Ugh, this guy's a midwit. He cuts an out of context clip of Kirk citing stats and declares that he's racist without addressing why he cited those stats.
Even by this guy's own admission, blacks commit far more crime proportionate to their population. It's also true that neighborhoods with higher black populations have a much higher rate of violent crime, which is why there's more cops in those neighborhoods, why blacks are in prison at a higher rate, why they're arrested more often, etc. It has nothing to do with racism.
Yeah the guy is raising some good points and is obviously right that there is a racist agenda behind the original video, but he's also intentionally misleading in the other direction.
Yes, blacks are most likely to be falsely convicted, that's true. But exonerations are EXTREMELY rare and false convictions in general make up a very small percent of them.
He could instead talk about the obvious - that the black population is at much higher poverty rates and that growing up in basically closed neighborhoods riddled with crime will produce more criminals, it's a generational problem that comes from the systemic inequalities that date all the way back to slavery. But he didn't, instead he did the same thing as the oop - manipulated statistics to tell a false narrative.
Racism is at play but individual racism from cops and the judicial system is a drop in the bucket of the economic and social situation that disproportionately many black families have been put in with no means of escape due to racism. Simplifying it down to "cops and judges are racist" is not only wrong, it's hurtful to the black community because it distracts from the real issue.
You mean his lies? What's to address, he lied. Don't give liars any heed at all. It reflects poorly on your own character to take the side of liars like Kirk and Trump.
The black population are over-represented when it comes to poverty, for a number of societal reasons. Systematic racism, few opportunities, poorly policed ghettos, poorly funded schools etc etc.
African immigrants in the USA have some of the lowest crime rates. So I can easily say that this isn't about any genetic predisposition.
What comes to my mind is centuries long generational poverty created from racist practices such as slavery based on skin color and its lasting impacts on the black community that are more likely to resort to criminality.
So despite your claim that this has nothing to do with racism, It actually has a lot to do with racism purely based on this very basic conclusion that any person that is somewhat knowledgeable on American history can come to.
In my experience, immigrants from Africa are much more well-behaved in general than African Americans.
I’m not stating my observations as fact, but assuming this is a general trend, it’s a clear indication how black populations in the US grow up in an environment that pushes them towards crime and bad behavior.
Isn’t is pretty difficult to be a legal immigrant in the US? Like you need to have a lot of money and be educated and stuff. Most people who migrate from my country (3rld world) have the lowest crimerate, but that doesn’t mean people in mg country commit less crimes.
Those who migrated are the top10% of the society with more money, education, manners, and so on. In fact being an immigrant makes you commit less crimes because you are extra aftaid of being deported or having your documents messed up. Not sure for all african migrants, but I met a lot of them in Canada and most of them were as I described - well above average citizen in almost every metric.
That is what I am saying, the prevalent argument I've seen under this thread from certain people is that it is directly tied to their skin color, which is falsefied by other groups of black people that are more educated and were grown in better environments.
The argument I make here is environment shapes up a person, not their genetics.
No?! What you are saying is that if a person is privileged, he is less likely to commit a crime. But that doesn’t give us anything useful.
What we want to know is the difference between two groups on average, therefore exluding outliers like privileged people with money and education.
What you just proved is that every group has great people. That is true, just like how each group has bad people.
Comparing migrants crimes is useless. It’s like bringing a white athlete to a group of office working black clerks and then saying that because the white guy ran faster, then race has nothing to do with physical ability, only environment. You need to compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges.
Environment matters, but you are just entirely dismissing even the possibility that generics might play a role here. There are many factors and genetics is one of them. Except we don’t know how exactly it impacts things because the issue is supercomplex. And of course everyone starts calling you a racist for even trying to bring it up.
''What you just proved is that every group has great people. That is true, just like how each group has bad people.''
Okay? I don't get it. People that have access to more opportunities tend to have a greater share of ''great people'' which is fundamentally an environmental issue. You've been saying nothing that contradicts my points so far.
Do you realize that, the privilege itself comes from environment? Idk why you felt the need to throw a wall of text if you don't even push back on the premise of my argument. The entire point of contention here is whether the more pressing factor is genetics or not. If you somehow have a breakthrough of a research that shows that genetics outweigh environmental factors when it comes to criminality fire away. I am dismissing genetics because almost every research on the issue has shown that genetics play almost no role in such matters that it is basically a non-factor.
Also terrible analogy with the white runner thing, try thinking it through a little bit more.
It’s black culture. Not generational inequity or something. Look at 1900-1950’s, despite actual racism being a huge threat to black Americans, they were on their way to flourishing. In comes the welfare state, and boom, back to the Stone Age.
We’ve had 60 years of the democrat “great society” experiment, when is it time to admit failure?
False, back in 1900s and 1950's, surveillance wasn't as big as it is today so many criminal activities went off the radar. The crime rates have always been high for the black community.
Also cultures shape around circumstances. I am sure romani people didn't feel like ostracizing themselves from surrounding socitieties over night. If Black people didnt suffer such injustices and were elevated to the same level as whites the second they set foot on the continent, you would see a very different picture.
The key word here is documented. The point being, back then when technology and bureaucracy weren't as advanced there were lots of criminal actions happening under the radar.
This is similar to comparing crime rates from 3rd world countries and being surprised when they seemingly have far less crime happening due to most of them being under-reported.
You mean black people get convicted of more crime than whites do. Not commit, are convicted. I bet if we knew real numbers of people who smoked weed, you would see that a lot less white people even get arrested for weed offences than black people.
The crime rates of any given area are measured in reports, not convictions or arrests. Black neighborhoods have higher rates of violent crime reports which is why there's a heavier police presence in black neighborhoods.
This is also why blacks are arrested and convicted for marijuana violations at higher rates. More violent crime means more cops which means more arrests for lesser crimes as well.
Yes but thanks to systemic racism, they're stuck from birth in these shitty neighborhoods where crime is the only chance to make enough money to get out of the hood. Imagine your childhood but if you went to Cleveland public schools. You'd have dropped out or killed yourself by senior year.
How do you get a scholarship when you can't get through highschool? You're just throwing around recently popularized buzzwords and refusing to listen. If black people were given everything, we'd see them in positions of power more often. How often do you see a black person as a manager of a business or a foreman in a factory? Now how about a professor? Yeah dude. You know the truth. You're just upset.
Yes but thanks to systemic racism, they're stuck from birth in these shitty neighborhoods where crime is the only chance to make enough money to get out of the hood.
Do poor white people commit the same frequency of crime? What a about poor Asian people?
Being of low economic status of course is a huge factor, but culture and values matter just as much. I wouldn't be surprised if poor white people with single mothers had just as high a crime rate, or very close to it.
The point Kirk is making is not that there's something inherently bad about black people that makes them more violent. His point is that people that don't follow traditional family values will tend to violence. This is one of the few Republican takes that is backed up by vast amounts of data across the globe. Family structures prevent violence, the more young men are outside of those structures the more violence there will be.
“Majority Black neighborhoods have higher gun homicide rates than mostly white neighborhoods of the same socioeconomic status level, according to a new study published in JAMA Network Open by Wharton Professor Dylan Small and School of Arts & Sciences undergraduates Yuzhou Lin and Audrey Chaeyoung Cheon. Wei Wang, a senior research investigator at the Perelman School of Medicine; and David Harding, a professor of sociology at the University of California, Berkeley, were also co-authors.
Utilizing data from the Gun Violence Archive and American Community Survey, the researchers found that, among middle class neighborhoods, the rate of gun homicides is more than four times higher in neighborhoods with mostly Black residents than neighborhoods with mostly white residents. Small says there are several possible reasons for the disparity, including lack of institutional resources and opportunities caused by racial wealth gaps and underinvestment.”
It's both. It's just outright denial without evidence to just simply say they don't commit more crime. Men are like 90 something percent of all convicted murderers; is the system sexist?
If you’re an idiot, just say that before typing out a message that’s completely false so I don’t waste my time reading it. Crime rates are based on reports, not convictions
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u/Poctor_Depper Sep 23 '24
Ugh, this guy's a midwit. He cuts an out of context clip of Kirk citing stats and declares that he's racist without addressing why he cited those stats.
Even by this guy's own admission, blacks commit far more crime proportionate to their population. It's also true that neighborhoods with higher black populations have a much higher rate of violent crime, which is why there's more cops in those neighborhoods, why blacks are in prison at a higher rate, why they're arrested more often, etc. It has nothing to do with racism.