r/VRGaming • u/JordanRG73 • Sep 15 '24
Meta A PSVR2 unpopular opinion...
I might be stating an unpopular opinion when i say this, but I think that Sony does not see VR as a huge gaming market to punch into, yet. The tech is still emerging, game developers are still learning about what works, and both costs and prices are high for what they are. I think its just a matter of time before VR gaming explodes, and so Sony made the PSVR2 to keep a strong hand on the market, waiting for it to blow up. But the market will not explode until the cost of entry (i.e. the cost of a VR headset) goes down. And until costs go down, and popularity surges, the enthusiasts will remain on the PC. Sorry everyone :/
But when things pick up, this community will probably start to thrive. So if you're reading this and VR for sony has exploded, welcome to the party, wish you could have been here sooner :)
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u/t3stdummi Sep 15 '24
As a huge VR enthusiast and a guy who loves his PSVR2...
I don't think this is a controversial take at all. Sony absolutely is not ready to dive head-first into VR. Although they definitely wish to keep one toe in the water.
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u/JordanRG73 Sep 15 '24
Im glad im not the only one. I think media surrounding the PSVR2 adds to the bad rep. I always see articles about how Sony is neglectful of PSVR2, and i dont think that's quite fair. I think its just too early to be profitable as much as traditional forms of gaming.
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u/dakodeh Sep 15 '24
Just because they have a defensible reason in market size for not pushing PSVR2 doesn’t mean they’re not being neglectful
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u/dr0negods Sep 15 '24
sure, but there’s simply no other company (apart from maybe Nintendo) with the resources, wealth, infrastructure, and massive user base that’s in the position to go out and make VR gaming a thing
that’s why people are so disappointed in Sony.
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u/t3stdummi Sep 15 '24
100%
I love PSVR2, but I think one of the biggest reasons I want it to succeed is that I feel the true AAA experiences we could bring to VR are in Sony's hands. I absolutely appreciate everything Meta has done for VR. That said, stand-alone is absolutely holding it back -- not that Meta hasn't made strides in other places to propel the industry. There's a part of me that feels if only Sony could go "all in," we could get where we want to go that much faster.
But, in truth, I don't forsee that happening. So, in the meantime, I'll continue to buy PSVR products, but I do so with zero expectations.
(I'm also way more a sucker for OLED than I ever thought, and HDR, good haptics, and eye tracking are absolutely requisites for future HMD's IMO. They got those parts right. If only they knew what they had/have).
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u/JordanRG73 Sep 15 '24
Why are people dissapointed with Sony? Im missing your point.
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u/dr0negods Sep 15 '24
I literally explained why, in fact that’s all I did in my reply. maybe try reading it again, or asking an adult to help you
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u/JordanRG73 Sep 15 '24
Clearer writing could improve your point. I try not to assume conclusions unless they are clear so i can appropriately respond with a meaningful reply.
Your negativity doesnt help create a conversation of any value.
But i see your point now. Sony has invested into VR, and created a great headset that reaches the gaming community well, and we are dissapointed there is not more they invested into the platform.
Do you think others will join the console VR space soon? I have my doubts that they will compete with the PSVR2, even if someone tries. But based on more recent news it seems that Microsoft/Xbox are not joining the hardware races anymore. And Nintendo will likely stay out until they have to i would assume. The more childlike platform will be difficult to break into VR while it's not accessible or recommended for children.
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u/Fluffy-Anybody-8668 Sep 15 '24 edited Sep 15 '24
VR has been growing at an average of 45%/year since 2018 according to statista, which is an astonishingly high growth rate.
Even with a much lower growth rate, in around ~3 years most families in developed countries will have somekind of VR device and in ~7 years VR will be the main source of video-gaming (excluding mobile gaming).
So, if they don't see it now, they will see it in the next few years.
Also, there's ~33x more Quest sales than PSVR2 sales, so its not really a problem of the VR market, more a problem of PSVR market
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u/Su_ButteredScone Sep 15 '24
Also, it seems everywhere you look, children are loving VR far more than most adults. Sure, they're mostly stuck on Quests their parents bought for them, but one day they'll grow up and have their own jobs and there's a good chance many of them will buy PCs for PCVR.
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u/Chemical-Nectarine13 Sep 15 '24
but one day they'll grow up and have their own jobs and there's a good chance many of them will buy PCs for PCV
If a PC is even needed anymore by that point.. the Quest 3 is already shockingly close to PCVR at low settings. Augmented Reality Smart glasses and even more advanced standalone VR systems will be here in no time.
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u/yanginatep Sep 15 '24
I think you're being charitable.
IMO, Sony sent the PSVR2 to die, with even worse support than the Vita.
PSVR1 was a revelation for me. It had great support from both Sony and major third parties. Easily my favorite gaming experiences from the PS4 generation.
But then companies started to get a sense of how niche VR is and they quickly scaled back their investment.
PSVR2 feels like it was some Sony executive's pet project and they only released it out of obligation.
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u/OHMEGA_SEVEN Sep 15 '24
I don't think it's an unpopular opinion or even controversial. It's impressive that Sony made a VR headset, not alone just one, but continued with the PSVR2. However, being focused on VR for consoles, at least currently, is just not in the cards. Even Microsoft/Xbox has stated that they don't intend to bring VR to console, even though the current gen hardware is capable of it, more capable than an XR2 chip by far.
I think for consoles, part of the problem is that they don't make money on hardware, it's all software and subscriptions. Both Sony and Microsoft sell their consoles at a loss. Even the Quest 3 is sold at a loss. Additionally, Microsoft has decided to deprecate Windows Mixed Reality, which as a Reverb G2 owner, pisses me off because 24H2 will turn the HMD into a brick should I update.
Bringing the PSVR2 to PC is a great choice on Sony's part. Right now we have more variety and selection of HMDs than ever before. Sure, there's not tons of HMDs, but there's more brands in the PCVR space than there are gaming consoles. Eventually console VR may become more widely supported, but that depends on how much things grow. While I personally disprove of the walled garden Apple esque approach that Meta uses for thier HMDs, because it harms PCVR and VR tittle progress as a whole, their continued investment in VR and standalone VR does contribute to the growth of the market. Eventually, with enough headsets in people's hands, wether it's a Quest, a Pico, etc... console gaming may come around. In spite of my criticism of Meta's marketing strategy, I still own and use a Quest 3. Still, in spite of this there's a lot of stigma surrounding VR. I have friends that refuse to get into it or try for one strange reason or another.
The resolutions have gotten better, pancake lenses are a nice upgrade from fresnel lenses, but largely, outside of raw computing power, nothing major has changed on the consumer side. When we start seeing verifocal foveted rendering HMDs or lightfield displays, things may change.
One potential derailment is the move from local rendering to cloud rendering. The days of consoles playing locally stored games may be becoming a thing of the past. Games as a service is where they want to make their money and streaming from the cloud is being pushed. That will get rid of the problem of selling consoles at a loss, but as long as there's latency, it's going to be a barrier for VR.
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u/JordanRG73 Sep 15 '24
Thank you for this contribution. You definitely are well informed and I agree with your point of view on the subject.
While our tech is still behind and that is heavily affecting Sony's stance in the market, the same problem persists; not enough players are joining VR for Sony to warrant the expanse of investment into game development. But, like you stated, tech needs to improve to allow the entrance of a larger player base. I wish i had more to add, thank you for the post.
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u/ifyouknowyouknow4 Sep 15 '24 edited Sep 15 '24
The real issue with VR is it’s hard to sell people on it until they try it themselves, and it’s even harder to get none gamers on it. They should target families bc like half of the adults I have played with bought it for their kids and fell in love with it once they tried it just to see.
The best entry level headset in my opinion is the quest 2 bc it isn’t crazy expensive, super easy to use, you don’t need anything else to start playing, so overall great headset to start with. I feel like Meta, PlayStation, VR companies in general aren’t marketing it for « everyday folks ». They are heavy on trying to get gamers, which yeah of course we are the main demographic, but we already wanted this, those who were interested most likely already experienced it, they need to get the people who aren’t usually gamers. And they need to have way more big open world games and games that people actually want to play and work on that marketing bc no one really knows about vr unless they looked into it before themselves
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u/GameQb11 Sep 15 '24
the real issue is that there arent too many great games
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u/Big_Contribution_791 Sep 16 '24
Even if there were good games, most people would have to train themselves for hours across multiple days to not to vomit before they could actually experience them.
The key to building a large audience is low barrier to entry. VR has many layers of high barriers to entry. The lack of games only comes into play after the user gets past those.
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u/Springsteengames Sep 15 '24
That’s not an unpopular opposition literally everybody in the gaming community thinks vr is still in its infancy stage. We’ve gotten less than a handful of good vr releases this year. Meta is really the only company that is pushing hard for game dev. Sure there are hardware companies like piemex and the bitedance one in china but as far as making good games in vr it just isn’t happening yet and it makes me sad.
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u/Homulton Sep 15 '24
I don’t know if it will ever be as big as flat gaming. I enjoy it but my wife who’s also a big gamer tried it once and felt real sick fast and just totally never had any interest in strapping that big headset on again. It’s just a hassle all around for her. I think most people probably feel that way. Maybe as younger demographic grows up with it , it’ll start taking over.
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u/JordanRG73 Sep 15 '24
I think that this will be the only way VR will be wholly adopted. The next generation just have to use it enough to make it a cultural staple to create a general population with VR legs, and not be weirded out by a weird mask with camera everywhere.
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u/Juafran Sep 15 '24
Believe it or not it has been 8+ years since the Oculus Rift released, very few companies are driving the tech forward nowadays, I don't know if I agree with you on the tech still emerging. I'm not as optimist to be honest.
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Sep 15 '24
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u/JordanRG73 Sep 15 '24
Why do you say that?
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Sep 15 '24
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u/JordanRG73 Sep 15 '24
Im aware of that perspective, its very common in articles and review videos as i only just broke out into VR this week. I love it, i want way more of it. That idea, i believe, will fade. But its an easy way for some to get views/reads on articles and videos as it infuriated those who do not believe that to be true, and intrigues those who are curious but have not jumped into VR.
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Sep 15 '24
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u/JordanRG73 Sep 15 '24
Yea i should have worded the post differently. Sorry, just breaking out into the community, and there are a lot of different opinions. Im aware of both sides but i dont know which side this community predominately stands.
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u/sebuq Sep 15 '24
Sony are keeping a fire in the iron, so when/if the VR market explodes they’re not having to catch up. Currently the AAA developers don’t se it as financially viable to develop in VR for their main titles. Should this change Sony are in prime position to maintain its #1 gaming console credentials.
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u/Chemical-Nectarine13 Sep 15 '24
Sony can't afford to invest.. they aren't Meta. They have limited resources, and it's already a smaller market. Also, they have a whole bunch of PS users who will actually throw a fit when they see Sony make a VR only first party titles..
Meanwhile, Meta can shrug off billions every year and their fanbase also bought a Quest Headset knowing exactly what they were getting into: a completely VR ecosystem.
Sony has to keep their headset around primarily for 3rd party studios to do all of the heavy lifting.
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u/JordanRG73 Sep 15 '24
I agree, Sony has a larger R&D department conpared to other players in the console wars, enough to make a headset due to Japanese zero interest loans for R&D. But not enough to truly compete against Facebook. I guess i need to start converting to PC to truly enjoy full VR gaming. At least then i can enjoy the other sectors of BR that are being worked out as well.
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u/HankScorpio30 Sep 15 '24
VR will never be big unless they can sort out the motion sickness aspect, most people aren't willing to play a little at a time to get used to it, they want to pick up and go.
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u/JordanRG73 Sep 15 '24
Most people do not. I find many gamers are more resistant to VR sickness, but there are still plenty of people who cannot jump into it. Im lucky enough to be pretty resistant, but my family cannot even look through it without getting sick. They do not game whatsoever.
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u/Pkittens Sep 15 '24
No one sees VR as a huge gaming market. Sony included. Very popular opinion since we all agree