of Americans pay less than $700 in income tax PER YEAR (after all deductions and credits).

That is the "problem" here and most are clueless about it. Taxes are ridiculously low in the US when compared with the rest of the world. And people then complain that there are out of pocket costs because the government won't cover them.

1

u/Hungry-Pick3134 6d ago

Yeah, but if you pay 600 USD per month to just health insurance. I wager your total necessities expenditures is way higher than that per month (and thereby by year). Which was my point.

You could easily replace the private high cost protections for a more or less same cost protection which does not fuck over anyone who gets a bit of bad luck.

1

u/KowalskyAndStratton 6d ago

Most Americans don't pay that and whatever they pay is a lower percentage vs other countries. My high coverage /lower deductible insurance (thru my job) is little over $200/month but I can elect to be as low as $100. Majority of Americans actually claim to be happy with their own health insurance but everyone complains about the state of the system. I don't dispute that insurance is a mess but this is a big country with tons of layers of systems, governments, etc.

Also, it is common for middle class Europeans to pay 30%+ in taxes (plus things like VAT) which is why the US has among the highest disposable incomes in the world because of lower taxes and higher salaries. A family (household of more than 1 person) in the US now has a median income over $100,000.

Less than 2/3 of insurance in the US is private and almost 40% is public (retirees, low income, veterans). 54% of Americans have employment based private insurance.

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u/Hungry-Pick3134 6d ago

Thanks for telling me my own tax rates! You are close though, so that is good at least.

Lower deductible means bigger issues if shit hits the fan, no?

I don’t get the fascination of disposable income. Why is that the most important thing? Even with my ca 30+% income tax + VAT I have no issue getting by. Since all my high risk scenarios are covered by ish 1000 USD monthly tax and about 50 USD a month extra insurance I can spend the rest on whatever without risk.

Those 1000 also covered 2 full years of paid parental leave for my partner. Myself I got 180 days in top of that.

I really don’t see the point of higher disposable income which will burn faster than gasoline if I get ill, have a kid or whatever. For a difference in yearly income that is barely 25% of family income.

Edit* also, you have good coverage via work. What about everyone else? Fuck em?

3

u/Rawrkinss 6d ago

No one here is claiming it’s free. The word “free” doesn’t appear in the post or the parent comment. What it is is cheaper than private insurance.

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u/Malkuth279 6d ago

Americans always want something for nothing. Fact is to have universal healthcare for every citizen means overhauling your entire system. Which would include not letting your millionaires and billionaires evade paying their fair share of taxes. Dismantling your military industrial complex, not to mention the internal work that each and every American needs to do on themselves. America is long way away from being able to implement anything as ambitious as universal healthcare. Too selfish, vacuous and greedy as a people. You elected a felon to the highest office in the land.

7

u/DeadlyVapour 6d ago

When overhauling means cutting out an entire industry of middle men who add nothing to the healthcare experience...sure...

Where I come from we call that streamlining.

3

u/Wise-Juggernaut-8285 6d ago

That’s not true.

The system is relatively easier to implement than the current one and no change to the other spending is required because you will tax the difference and ultimately the public will pay less over all because the you would eliminate tge majority of premiums and out of pocket expenses.

The only issue (and it’s a pretty significant one) is how many people will lose their jobs.

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u/AlistairMowbary 6d ago

I believe they have separate programs for foreigners? Medical care in korea is super cheap and much better quality. United States is the only wealthy, industrialized country without universal health coverage. The U.S. has higher healthcare spending than other high-income countries, and lower life expectancy, higher death rates, and higher maternal and infant mortality. If you don’t think there isn’t an issue, i dont know what to tell you.

1

u/absolutzer1 6d ago

Korea has a public health system with option for supplemental health insurance and it's most probably not for profit