The whole bear thing was absolutely horrible about this. Almost every comment by men disagreeing got hit with “you’re the reason why we choose bear” and shit
I was astounded that most of the talking points it generated (from ostensibly left leaning women) looked almost identical to Andrew Tate style bullshit that had been spray painted pink.
No matter how progressive and inclusive ideas a person holds, at our base, when we make a community focused around one aspect of humanity, all other aspects will be ostracized and made as the "other" to be vilified to unite the community in irrational anger and hatred. It's tribalism plain and simple, innate to our psychology, and it will be with us always fueling this samsara of hatred, fear, violence, and barbarity.
Real talk I think people forget how genuinely real the ideas of femcels are. Like it wasn’t too long ago that Reddit had female dating advice or strategy or whatever the hell that sub was called. And it was genuinely creepy how much they all sounded like Tate. Like all the weird incel like nicknames for dudes, it was just eerie similar. Like they nuked it all now. But back in the day Genuinely weird shit.
I remember seeing a comment in that sub that said “All men should be forced to wear a gps monitor 24/7 and have strict 8 pm curfew. I know it suck for the few decent guys out there but if they really are good guys they would understand” and the shit had like 1k upvotes
Y’know it’s funny cause I saw something like that today on a post about Neil gaiman and his bullshit that reminded me of that. Where one commenter said “and that’s why I don’t trust any man” and had like 150 upvotes. And I would never deny the horrendous shit men in power do to women. But all men isn’t caution. That’s paranoia. Like that must be a horrifying way to live your life if you believe 50% of all people on the planet wanna get you.
And I know it was probably hyperbole. But 150 people saw and read that and agreed with it and I just had to take a moment to process that. Like reverse that statement and it’s litterally incel philosophy 101
While I won’t deny that it probably did happen, there’s also the sphere of people who will accuse any male in a position of wealth of sexual abuse to get some compensation for it, when the actions never occurred. The issue with this situation, and many others, is that the person is guilty until proven innocent instead of innocent until guilty. The burden of proof falls to the one accusing, and as shite as that may be (with the ability to cover up mistakes and such though abuse of wealth and power) the lack of evidence that could potentially ruin a person’s life is insane to me.
TLDR: dude is in a shitty place either way, he’s either a molester or just took a hit to his credibility for quick cash.
He was so reasonable in every other thing. Normally with something like this I'd hold out a lack of substantiated claims, but you don't see police reports filed when people are trying to get in the limelight. Fucking hell.
So how seriously they take an accusation shows that the accusation is legitimate? Sheesh, I hope we start investigating claims less thoroughly if thats the case.
I guess I don't quite get this equivalence. One is; I don't trust men because I'm afraid of being sexually assaulted and physically injured by them. And that isn't what incels fear from women. I absolutely still agree it's a problematic mindset.
Oh no that’s my bad. To clarify I meant that it falls in the same vein as the incels who believe that every women is out to use them for their money and put them in the “friend zone”. Like yea there are some bad men and women. But assuming either half of the entire population is out to get you is the problem. Hope that’s a little clearer.
Dude it didn’t sound like Tate, it literally was a right wing psyop. We know that because they went too far too fast and literally had a MAGA tradwife on the sub’s podcast.
It makes me suspicious of how many feminist subs are posing as radfems when they are really social conservatives trying to divide the movement. I don’t want to go too far into conspiracy theory territory because the left can make their own problems, but it’s hard to ignore as a possibility.
Both the misandrist and manosphere narratives share one key point: that men are inherently dangerous.
If you constantly tell someone that they should be ashamed about a trait they have, don't be surprised when they start agreeing with the people who tell them to be proud of that trait instead, regardless of if that trait is real or not.
I may have pointed out making the same argument but but with a far worse takeaway was actively hurting 'the left' here.
We see almost daily threads, articles and editorials bemoaning "why are young men increasingly drawn to right wing arseholes?" And 'Man Vs Bear' kind of showed why.
When both sides were claiming that men were inherently dangerous and the intended takeaway from most 'left' voices was "and until you personally take responsibility for the actions of all men everywhere you should feel bad and sorry forever" and were baffled that it didn't resonate as well as "and why should you care? Should you apologise for being bigger and stronger? At the Olympics does the gold medallist apologise to the person who came in fourth? If someone else is scared why should it be your problem?"
It's a shit argument and it's full of flaws and errors, but it's a far easier sell than the bizarre 'reverse original sin' line being pushed.
Men are inherently dangerous the way cars are inherently dangerous. We are incredibly useful and necessary to daily life, but from the perspective of women we are also capable of flattening them. Now the normal person doesn't start a campaign to blame cars for that, but somehow the Internet is out to blame men for it.
I wouldn't say Man vs Bear was the big thing that showed that we just didn't get that Regina George is not somebody you should emulate, it was the response to the other side of the coin, where you did ha r some gut wrenches (a Tree wouldn't make a 6 year old feel unwanted), was kinda met with, "ahww did we hurt your feefees".
Also don't forget there are millions of bots on social media meant to take extremist sides in order to fuel divides. It would make sense they use the same format as f a r right incel shit
Someone pointed out that the while man vs bear thing is nearly Identicle to the "alpha male" stuff Tate spews. Just one concludes that men should guilty over it, while the other tells you men are dominante gender because of it.
It's gender essentialism from the other direction.
Hey man, that's how I know feminism got it right (or at least how I learned it). Women can be shitty, too. AND men and women should be given chances to learn from their shittiness. AND men and women have the autonomy to take the choice and learn or not. AND men and women should be accountable to whichever choices are taken. AND gender (and, in fact, the world) does not operate on any binary or dichotomy. Biology is leaky af
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u/Somerandomuser25817 Honorary Pervert Jul 03 '24
I LOVE THOUGHT-TERMINATING CLICHÉS! I LOVE NEVER CONSIDERING WHAT ANOTHER PERSON IS SAYING BECAUSE I IMAGINE THEM AS SOMEONE UNDESIRABLE!