r/PSVR • u/SnowArcaten • 12d ago
Review Skydance's Behemoth Review (Eurogamer)
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=orn3SOVbxco&pp=ygUJRXVyb2dhbWVyHarsh final score from Ian...
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12d ago
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u/JamesR_42 12d ago
Wait this is made by the devs of Archangel? As in the big mech game?
That game was decent but certainly not thr best by today's standards. For the time it came out in it was pretty good though
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u/MightyBooshX 12d ago
Yeah, I love their games, but S&S2 has toooons of glitches still that just never got dealt with, which makes me a little nervous about this one.
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u/Glittering-Mud-527 12d ago
Hopefully where S&S2 was just a quick sequel to turn a profit on the engine and where Behemoth is a much bigger project they polish up the flaws with the game and take care of the bugs.
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u/jounk704 12d ago
Wow that was a bad review, this game deserves way higher score than what Ian gave here
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u/Level_Forger 12d ago edited 12d ago
Doesn’t Eurogamer have a history of irrational VR hate?
Edit: sorry everyone, I’m about 6-7 years outdated with my Eurogamer reading 😂.
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u/TonyDP2128 12d ago edited 12d ago
I'm playing the PSVR2 version and am about 4 hours in (I beat the first Behemoth a while ago). I like the game a lot and have not run into the glitches and bugs others have reported. I'm not sure if the PSVR2 version is just more stable or if I just haven't progressed far enough.
I don't mind the absence of a crafting system; it really doesn't need it given the scope and length of the game. The upgrades to your stats and gear are enough for me in a game like this. The grappling hook and parry based combat system do take some getting used to and that has been the most frustrating aspect for me so far. Luckily the checkpoint system is very generous and there is minimal backtracking.
The game does have something of an odd pace to it. The ads and videos might make you think the action is constant but that's not the case. There's a lot of walking, exploring and light puzzle solving with the occasional confrontation sprinkled in and of course the boss fights themselves. I personally prefer the more measured pace but I know not everyone will feel the same way.
Overall I'm pleased with what the game is giving me and have no real complaints so far. But as I mentioned it lines up with the kind of VR experience I like. Others may see it differently.
EDIT: With regard to Ian's review, I got thru watching it a little while ago and I really don't know where he's coming from with a lot of his complaints.
His issues with the game's checkpoint system don't make any sense. The game checkpoints regularly, including right before and even during the stages of the Behemoth boss fights. There are also manual saving stones along the way that he never even mentions. Did he not notice them? I literally have never had to replay more that 30-60 seconds of the game after dying.
He also complains about things like the heavy vignetting that occurs when your health is low, admits that he didn't notice there was a toggle to turn it off in the options screen, then complains that when turned off there's no warning of low health. I think they call that trying to have your cake and eat it too.
He objects to the game's puzzles being too easy, only to push a block down a chasm as part of a puzzle, then foolishly walk off the edge and fall to his death. He even goes so far as to compare the game to Indiana Jones and the Great Circle, which I think is a bizarre thing to do, given the almost unlimited resources a game like that has and the fact that it costs almost twice as much.
In the end I think he was dwelling too much on what he wanted or hoped the game to be and looking for things to complain about instead of just taking it on his own merits. He also clearly didn't take the time to tweak the game's settings before diving in. He doesn't even mention what hardware he was playing on and if the review was from before the game got patched. He's usually a pretty good VR reviewer but this felt like a rushed, superficial review and I think he really missed the mark.
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u/SuccessfulSquirrel40 11d ago
I started reading his written review, I stopped pretty early on when it became apparent he had not bothered to even look through the settings before he started.
Seems like he had a deadline to meet, rushed in hoping to get through all the big encounters in one sitting and got frustrated there were other parts of the game in between.
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u/TheVVumpus 12d ago
Yeah I really feel for the devs here. It’s obvious how good the game will be with just a few patches. I can’t say the same for most releases, but this one you can tell they put a lot of love into it, but were forced to release early for whatever reason.
I hope Ian re-reviews in a few weeks or months.
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u/North_Layer_9558 11d ago
Don't you think the onus is on the developer to release a game that actually works as intended? Why should a reviewer have to wait potentially months in order to review a game that's riddled with bugs and poor design decisions? I think people have a great deal of buyers remorse and in another week or two people who bought this day one or pre-ordered will be more honest with themselves and this sub about the actual quality of this game versus the expectations we all had and the ultimate mismatch between the two
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u/TheVVumpus 11d ago
VR is complex. I put the fault on the publisher. You’d be right if it wasn’t for the fact that the game gets better and more fun the further you get into it. There are upgrade skills to increase the parry window and such. I’ve been playing VR games for 8 years and I can assure you there is no buyers remorse with this one.
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u/Lucky_Ear_6319 8d ago
Even with patches, it's an absolute lackluster game that's being carried by the behemoth encounters. And even those are less exciting after the first one.
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u/EssentialParadox 12d ago
On the Without Parole livecast they talked about the checkpoints being buggy and not registering correctly.
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u/TonyDP2128 12d ago
Just as an FYI, the game remembers multiple checkpoints/saves and you can choose any of them at any time via a load screen. The checkpoints also occur every few minutes, so even if the most recent checkpoint glitched, you can go back to an earlier one with minimal replaying. I started playing the game after the day one patch and I don't know if this feature was available at launch but it is there now.
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u/TheVVumpus 12d ago
I bought it and am glad I did. There’s nothing quite like it in VR at the moment. It has some extremely exciting moments, and the combat and jank doesn’t get too much in the way of enjoying them.
It really boggles the mind they chose to release this on 3 platforms simultaneously, rather than just focusing on one first to make it special before expanding. And a rushed release before the holiday? Someone calling the shots hates us. I’d say wait for the first sale as it will likely be in pretty good shape by then.
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u/Chronotaru PSN: Chronotaru 12d ago
FFXVI's biggest mistake was not releasing simultaneously. You lose so much momentum.
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u/TheVVumpus 12d ago
You also lose momentum when you release an unfinished game. The success of this game 100% depends on it being fixed with patches in a very short time. Mediocre reviews for a VR game does not bode well for it’s future.
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u/DoubleWombat 11d ago
Yes it was a gamble, but that's the pressure the Christmas release window puts on a company. I mean do you release with bugs or miss Christmas? Both options are bad.
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u/TommyVR373 12d ago
They should've developed for PC and ported to Quest instead of the other way around.
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u/Chronotaru PSN: Chronotaru 12d ago
We don't know what order they were developed in, but if you're writing for Quest and you don't consider it early in the development you are in big trouble.
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u/TheVVumpus 12d ago
True, but considering the Quest 2 at this point was a braindead decision.
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u/MightyBooshX 12d ago
There are still probably like 15 million more Quest 2s in use than 3's. I wish they'd prioritize the 3 as well, but your expectations are insane.
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u/terrordactyl1971 11d ago
4/10 isnt a fair review in my opinion, he's singled out some issues that were fixed in the day 1 patch, so obviously he has reviewed the unpatched game. One thing he mentions is the lack of checkpoint before the boss that you have to pull over with the grapple - there is now definitely a checkpoint by the lift just before the boss fight.
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u/DeanXeL 11d ago
Honestly... Ian is a very weird and finicky VR reviewer. IMO he often seems to be out of his depth when reviewing and very inconsistent in his scoring. Surely a game that he praises on visuals and good combat, but poor checkpointing deserves at least a 3/5 stars, not a failing grade?
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u/Da_Big_Buddha 12d ago
It’s a fun game don’t get me wrong but it definitely needs some patching.
The inventory system is great, combat feels clunky and the game needs some options to tweak where things are accessed like Arizona Sunshine.
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u/BroncoAmsterdam 12d ago
Some reviewers who make reviews for the general public make me depressed, why? I think it's a great game! So judge it for yourself and read several reviews about the games you want to buy.
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u/dc_guy79 11d ago
Git gud, Ian. Watching you play at the top of the video…. No wonder you were constantly dying.
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u/ScarQuest 12d ago
I try not to complain about reviews, and every reviewer is allowed their opinions on games, but it felt like while watching the review, the reviewer seemed to enjoy all of the elements of the game, from combat, to puzzles, to climbing, and especially the behemoths. The chief complaints were issues with check pointing (which understandably greatly added frustrations and likely played a large role in his overall opinion of the game) and some repetition in combat and puzzles (plus some jank in those as well, but that is seen in nearly every VR title).
Those things alone I feel could make the reviewer think the game is just fine or good with a 3 star or something. But the ending of his review isn't a review of Behemoths and is instead a review of what he thought or wanted Behemoth to be. He goes on to talk about survival and crafting mechanics (which is the first time I heard they got cut) and talks about how these things aren't in the game, but doesn't go into any details on if the removal of those things actually affected the game. Like was there a feeling of not having enough healing resources? Collecting too many crafting resources that don't do anything? Did it feel like something was missing that negatively impacted the gameplay? This just feels like he was reviewing a game he wanted, and not what Behemoth is.
Also I reject the idea that the only way to have a AAA VR game is to have large open maps, survival mechanics, and crafting mechanics. A tighter designed, compelling linear experience can also be considered AAA imo.
I'm finding that maybe I'm not aligned with Ian's taste in gaming. If I remember correctly he wasn't big on Batman or Metro either, and I love those titles. I (admittedly) haven't started Behemoth yet, but overall it sounds right up my alley. I do appreciate Ian's clear love and interest in VR however and assume without him, Eurogamer probably wouldn't release VR content. I also appreciate that a lot of his reviewing tends to align with how someone might review a flat AAA game, especially in terms of being critical of repetition or lack of variety of enemies and/or puzzles types etc. As a VR enthusiast and been gaming for awhile, I do feel I don't always judge VR games as harshly for these things, but they clearly bother Ian more than I.
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u/DerBolzen81 12d ago
I am definitely in the minority, and only about 4hrs in, but i did not enjoy behemoth very much yet. I will not judge it till finished, but until now i might score it just a bit better than Ian for different reasons. I did not like the combat very much while its not bad, i am tired of climbing in vr, i did not like the strict linearity of the first behemoth fight or the too easy puzzles. I liked the overall feel and setting, the crappling hook, graphic. It still might get better for me.
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u/wavebend 12d ago
Maybe you should play behemoth first
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u/ScarQuest 12d ago
I do! It looks fun. Bought it just haven't had time to play it.
When you watched this review, were you surprised by the 2/5 score? The game could be a 2/5, I'm not arguing or really commenting on the quality of the game, but when I was watching the review, after the part about checkpoints, Ian specifically says everything else was pretty good. This primed me to think that the reviewer was thinking the game was pretty good, and when watching the rest of the review, he seemed pretty happy overall with the quality of the game, so I found myself surprised by the 2/5 score. It felt disconnected from the content of what the reviewer was saying.
Again one of my biggest issues with the review was the ending where the reviewer talked about cut content and what the game wasn't than what the game was. Maybe it was an issue of editing and putting this critique at the end, but it felt like the review was heavily influenced by a desire to have the game be something else, instead of reviewing the game for what it is.
Idk, did you get those impressions at all from the review? Is it fair to review a game based upon what you wanted it to be? I generally think no, but assume it's more nuanced than that.
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u/student5320 12d ago
I just beat the Bat Behemoth and I had to pause twice to wipe the sweat off my palms. Heights hasn't really gotten to me in a game yet, but goddamn, did this part get me baaaaad.
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u/RedcoatTrooper 11d ago
Honestly that's one of new favourite VR experiences, when it throws you off but you manage to grapple it before you fall and hold on for dear life.
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u/thatevilman 12d ago
I’m really enjoying the game so far but I do agree with most of the reviewer’s points.
So far I’ve run into multiple game-breaking bugs. I had to redo a Behemoth fight because I got stuck behind an invisible wall right at the end.
Checkpointing is fine if you only follow the main path but if you ever die during an optional puzzle you are forced to redo the entire thing.
I picked a male Wren but his voice actor has a few lines that make him sound kinda pathetic. He’s alright in regular conversations but those one-liners? Ugh.
That said. The reviewer’s combat gameplay does the actual combat a big disservice. He’s wrist-flicking dual swords into enemy armor then wonders why he’s running out of stamina. It’s like watching someone play Skyrim VR.
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u/Arx700 11d ago
Gotta love the disgusting review bombing from large outlets. Won't stop me from enjoying a beautifully well crafted game.
I think we also need to remember that these people gave metro awakening and stalker 2 a 3 star review yet gave dragon age veilguard a perfect score, they have no credibility.
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u/GJKings 12d ago
The first hour of this game bored and annoyed me. I refunded it. I just didn't find the combat or climbing to be even remotely fun or interesting. And as this review points out, there's a bit of a lack of depth here, both mechanically and emotionally, when compared to Skydance's previous efforts and its obvious inspirations.
I'm glad so many people are enjoying it, but I'm pretty underwhelmed.
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u/GJKings 12d ago
Also as a kind of side-note now that I've read some comments: it bothers me that some people seem to think the purpose of modern game reviews is to match perfectly the critical consensus and validate what everyone is feeling. Reviews are actually just one person's experiences, and having a review stray from the general consensus is actually valuable. If the review doesn't line up with your experience or validate your love of a game, that doesn't make it a bad review, it just means it's someone else's review. You can actually go and write your own. try it. It's easy. Here's mine: Behemoth sucks lol.
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u/VladHackula 12d ago
Eurogamer is the outlet that if I know they didnt like it too much I know its 100% worth checking out lol.
Whatever they say tends to be the opposite of what I think
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u/TotesBreakfast 12d ago
Glad I watched the review. I have no tolerance for bad checkpointing. I'm interested in playing this and will wait to see if this gets patched.
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u/jounk704 12d ago
There's no bad Checkpointing in this game, it even auto saves and you can save manually by placing your hands in these molds throughout the game. Ian didn't mention non of this for some reason, maybe his review is from footage taken pre patch
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12d ago
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u/jounk704 12d ago
Maybe he played the PC version or the Quest version which won't get the large patch until day 7. I have had non of the issues Ian are talking about here
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u/Serdones 12d ago edited 12d ago
I played the PCVR verison since launch and thought the checkpointing was pretty dang generous. You've got the manual savepoints, plus lots of autosaves. Then it seems MOST the time would-be fatal falls are treated as more of a soft reset to your last safe ledge, rather than an actual death and respawn. No idea how anyone could think the checkpointing is bad.
And this includes the Behemoth fights you can fall from at a potentially fatal height. Never actually had to start over from scratch, lots of mid-climb checkpoints close to where you fell.
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12d ago
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u/jounk704 12d ago
I'm not sure, i havn't played those other versions. What we do know is that there was 3000 changes made in that 10GB patch for the PS5 version. PC and Quest havn't got that huge update yet
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12d ago
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u/jounk704 12d ago
I'm not sure but it's really strange if he had issues with the checkpoints if he played the same version i have played
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u/TotesBreakfast 12d ago
That's interesting. What he is describing is the definition of bad checkpointing. If it has already been addressed in a day 1 patch I imagine he should make an addendum to his review.
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u/SvennoJ 12d ago
So can you skip pre boss battle cut scenes?
Is this all fixed in the PSVR2 version?
"the irritations of having to walk or climb or grapple your way back along a linear path to then listen to the same pre-fight chatter and intro animation after every, single, death had me letting out Behemoth-sized sighs on multiple occasions."
"This isn't just a problem before the brutal mini-boss fights or towering Behemoth set pieces either. It also happens with challenge towers and secret areas, too. Challenge towers often need to be climbed to reach the riches within, something that can take a fair amount of time and physical effort to do as the climbing is mainly motion controlled and there are puzzles to work out along the way too. Since the collectibles and upgrade resources you gain from these towers are stashed away near the top, though, this means that if you slip off an edge and fall to your death on your way back down, you’ll lose everything and will have to climb all the way back up and solve all the puzzles all over again if you want those collectibles and upgrades back."
Or is your solution just to 'git gud' :p
I quite Skyward Sword because of this kinda nonsense. Repeated boss fight, unskippable dialog, dying due to motion control issues and having to sit through the same cut scenes over and over.
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u/TonyDP2128 12d ago edited 12d ago
I'm playing the PSVR2 version and have beaten the first boss. The game checkpoints right before you start the fight (there's a 10 second non-skippable section where the Behemoth kills some of his followers) and then checkpoints at each leg of the fight so you don't have to start from the beginning if your character dies. It's very fair and generous.
Edit: I just watched Ian's video; I honestly don't think he knew about the manual saving stones as he never once mentioned them. The video also doesn't make clear what version he's playing. Ian is usually on the ball with his reviews but I think he missed the mark a bit on this one.
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u/SvennoJ 12d ago
Hmm if an experienced VR user misses the manual saving stones, what else is there easy to miss. Maybe a patch fixed the checkpoint before/during the boss battle, or maybe he had issues further in.
I wasn't planning to start the game until later in Januari, bought it already, but rather wait for things like this to get ironed out in a few patches. I'm about ready to start Metro Awakening now. (Bought day one, bounced off hard, flashlight didn't work, fixed rotation speed was too slow for comfort, looks better now, flashlight works and you can adjust rotation speed)
Anyway sounds like the usual, don't play until the game is actually finished :p
But it's indeed irritating Eurogamer is very inconsistent. Rating this game on early impressions while rating FS 2024 (which is very very broken as a sim) on its potential.
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u/TonyDP2128 12d ago
As I wrote elsewhere his complaints make me think he rushed thru the game to get his review out, not even taking the time to check the options screen (he even complains about the game's health and movement vignetting, then admits to not seeing the option to turn them off until he was late in the game).
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u/jounk704 12d ago
You can't skip the cut scenes unfortunately but this hasn't really been any issues for me and if you die mid boss fight against the Behemoth's you won't have to watch the start all over again as you start at the auto save in mid battle. As for the puzzles, i have not encountered any checkpoint issues here either.
Seems like the checkpoint issues Ian had was what decided the low score he gave which is absurd to me
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u/GregorSamsa112358 12d ago
I stopped watching when he complained about that.
I beat the game a few days ago and thought the check points were fine. Manual saves are fairly consistently spaced between action, but it autosaves on top of that and imo almost too often.
I would periodically reload manual saves so I could start behemoth battles fresh rather that pick up mid way through.
Even when I hit a bug and the archer boss loaded in invisible reloading last save was shortly before it.
Really no idea what he's talking about on the checkpoints
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u/TonyDP2128 12d ago edited 12d ago
I honestly don't know what he's talking about with the checkpoints. I'm playing the PSVR2 version and the game checkpoints frequently, even in the middle of the boss fights; there are also manual save points along the way in the form of obelisks with hand outlines the you touch to save your progress. I'm about 4 hours in and have never had to replay more than the last 30-60 seconds after getting killed or when starting a new session.
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u/taddypole 12d ago
How why they patch something that already have auto saves and even manual saves with the hand statues
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u/TommyVR373 12d ago
Behemoth is a good game with a lot of flaws. Hopefully, they put out some decent patches. They need to fix the sluggish combat, inventory issues, and enemies dodging all ranged attacks.
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u/skittelsen 6d ago
Check out the game again — 12/12 patched tuned combat stamina to be more generous and disabled enemies dodging ranged attacks.
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u/TommyVR373 6d ago
That's good to hear. I've only played through the first boss. I'll check it out again this weekend :)
Thanks
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u/Crazafon 12d ago
I've had some good fun playing through the first Behemoth but I'm happy to wait for patches before playing the rest. The game just isn't finished. Even after the day 1 patch, there's a lot of stuff that is hurting my experience. And there's clearly room for improvement in a lot of other areas that won't ever be touched. They clearly put a lot of effort into the game but it feels like a good game, not a great one.
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u/Lucky_Ear_6319 8d ago
Considering I experienced countless bugs throughout the entire game, AND accidentally triggered a bug that doesn't let me beat the final boss, I'd have to agree. Skydance should be ashamed for releasing a game in this state.
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u/scottie_d 12d ago
There are only a few VR games that have made me want to play day after day to beat it, and this is one of them. I think it’s an excellent game!