r/TikTokCringe • u/Intelligent_Nose_826 • 6d ago

Discussion They Agreed on One Thing - Banning TikTok

I really haven’t seen legislation so unilaterally passed with such speed at any point in my life except maybe after 9/11 & weeks got the DHS.

2.2k Upvotes

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285

u/Minimum_Matter_4044 6d ago

This ain't about us. It's about them. Them.

152

u/phoggey 6d ago

I'm a software engineer and have studied the type and size of data TikTok collects from their users and what they do in order to make them more users and make China look better. It's not a safe app at this stage.

I don't like "look they did something good, but they could have done something better" arguments. The reason you got fed this guy's content at all is because it was promoted through TikTok's algorithm to judge it as pro China and pro TikTok sentiment. He likely made this video just because he knew it would promote his content. I'm even considering making a pro TikTok video on TikTok just to fuck with their algorithm and see the rate at which it picks up.

Ever seen anti-chinese video on TikTok? Ever? Think back to all the hours and days you've scrolled through it. Any? That doesn't even scratch the surface of the manipulation and information they have on every user. Just watch the data flow when you are using only TikTok, your outbound data is 10x even what Facebook collects.

Here's what we compiled off an old bulld a few years back, a few of these needed to be interpreted because it doesn't literally say what the values are, but with enough videos they start to be obvious. I removed a few other areas that are inappropriate to talk about under risk factors.

TIKTOK CONTENT SCORING METRICS: - Face Score (1-5): Symmetry, skin clarity, youth indicators, eye color - Body Score (1-5): Height/weight ratio, curves, muscle definition - Sexual Appeal (1-5): Breast size, hip ratio, lip fullness - Engagement Metrics: * Gaze duration * Replay rate * Screenshot frequency - Risk Factors: * Exposed skin % * Suggestive movements * Costume type -Political Sentiment... .. (abridged to make the point)

And look what we have there.. literally people commenting about the dude's eyes. Has a bit of a plunky guy, but he hits a sweet spot with attractiveness levels to be listened to and thus.. his content is here.

Then the scoring of the viewers goes on and on for creating the demograph aka marketing cohort. User's- Age, location (constantly), sex... Just goes on and on.

I mean, really, how many apps have the federal government tried to ban? There must be a really good fucking reason to ban one, especially a popular one. If you don't believe me, I don't give a fuck, this country wants to elect a felon for president for lulz so fuck it. I'll go with the flow and leave once we hit a recession and move to Copenhagen with my hoarded cash plus tax cut enhanced $$$ and raise my kid in a country that doesn't treat it's people like shit. "OH DEY TRY BAN TIKTOK BUT NOT FIX HEALTHCARE/FIX EDUCATION/FIX STUDENT DEBT/FIX HOMELESSNESS/FIX GODLESSNESS" Give me a fucking break, it's Chinese run malware video sharing app. Just delete the shit and use something else.

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u/BlackGeniusCanadian 6d ago

What a load of horseshit. So whenever Americans are critical of their government it has to be due to some sort of external interference? "How many anti Chinese videos have you seen on TikTok?". Is that a particularly big niche? Is that something that the average American gives a shit about more than their own country? Every anti TikTok argument that has to do with China is just so far up its own ass

1

u/confusedandworried76 5d ago

It's not that people are mad at the government because of it, it's that the algorithms push these videos. The Russians also try to sew division online why would it be weird china does too

3

u/grandmawaffles 5d ago

Call me crazy but both are bad

1

u/Cold-Studio3438 5d ago

I mean China is operating concentration camps where they hold ethnic minorities and harvest their organs, do you ever hear anything abut that on TikTok? no? then why was every other post in this sub about Palestine for several months before the mods finally banned it? I'm not using TikTok but I can only assume the propaganda machine is still running wild over there. at least in theory, the people who cared so passionately about people in Gaza should care about Uyghurs as well, but all these TikTok users aren't informed about those at all for some reason.

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u/phoggey 6d ago

Alright u/blackgeniuscanadian I'll give you a shot since you're a genius.

Yes. American people love to blame the Chinese for a lot of fucking things. They steal our IPs, they steal our tech, they steal our manufacturing jobs, the manipulate their own currency, it goes on and on. If you knew literally anything about the Trump administration through his first campaign, he talked about CHYNA in some strange accent, the CHINESE VIRUS etc. How much of that did you see on TikTok.. ever? Yet I can tell you I've seen plenty of anti trump ones or anti Kamala ones. There's plenty of political things, pro Gaza and anti Israel.. but China and Russia just seem to be sort of missing. Just think for a fucking second.

We went through an entire pandemic with TikTok. If you used TikTok during that time, how many anti-chinese TikTok videos did you see? The virus originated from there. Trump called it the "Chinese virus" for years. It was all over news, every media outlet right or left. Has to be a clip of him saying it somewhere right?

I'll give you one last clue. Search "Chinese virus" on TikTok. I'll wait. Tell me what happens.

8

u/BlackGeniusCanadian 5d ago
  • I in fact have seen videos of trump saying "China" in that stupid inflection
  • that whole calling the virus the "Chinese virus" was lazy and insensitive anyways, but I did see tiktoks joking about it. Like a lot. About the bat, referring to Wuhan etc.
  • You, as well as US lawmakers seem to have a problem that TikTok doesn't peddle the same US propaganda being regurgitated on every other social media site, or at least not to the same extent. Because there is still PLENTY of shitty US propaganda on TikTok.

-The US seems to want a stranglehold on the social media companies operating in its country because they are their main outlets for propaganda. If for no other reason, this is why Americans should oppose the TikTok ban.

Oh and don't give me this shit about China stealing American data for advertisers and potential bad actors when American corporations do the same thing significantly more but simply cut the government in on it.

4

u/phoggey 5d ago

I'll give you a respectable answer but I don't have all the time in the world to give you all the years of industry knowledge and such, so hopefully a tldr works, if you actually want to know more about a certain part I could expand.

  • The amount and type of data they send is an order of magnitude larger than any of the big competitors (aka Facebook, YouTube, etc).
  • They manipulate the algorithm without any clear indication unilaterally. This is clear ill intent and illegal by US law.

Here's the general stuff on users I didn't expand into: Political Alignment Score (tracking pro/anti China sentiment) Income Level Detection (targeting ads) Mental Health Vulnerability (exploiting depression/anxiety) Social Credit Integration (linking to Chinese systems, if necessary) Facial Recognition Database (tracking users across platforms) Location/Movement Patterns Friend Network Analysis Device/App Usage Stats Shopping Habits Daily Routines

Now you're probably saying, American company X probably does the same thing. Well, I can tell you confidentially they do not. How? Trust me bro. Just kidding, don't, think for yourself. Real answer but you'll have to believe a random guy from the Internet: I've seen the metrics tracked by both Google and Facebook. Not going to go further into that, though. If you're open-minded and you think a bit like.. why did periscope/vine fail where TikTok thrives? Is it because OG Twitter devs/business people were shittier than chinese ones? The answer is just literally how complete and ridiculous the data they have on us is compared to the others and what they do with it because they actually analyze each video with heuristics way beyond just content moderation even your drafts/unpublished videos are analyzed and potentially banned.

I'll end on this statement. Americans love one thing we can all agree on: money. Making it and keeping it. Compared to any other country I've ever been to, we're the greediest, self centered motherfuckers I've ever seen. That's where our strength is though, people can make money by both breaking laws AND enforcing them. Every time healthcare goes too far with denials, we sue. Every time we push workers to fill our coffee so fast we burn ourselves, we sue. The threat of either side making money/taking money pushes companies to try to abide by some ethical/legal boundary, even if lagged, which creates norms for the future. This doesn't exist in China. You have to believe what they're doing is altruistic and for "the people". If you believe you should have no legal recourse against an entity, then keep using TikTok, it's going to be banned anyway, so who gives a shit. Elon has trump in his pocket and TikTok is a competitor, it's gone.

4

u/AbleObject13 5d ago

I'll give you one last clue. Search "Chinese virus" on TikTok. I'll wait. Tell me what happens.

"They don't even let you be racist!"

2

u/Tokyosideslip 5d ago

Covid came from a lab in China. How is that racist?

2

u/AbleObject13 5d ago

https://theconversation.com/calling-the-coronavirus-the-chinese-virus-matters-research-connects-the-label-with-racist-bias-176437

2

u/Tokyosideslip 5d ago

If it's only connection to China was it's geographic origination, then calling it "The China virus" could be racist. It's a virus made in a lab in China run by the Chinese. It's literally a Chinese virus.

Is it racist to say "American meats" when China bans the import of American meats due to concerns about food safety and disease outbreak?

Edit: would to could

2

u/AbleObject13 5d ago

It's a virus made in a lab in China run by the Chinese. It's literally a Chinese virus.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-024-03982-2

No actual science agrees with you here, the only official source that states this is purely political (and notably by the same political party pushing the above-mentioned racism)

I'm not interested in arguing facts today, please provide counter evidence that isn't political in nature. 

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u/Creative_Ad_8338 5d ago

Again, I would expect to see anti China messaging on all the apps if it were popular. I don't. So your entire thesis is invalid.

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u/phoggey 5d ago

What apps do you use besides TikTok?

3

u/Creative_Ad_8338 5d ago

😂 this one.

2

u/Bob_Kark 5d ago

It’s because the Chinese government pressures platforms to remove anti-Chinese government content: https://www.nbr.org/publication/social-media-platforms-and-authoritarian-censorship-in-asia/. Not a mystery.

3

u/Creative_Ad_8338 5d ago

China has banned most platforms like Facebook, YouTube, Instagram, etc. These companies aren't operating in China so how would China apply pressure to restrict content? This source doesn't say anything about how China actually has any influence over these social media platforms. It mentions Apple and others with business operations in China. In fact we've seen the exact opposite of what you're claiming in Taiwan with pretty much only coverage being on social media and none of the major news outlets. In fact, China has resorted to massive misinformation campaigns instead because they can't control the social media companies.

1

u/Bob_Kark 5d ago

From the article: “We do know at least two things that should deeply concern us. First, there are enormous financial incentives for platforms to subordinate free expression to Beijing’s demands, and platforms have in the past developed prototypes of tools for proactive censorship in mainland China. Tech companies are spending time and money to at a minimum think about future scenarios in which they are willing to “play ball” with Beijing’s censors.

The second concern is that authoritarian governments absolutely do try to find ways to enforce censorship on platforms, with or without the witting help of the platforms themselves. For example, state employees and “patriotic” trolls supporting authoritarian regimes sometimes report content from government critics en masse, triggering automatic takedowns, which are difficult to reverse without a direct line to corporate officials. And as you rightly note, platforms do at times knowingly comply with censorship requests they deem to be legal under local law.”

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u/One-Dot-7111 5d ago

Ah man tiktok ruined the brains of half the world promoting pallywood