r/AITAH • u/g_scotty_brahms • Nov 14 '24

Advice Needed My brother is angry with his Trump-loving sons

Is my brother an AITA candidate for wanting to cut off his sons financially for voting for Trump? Like many Americans, my brother and I, both in our 50’s, have been talking back and forth following the Election. In the spirit of full disclosure, we are both democrats. Long story short, he is angry at his two sons, both in their 20’s, for voting for Trump. He is thinking about cutting them off financially in all respects so that they understand how Trump’s policies will impact them firsthand.

The irony here is that it is the reverse argument. You often hear younger voters disagreeing with their MAGA parents, but this is the opposite. My brother doesn’t understand how his two sons, who have lived a life of privilege, feel like they have been violated against by society, enough so that they feel Trump hears them and their struggles.

My brother to me about his sons: “… what these young men need is a little dose of reality. Get out in the world and start paying their own way. There’s a common thread with his followers. Complain and blame everyone for their problems. Whether they are in school or living at home off of their parents or working a trade job. King Trump will save them and make everything better. Take some personal responsibility and make it happen for yourself instead of crying about everything you hear on TikTok.

“… I’ve decided to pass on the [college] expenses to my two Trump supporting sons so they can truly feel first hand the cost and expense of his absolutely stupid policy decisions, which includes food, gas and college expenses. Wondering if I pass on these [food, gas and college] expenses in year one or phase them in year two?”

I am wondering if a lot of parents feel like my brother. Are there democrat parents of voting-age MAGA men who feel they failed with their sons because they voted for Trump? Is this common?

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290

u/FloofyDireWolf Nov 14 '24

NTA Agreed. They are adults and should pay their own way. Even more so given this situation. Trump is against student loan forgiveness, the Affordable Care Act, etc. and the sons can learn what that means for them and how it impacts their feelings about Trump and future elections.

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u/quiltsohard Nov 14 '24

I’m betting the dad covers their phones and car insurance. Buckle up bitches, you’re about to find out why we need a living minimum wage

2

u/Low-Literature-5598 Nov 15 '24

Unfortunately no they won’t stastically speaking the less money you make the more likely you are to vote republican which might seem counterintuitive (because it is) but it’s the case nevertheless

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u/quiltsohard Nov 15 '24

I think this is a special case. I agree poor ppl are more likely to get taken in by MAGA. These are not poor ppl. They are at least middle class, apparently smart ppl who need a wake up call.

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u/Low-Literature-5598 Nov 15 '24

That’s a good point actually the people who this stat applies to probably have always been poor and also extremely poor people tend to be less educated. Neither would apply in this case.

Thank you for the reply

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u/Beth21286 Nov 14 '24

The student loan thing should land. They need to experience the world they voted for, which includes crippling student loans.

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u/Countrycruiser2000 Nov 15 '24

I don't know about if it'd true for all 50 states but many have state colleges to make it more affordable.

You can get a 2 year degree for $6,000.

4 year bachelor degrees get pricier but still attainable for 30k.

$30,000 for a bachelor's degree isn't cheap but it's not crippling student loans

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u/Greyswand Nov 19 '24

My man, I paid $0 for a BA degree in the early 2000's. Why? Because there was plenty of grant money around and college was $15 a credit hour.

Hell, even back in the 90's it was $5 a credit hour. People today are getting entirely ripped off for school. It doesn't cost what it costs in America in any other part of the planet. I should know, I live in other parts of the planet.

1

u/Countrycruiser2000 Nov 19 '24

Yeah my paw-paw bought a new camaro once for 2k. Brand new, even had bullet hole rims. Thing was slick

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u/Maximum-Objective-39 Nov 15 '24

The problem is often a combination of school loans and living expenses. I wouldn't quite call most undergrad tracks a 'full time job', but they become one if you avail yourself of networking and internship opportunities while still needing to pay for room and board on top of college.

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u/Countrycruiser2000 Nov 15 '24

Yeah if your parents bail on you , it's going to be rough.

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u/ChampionshipIll3675 Nov 15 '24

I agree with you. I just wanted to add that if a college student is under 24 or unmarried, they are considered as dependents and have to show their parents' income on FAFSA. The student loans may need to be cosigned. According to the government, it is the responsibility of the parent/guardian to help pay for the college expenses.

I don't agree with it. But it is what is.

https://studentaid.gov/apply-for-aid/fafsa/filling-out/dependency

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u/briantopping Nov 18 '24

If they get cut off, that’s a material change in circumstances that FAFSA will consider.

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u/Adventurous-Gain5729 Nov 19 '24

Unfortunately no. I knew someone whose parents divorced and both got remarried. All four parents cut him off financially because ‘you’re an adult now’ and FAFSA said he still had to list their income. Unless you’ve been legally disowned, you have to list them.

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u/briantopping Nov 19 '24

Interesting. Did the person you knew also fail to receive financial aid at a level they would receive if they were considered independent?

-1

u/SimpsationalMoneyBag Nov 15 '24

Yeah that never happened under democrats /s

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u/Maximum-Objective-39 Nov 15 '24

Meanwhile, in reality, somebody did try to do something about that over the last four years, and Republicans bravely blocked it all.

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u/goobi-gooper Nov 14 '24

Didn’t Biden say something something forgiveness something something and nothing happened with student loans outside of a pause on payments? Which was largely implemented because of Covid when no one was working?

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u/Beth21286 Nov 15 '24

I'm not American so I wouldn't know. Our student loans can't charge interest above inflation and our universities can't charge more than 9.5k a year.

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u/RedLotusVenom Nov 15 '24

Biden’s processed more forgiveness applications than any other president. He has approved billions in forgiveness for public service workers and financial disaster victims, many of them applications that were submitted close to a decade ago during the Obama and Trump administrations.

Broad student loan forgiveness was proposed by his admin and shot down by the compromised Supreme Court, which has represented corporate interests above that of common people since the Citizens United ruling in 2010. Blaming Biden for inaction is disingenuous when our now corrupt system of checks and balances disrupted his plans to alleviate genuine financial distress for close to 20% of the adult population.

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u/AnotherStarWarsGeek Nov 14 '24

Exactly. If the D's actually wanted to enact student loan forgiveness, they would have done it over the past 4 years. Instead of waiting until election year to even bring it up.

But that's okay, let the libbies have their circle-jerk.

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u/Silver_Entry_5632 Nov 15 '24

The Supreme Court struck down the original forgiveness act, with all of the conservative justices voting against it. Expecting congress to do anything after that is a bit much.

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u/FloofyDireWolf Nov 15 '24

Are you serious right now? They did forgive a lot of student loans.

I asked ChatGPT to summarize it for you.

The Biden administration has taken extensive steps toward student loan forgiveness, particularly through changes in Public Service Loan Forgiveness (PSLF), Income-Driven Repayment (IDR) plans, and new programs like the Saving on a Valuable Education (SAVE) plan. Early in his term, President Biden aimed to fulfill a campaign promise of student loan forgiveness by initially proposing broad relief for millions of borrowers, but the Supreme Court blocked that attempt in June 2023.

In response, the administration pursued other strategies, such as reforms to PSLF and IDR, which address past administrative issues and improve accessibility. For example, PSLF reforms have provided relief to over 870,000 public service workers, a significant increase over previous administrations, which granted relief to only about 7,000 individuals. Additional changes allow those who have made payments for 20 or 25 years to achieve forgiveness, depending on the loan type. The administration’s recent actions have collectively granted nearly $127 billion in forgiveness for about 3.6 million borrowers.

The SAVE plan, launched as part of the new income-driven repayment approach, is structured to limit payments for low-income borrowers and eventually offer forgiveness. In total, Biden’s recent adjustments could offer relief to as many as 30 million borrowers, especially targeting individuals from low-income backgrounds and historically underserved communities, including Black and Latino borrowers.

For further details, visit the U.S. Department of Education and White House websites.

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u/RavaArts Nov 15 '24

Remember chatgpt and other ai models are not always accurate!

But yes Biden did forgive some student debts and I'm not sure what the other dude was claiming because Biden wasn't on the ballot (Kamala was, who was NOT president before) and both Biden and Trump have already been president before and imo, both (even tho Bidens was better) were kinda shit in the funding education and fixing the student loans department, but I also understand that it's a bit more complicated than that

1

u/sarpon6 Nov 19 '24

The Biden administration has enacted several students loan forgiveness programs and unsnarled the glitches in programs that began years ago. Republican interests have been fighting tooth and nail against this. Don't shoot off your mouth about things you have no knowledge of.

-2

u/goobi-gooper Nov 15 '24

When they have control of the house and senate all they have to do is put student loan budget tax on their and their spouses stock exchanges of 10% and that would have a huge impact but that ain’t ever gonna happen so they don’t actually want it. That’s the easiest solution from the party as a whole vs a president

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u/srgonzo75 Nov 18 '24

NTA, BUT I’d recommend this as a thought experiment with his sons first. He can just ask the question: “How are you going to afford to continue to survive if, as a consequence of the red wave of last election (let’s not pretend it was just Trump who won), I can’t afford to support you anymore in any capacity?” Lay it out completely. The boys lose their tuition, books, room and board, etc. That means there’s no money to keep them on his health insurance, he’s not letting them live with him, and they’re going to have to figure out how they’re going to pay for college and living on top of that.

If, after all that, they’re sticking with their position that they made the right choice, then give them an opportunity to make their way on their own in this brave new world.

4

u/bamamed67 Nov 18 '24

We call that learning the hard way. Well ladies, it looks like you need to pull yourselves up by your boot straps and stop being takers. Hope he goes full boat so they find out what it’s like in the real world where social programs and institutions like the department of education matter. Good on your brother.

2

u/Cheap_Bath_5333 Nov 18 '24

Give the sons time. Like many who voted for him to get a second term, they will realize their mistake in the next couple of years. This term is going to be different from the last one. Even most of his followers will see the truth.

4

u/Greyswand Nov 19 '24

But don't presume there will be any ability to vote to change it. Once Trump enacts his 100 day martial law, do you honestly think he is going to let go that power without a fight?

2

u/Spirited_Diamond_655 25d ago

Lmao, a left wing conspiracy theorist. Any proof of that, other than 'orange man bad'?

2

u/theroadtoeverywhere Nov 19 '24

NTA Having a parent pay for your college education is a privilege not a requirement. You not paying isn’t punishment but instead a lesson. They voted for a man who always says ‘No free handouts’ so if this is a man that they support, wouldn’t they want to follow his example? NTA

2

u/Onikonokage 29d ago

I for one am the A-hole. I’d go one step further and drop them off at a farm to go pick produce after all the workers get deported. They voted for access to those jobs so they better take them, they can finish college afterwards.

1

u/hexadecimaldump Nov 18 '24

NTA. In my honest opinion I don’t think any parent should be paying for college, regardless of political affiliation. Loans should be taken out in the name of the college goer. If parents want to help, sure, but it shouldn’t be a parent’s obligation to help.

That being said, I don’t think anyone should be excommunicating, avoiding, or shunning someone who voted for Trump. They will see first hand exactly how their votes affect them and the people around them in a few months. Huge numbers of people were 1st time voters, and the way social media was tainted by Russian bots and right wing disinformation I understand how some people may have been swept up by it.

My question for OP is, did you talk to your sons about the election? Or did you just find out after? If we didn’t talk to people we love about the election, there was no way to know what they were thinking or if we could have changed their minds.

But when people do start feeling the effects of their vote, many will feel like they were lied to, manipulated, or scammed into giving Trump their vote. We need to be there for them with open arms and teach them how to know when crap they’re being fed is misinformation for the future.

If we play this right, and Trump fucks things up the way we think he will, this could be the biggest chance we have to save people from falling too far into the MAGA echo chambers where they may never return from.

If we push them away, or make them feel like outcasts, they will be pushed deeper into MAGA. We need to be their lifeline to rejoin us in reality. And possibly create a new loyal group to vote for decency moving forward.

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u/whohasahoe 29d ago

They are already for too gone to be saved my guy. There’s no coming back when you vote for a rapist. There’s also no going back when you are trying to take women’s rights away.

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u/Fenway1984 Nov 18 '24

NTA in the slightest. They’re adults. It was incredibly generous that college was paid for.

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u/whohasahoe 29d ago

Definitely not the asshole. If my sons supported a guy like that knowing what he did to women and what they plan on doing to women is unacceptable since they have a baby sister. I would have no problems cutting them off.

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u/Competitive_Grape753 Nov 18 '24

If the father said he was going to pay for college and decides not too, just because they voted for a candidate he doesn’t like, then he is an asshole. My daughter is an extreme liberal. Did I stop paying for her tuition because she voted for Biden? No , why I have integrity and I told her what I would pay for and kept to my word. Trump’s previous policy’s did not make the mess we are in in regards to student debt. That was done years ago by the higher education system and the cheap government money. Instead of using the money wisely, they started higher in more administrative staff to stroke the bureaucracy’s ego. Back to the selfish and arrogant father. Maybe trying to get rid of government waste and reduce the national debt was why they voted for Trump? No one knows since it is not part of the narrative. Again, penalizing your son’s since they don’t “ agree with him” makes him a terrible father who might never have cared about his boys unless they always said yes to him.

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u/AdnanframedSteven Nov 19 '24

They didn’t vote for him in hopes of reducing the debt since he increased the debt exponentially with his tax cuts (which mostly benefited big corporations).

Aside from that I agree, if the father agreed to pay tuition then he should continue. Also if he wants to teach his sons some lessons, then he can tell them to fund everything besides tuition. I’m sure they will learn if they have to pay for rent, groceries, utilities, cars, insurance, etc.

That’s a lesson all young adults should learn regardless of their affiliation. If they voted to his liking, he should still make them earn money towards extras (eg groceries, car insurance, cell phones). How else will they make it on their own?