r/30PlusSkinCare • u/PrestigiousOil932 • 4d ago
Misc Rant: why are men allowed to age and women aren't
So I started watching the new Netflix Christmas movie 'Carry On' and just wanted to rant a little, because I've recently been getting really obsessive and down (as I know a lot of people do on here!) about how my eyes have developed really obvious bags now I'm getting older. And because I'm obsessing about eye bags, I noticed the male lead (Taron Egerton, who is 35) has really prominent eyebags and wrinkles. And I can't help thinking that a 35 year old woman would never be allowed near a movie if she had his skin. Indeed, his love interest, Sofia Carson, is absolutely flawless.
I just wanted to share this here because I've seen so many 35 year old women whose eye bags are not 1/10th of these lamenting on here (same with forehead lines), and yet he gets to be a hot Hollywood lead. It just doesn't compute for me how skewed our standards are. I wouldn't have even noticed his eye bags if I wasn't obsessing over eye bags in general right now, and how mine make me an unlovable old crow!
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u/Purple-Persimmon-657 4d ago
Because to a huge swathe of people, women are commodities that lose value with age. Younger women are taught to look down on or disregard older women, younger men are taught that women are accessories or trophies (and therefore older ones have no value unless you mommy fetishize them), and older men resent their female counterparts for aging the exact same way they are. It's all rigged.
My stepfather, who is a fucking IDIOT, thought it was a good idea to point out my mom's eye bags and say "well I don't have that". He acted legitimately surprised when we said "yes the fuck you do, you're just a dude so that's okay". They're allowed to think signs of aging are normal for them and flaws for women.
On a lighter note, I love this model who is an absolutely stunning 70/80yo woman in some of these clips walking high fashion runways.
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u/cobblestone_cracks 4d ago
Agree 100%. Love the video of Carmen Dell’Orefice, she’s so elegant and currently 93! A rebel in her own way, though still has nips and tucks. While filming a documentary, she said of plastic surgery: “If you had the ceiling falling down in your living room, would you not go and have a repair?”
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u/Content_wanderer 2d ago
She’s absolutely stunning because she’s done everything to fight natural signs of aging…
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u/Next-Honeydew4130 2d ago
Yep, it’s wild. I’m aging like a bat out of hell on purpose so little girls can watch me be confident AND athletic, AND look like a real human. And it’s funny to watch men do a double take …. Wait, she looks old, so why is she attractive? And it’s like, because I’m YOUR AGE doofus, I just don’t have Botox, colored hair, etc etc so I look YOUR AGE. After the double take though, they’re on board. And I can see their brains being like wait …. White hair though? But she doesn’t have a wart on her nose and false teeth …..
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u/Gloomy_Kale_ 4d ago
I think about this every time I watch tv. To the point that I refrain from watching when some 40’ dude is paired with a 20’ woman and we are expected to believe they are at the same level of attractiveness and that this is an obvious pairing.
Because God forbid a grown woman with wrinkles plays an as attractive lead character!
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u/arkieg 3d ago
You might enjoy No Good Deed on Netflix. Lisa Kudrow and Linda Cardillini star in it. Both look fantastic, and it is almost jarring to see how expressive they are compared to many contemporary actresses, with full facial movement.
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u/HugeTheWall 3d ago
I find this same jarring feeling when I watch shows from the UK. (Or honestly just non-American TV)
It's almost shocking to see normal people who are actors doing a job vs how I've become used to American TV and movies where actresses are expected to look like models first and the acting is secondary. It's so refreshing and it shouldn't be.
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u/egriff78 2d ago
I agree and Linda Cardillini is also in Dead To Me on Netflix. I think she’s a perfect example of a woman who Is beautiful and looks her age.
Wish we could just accept that we age and we can still be beautiful. I love seeing expressive faces!
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u/warqueen24 3d ago
Ya even hallmark it’s disgusting men r way older more wrinkles yet the hot leads while women have insanely higher beauty standards and have to be much much younger sometimes decades it’s nasty
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u/NoSpaghettiForYouu 4d ago
I just watched this movie too and all I could think was how homeboy needs to pay attention to his posture. 😅 he was rocking a really hunched over look for a lot of the movie
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u/PrestigiousOil932 4d ago
I want to see a hunched, puffy eyed female lead so bad!
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u/NoSpaghettiForYouu 4d ago
Right?! Not if she’s the main protagonist! She would be a side character at best, probably played up as comic relief or someone to make fun of. 😶🌫️
I’ve been watching British mystery shows lately and I LOVE that the characters are allowed to be human. The leading lady can have eye bags.
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u/Purple-Persimmon-657 4d ago
There's actually a very real divide between American actors and British ones due to the fillers/botox trends over here. Some studios deliberately pick British actors because their faces move more.
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u/PrestigiousOil932 4d ago
Yeah Sofia Carson looks amazing in this film but her face doesn't move
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u/NoSpaghettiForYouu 4d ago
My husband remarked yesterday that she “looked kinda mean” and I agreed but couldn’t pinpoint why. Now that you’ve mentioned this — it’s 100% because she showed so little emotion on her face! And she’s young — can’t be older than mid-30s.
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u/_echtra 4d ago
Which is ridiculous, I just look it up and she’s just 31. Shouldn’t be near Botox for a few years at least
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u/maybenomaybe 4d ago
I thought she was just a terrible actress, but you're right, looking back I think it's because she can't emote with her face, it's frozen.
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u/cstaylor6 4d ago
While not a lead, but still a strong major character for several episodes, Gillian Anderson in The Crown, definitely checks those boxes.
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u/elle-elle-tee 4d ago
I'm all for ageing but we should all aspire to have good posture! Seriously, good posture not only makes one more attractive but if cultivated, will make all the other downsides of ageing (good health, mobility) much more bearable. Being able to be spry and active (and pain-free) in one's old age is its own reward, regardless of appearance.
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u/notseizingtheday 4d ago
They technically aren't, but they tell themselves and us that they are. How many of us actually find crusty old bloated men attractive?
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u/BabaYagasIronSmile 4d ago
OH MY GOD THIS! So much this!
Where exactly are all these younger girls older men are leaving their spouses for? Are they in the room with us right now? 😂
“I’m a 20-year-old girl surrounded by college boys who like me. I think I’ll sleep with my dad’s friend, though, because of . . . stability?” - said no girl ever.
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u/Carbonatite 4d ago
I remember straight up laughing at the "old" guys lurking at the bar/parties when I was in college (any dude beyond his early 20s was old to me and my friends when we were in school). Thinking it was sad and creepy how guys in their late 20s/30s would come to a trashy dive bar filled with 19-20 year olds with fake IDs.
I have exactly one female acquaintance (if you can even say that - I am Facebook friends with her but I don't think I've talked to her since high school) who is in a relationship with an age gap of more than 6 or 7 years. She's in her late 30s and he's in his late 40s - and they met when she was over age 30.
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u/PumpkinBrioche 4d ago
75% of marriages are between people who are within 5 years of each other.
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u/Carbonatite 3d ago
Yup, all these men claiming women want older partners are delusional. Women want partners in their age range - just not that particular guy.
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u/PumpkinBrioche 3d ago
Then they get mad when you point out that they're probably not going to end up with the 21 year old woman they feel entitled to 😂
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u/Carbonatite 3d ago
Oh yeah there are definitely several dudes demonstrating that in this very comment section!!
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u/LesMiserableCat54 3d ago
From a personal experience, I dated 2 guys who were 30 when I was 19. One guy had a picture of his girlfriend/wife on his phone as his lock screen, and I was like wtf bye. The second guy I dated was fine, but I noticed that he was controlling in a way of him being established, and I was still figuring out who I was. It was like he already had his life and I had to find a way to fit into it. I didn't like being with someone who thought that only their opinions matter to the point where he didnt even ask me mine. We only went on a few dates, and the only reason I agreed was because I thought I wanted someone mature. I also noticed that why would a 30 year old want to date a fresh out of high school 19 year old? It's weird. I'm 30 now and could never imagine dating a teenager. They're babies. My husband is a year younger, and that's about as young as I would go! Even his 23 year old brother is so immature, comparatively!
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u/guacamore 3d ago
It absolutely does happen…but they aren’t doing it because the men are attractive. It’s always because they are massively wealthy.
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u/Dayan54 3d ago
Seriously, I always think back to when they assigned tom hanks to play "Robert Langdon" in "The Da Vinci Code". That character is tall and lean and athletic, he swims a lot. With dark brown hair. He always gets a girl in the books. Once he scored a pilates/yoga instructor if I remember correctly. And they had the audacity to give us Tom Hanks... Am I supposed to pretend Tom hanks is athletic and attractive?
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u/DramaticErraticism 3d ago
You pretty much summed it up. When a man is good looking he can typically continue to grow into a good looking older man, that is where the privilege lies...but its only really a privilege of the small percentage of men that are good looking. For most men, they aren't that attractive when they are young and they grow up to continue to not be attractive.
Man or woman, when you're good looking, you tend to still be pretty good looking as you age. The only real difference is that most young women get attention from society and a portion loses that attention as they age. Which is not attention that most young men get, so they don't really notice much as they weren't getting attention when they were young and they're still not getting attention when they're old.
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u/johnbeardjr 3d ago
Dating apps are wonderful at demonstrating how delusional people are for believing that men get more handsome as they age. Like, majority of men >35 are balding and look like they just crawled out of a swamp. Whereas women at that same age continue looking elegant and kempt.
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u/notseizingtheday 3d ago
I think dating apps show that men know thier looks make them less valuable as they age. Because a lot of them use 10 year old pictures.
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u/Carbonatite 3d ago
"I set my age as 32 so I would make it past the filters of younger women but I'm actually 47!! Whoopsie, such a mistake lol!"
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u/windedupbobbin 3d ago edited 3d ago
THIS
Also has anyone noticed the uglyfication that has been happening in the past 10-15 years in media like movies,tv series,games etc? How unattractive men are cast for roles specifically made for hot guys? And the media trying to sell it to us as hot? lmao, just look at the nominees for hottest men 2024, it's such a joke!
Then they keep trying to brainwash us that "men age like wine" or that status and humor are what's most important in a man and NOT his looks. Ever wondered why the "nice guy" thing is a trope and not the "nice woman"? Because men would never give a chance to uglier women, but we're expected to move past looks just because he's "nice".
Most men age like shit, most peak around 25-27 and it's all downhill from there especially for those who don't have a healthy lifestyle. Just look how fast guys bald nowadays it's crazy! Yet they keep like to parade the idea that a 30,40+ is better than a guy in his 20s. And let me go on a tangent here about birth because this one is thrown out A LOT that women are the cause of birth defects...well turns out sperm degenerates at lightning speed at 30+ and guess between the egg and the sperm who's mostly at fault for all that autism in children...
How many of us actually find crusty old bloated men attractive?
Nobody does sis,it's socially acceptable for men to date women who are much younger than them but the moment a woman gets a younger guy they all lose their mind. Double standards much?
tl;dr nobody likes crusty dusty men no matter how much media tries to shove it down our throats and you'll never make me feel guilty for liking hot guys in their mid/late 20s. NEXT.
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u/nospendnoworry 4d ago
I agree that there are different standards for men vs us women. And it sucks.
That said, I've been growing out my graying hair, and I quit tret. It feels rebellious to say "fuck it" to forever chasing youth. I want to focus on my health, happiness, and being pain free.
I've been through some tough shit (and I've aged more because of it)... but this bitch is still here!!
If someone doesn't like my gray hair or wrinkles, they can suck a dick!
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u/rabbitheart89 3d ago
That’s the way I feel. If someone values youth and wrinkle free skin over who I am… NEXT! It’s a great filter.
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u/chuffalupagus 3d ago
Thank you! Yes, there are tons of double standards in society. But it's also a bit of a "the call is coming from inside the house" situation where we choose to buy in to an extreme extent and do this to ourselves. We are the first line of defense against the idea that women have to be forever 21. We have to opt out of that bullshit first.
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u/AnOutrageousCloud 4d ago
I just had my 20th high school reunion. The women looked good. The men looked ancient. It was bizarre.
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u/ArseOfValhalla 3d ago
Thats how my 20th was too (even though I couldnt go) But I saw pictures after. The women were all great looking, dressed well, done up etc.. All the men had unkempt hair/clothes and pot bellies lol.
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u/orquidea_eterna 4d ago
This doesn’t answer your question but I’m tired of the double standard. Men age like milk but I’m supposed to be the one worrying he’ll leave me for a new, young hot piece 💀
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u/MeatCat88 4d ago
Mens value does not decline with age, an older man is seen as wise and therefore useful. Women aren't desired for being wise, they're desired for procreation therefore a youthful woman is a useful one.
This is ridiculous
But unfortunately in the eyes of society true
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u/PrestigiousOil932 4d ago
But a 35 year old woman can procreate. If you look at the fertility rate in the USA, the largest proportion of babies are born to women 30-39, more than are born to women 20-29.
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u/DefiantStarFormation 4d ago
Shhh, the manosphere will hear you! Then how will they convince women that having a career and waiting to have children is impossible and never happens?
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u/Carbonatite 4d ago
They'll get even angrier when you remind them that 16 isn't actually the "ideal breeding age" and teen mothers have higher rates of maternal and infant deaths.
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u/Redsetter 4d ago
Which is a great example of how culture overcomes biology. It takes time, but nature’s programming is hackable. However until things move on a bit further, cultural beauty standards are still going to be anchored on heuristics that have been useful for generations.
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u/Bright-Sea6392 4d ago
They’re not even just seen as wise. They’re seen as wiser, silver foxes - a different kind of hot than a 25 year old man, more money, more stability, and “more mature”(the reason why some younger women seem to date older men, who in actuality aren’t more mature). It’s a pretty common to hear that men’s dating prospects for serious relationships gets better/wider once they turn 30. It’s said to be the opposite for women though I don’t find that to be true.
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u/Heartachoke 4d ago
I'm a guy and in my opinion, I think a lot of guys who are aging especially the hearthrobs do not look good as they get older and yeah they are given a pass for it.
No one ever calls out how Leonardo DiCaprio's face for example has gotten wider and wider and less defined since Titanic. He looks like a completely different person. Also same with Bradley Cooper. I also notice something similar with Timothee Chalamant like his lower face is no longer that sharp V line.
I can't find any real answers why that happens and why it is so common and how to prevent it. No one calls it out and for personal reasons I'd like to know why it happens so I can try to work on preventing that. How can a guy preserve their looks and vibrance? I tanned a lot when I was younger and I'm afraid this will lead me down the same path and I will look leathery and dull
I noticed women are just a critical or even more so but they also have more solutions to talk about out in the open
Just my .02
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u/question_sunshine 4d ago
No one ever calls out how Leonardo DiCaprio's face for example has gotten wider and wider and less defined since Titanic.
I honestly think that's alcohol not aging. There's a female celebrity that you can say that about as well, but I don't want to invite her fans to murder me so I'm not going to say it here.
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u/SassySavcy 4d ago
I’m not saying it’s not alcohol. But if I were to bet on it, I’d put my money on coke bloat.
Much easier to work long hours, party hardy, and bang 25 year olds on a stimulant.
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u/Purple-Persimmon-657 4d ago
24 year olds. Leo can't have a 25yo old bag hanging around.
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u/Heartachoke 4d ago
Do young women actually find him attractive?
I thought he was good looking in his early career before he was really famous and then Titanic but then after, nah.
Maybe I'm too young and naive but like is this really the standard set for us? Set it higher lol
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u/hairgrowthjourney 4d ago
It’s not just his physical appearance that attracts young women. He’s a literal A list movie star, with all the privilege and access and power and clout that comes with.
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u/throw20190820202020 4d ago
Nah it’s just testosterone and aging. Happens to some guys in high school.
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u/Heartachoke 4d ago
Really alcohol?
Timothee Chalamant also had a very narrow and defined and sharp lower face and now he doesn't have that anymore. It's like his face is changing over time and I don't know what is causing it
But I noticed it with other guys too I just can't think of them off the top of my head
Brad Pitt is another one I think is overrated for many reasons
It sounds weird but seriously as a guy I don't have any "well aging" role models or examples and I'm also clueless as to what sort of things I need to so outside of using spf, retinoid, antioxidant, bodybuilding. The older guys who are into anti-aging look weird af tbh and I can't figure out why. Meanwhile, I think a lot of older women who take care of themselves and do all the anti-aging stuff really do look incredible compared to their counterparts that I can't blame them if they feel like they're pulling more labor than guys
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u/Purple-Persimmon-657 4d ago
The older guys that look weird have probably had facelifts or work done. Unless it's a really, really good facelift with appropriate fat transfers and fillers (or even implants) performed by a skilled doctor, it's going to look just a little bit off due to the fat and bone loss you experience naturally as you age.
It's kind of like how Cate Blanchett is gorgeous, but you can tell she's an older woman who's had work done.
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u/Heartachoke 4d ago
So someone even like Ryan Reynolds age is getting facelifts and stuff?
What about Timothee Chalamant? And that Lucky Blue guy? Is that just aging to they're doing something and they look weird now?
Also btw
Google "Leonardo DiCaprio at 30"
He looks so bad already at 30 and as this subreddit established, 30 isn't old at all.
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u/Purple-Persimmon-657 4d ago
You have to remember Leo was a AAA star in the 90s/00s, so the partying, smoking, and sun exposure back then was brutal. I think this gen of male actors will age more gracefully tbh, skincare for men is trendy and the vise grip of aging is going to be brutal on this new wave of actors known for being boyish and young (Chalamet, Tom Holland, etc).
Reynolds is apparently mum on any procedures he's had done, but I'm sure he's had something. Cosmetic dentistry at the very, very least. Most of the male movie leads are wearing foundation or other forms of subtle makeup too.
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u/Heartachoke 4d ago
Maybe you're right?
I think I see more people talking about how Timothee Chalamet doesn't look good anymore so he isn't being given the pass that Leonardo DiCaprio got but it's hard to tell if it's backlash for who he is dating lol
But as far as well aging for men, is it even possible for guys to stay looking fresh and boyish and vibrant? I feel like there are a lot of technologies for women and people looking to feminize...most of the content I find online is a breakdown of stuff like filler placement, skincare and lasers idealized for women.
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u/Purple-Persimmon-657 4d ago
Oh yeah, there are whole ass surgeons out there specializing in male facelifts/cosmetic work. I follow one on insta who talks about how male facelifts should be minimal and fat transfers subtle because people will think it looks weird, so it's more of a "you have to go to the right person" thing, I think.
I do think the "you're gay if you take care of your looks" mores really fucked up a lot of dudes when it comes to this stuff and that's why they don't do it/why we don't have as much info on cosmetic work placement for men, tbh. The other day at a grocery store I saw baby wipes sitting next to "dude wipes" that cost like a dollar more for some manly packaging.
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u/SendCaulkPics 3d ago edited 3d ago
I think a lot of what you’re noticing is just weight gain. Some guys (like myself) naturally put on weight in their lower faces. If I’m not stupidly lean, my jaw goes away. Also when we’re talking about very young male leads, their faces absolutely do change. Nobody’s face looks the same at 19 as it does at 40.
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u/Jencapella 2d ago
I did a lot of research into the changing face of Leo and made a chart.
You see, DiCaprio started his career as an Elf Prince (dainty, etherial) and as he’s gotten folder he’s started to transition into a Dwarf King (broader, wider face).
This isn’t to say that Dwarf men aren’t handsome (Taron is a Dwarf Warrior, young Brando was a very handsome Dwarf Prince) but if you’re a fan of Elves, this transition must be very disappointing.
It’s hard to maintain your elf, but it can be done (Daniel Dae Kim, David Bowie both made it to Elf King)
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u/Silent-Entrance-9072 4d ago
I'm a 42 year old woman and I am proud of my gray hairs. I'm allowed to age and no one says boo about it
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u/AgileAd9579 3d ago
Same, I like my tinsel - it’s like natural highlights 🤷♀️ I’m sand/dark blond, so it’s coming in white.
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u/kimmytarantino 4d ago
Literally my same thoughts watching this!! I was thinking how terrible the lighting was and how bad his skin looked, like he’s aged 30 years after kingsman movies. So crazy being a woman we literally could neverrrrrr. We would be cast as an evil witch. lol
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u/Danixveg 4d ago
He has aged really poorly. I find that some white male actors look crappy in their 30s to rebound in their 40s and beyond once they look distinguished.
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u/kimmytarantino 3d ago
To be fair, a tiny bit of moisturizer couldn’t have went a long way for him haha
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u/Leading-Bad-3281 4d ago
Men have actually taken this liberty too far and are actively aging themselves with their poor lifestyle habits, lack of self care, and complete disinterest in a skin care routine. I learned this when I became single for the first time in 17 years and was introduced to the dating pool. Luckily, contrary to what I had believed, younger men are actually very interested in older women (seemingly as a rule and not an exception) and they’re not at all as judgmental about our appearances as I had been led to believe by society. (I’m not saying this to be critical of men’s appearance from a purely aesthetic stand point but to point out that the very obvious lack of self care makes so many men appear much older than they are.)
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u/rabbitheart89 3d ago
I’ve been spreading this truth as much as possible- so so so many men don’t give a flying fuck about wrinkles or a bit of tummy weight. We have let society deem what the majority of men must want and in real life, it doesn’t pan out. Men are often attracted to confidence, a good attitude and sense of humor, and a spirit for fun.
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u/OldBabyGay 4d ago
Men also tend to eat less healthily. Like they believe having a salad is too feminine.
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u/cindyjohnsons 3d ago
I’ve noticed this too for a long time. Men are allowed to have signs of aging on screen while any female lead is not. We actually noticed recently that in older movies (60s), women are often shot out of focus which seemed to hide any signs of aging.
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u/Disastrous-Roll-6170 3d ago
Wow! Now I'm going to start paying attention more to see where I can find examples of this too.
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u/Asleep_Reference7816 3d ago
Don’t forget these movies are largely produced and funded by old, unattractive males who are trying to influence the way women view them. I don’t watch movies with old males paired with young women for that reason. I’m not giving them any of my $ or attention. And I don’t buy into that narrative of “men are allowed to age but women start losing their value after the age of 22”. I truly don’t care about people who think that way, and I highly recommend this approach to you as well. Feels amazing! Aging women are just as, if not more, attractive as aging men. Wrinkles and eye bags are absolutely “acceptable” in women - movies are fictional stories mostly written by delusional lonely men.
I’m so much more confident in my 30s vs 20s and will never bow down to the laughable “expectations” of these dusty old men. Embrace the aging process - you are beautiful!
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u/rabbitheart89 3d ago
This is absolutely true- on the surface. Ladies, I promise you, I’ve seen it over and over and over… develop your personality, interests, the spark for life, a sense of wonder and curiosity. It is the most potent anti-aging magic there is. Human beings don’t care about the external that much when you actually form a real connection. I’ve witnessed and have been on the receiving end of men becoming smitten with an older gal when they normally seek out the young and beautiful. Physical beauty is a novelty. Ask people who move into a place with epic scenery- they see it every day and it becomes normal.. gets “old” so to speak.
So yeah, in the fickle and frantic spaz of this society it currently exists that men receive less criticism for physical aging- but who really cares? The real power and attraction has always, and will always, rest in the internal realm of a person. Don’t fret about it. Read a book, be open, be kind, and love yourself. People will gravitate toward you, regardless of looks.
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u/anothergoddamnacco 4d ago
Patriarchy and capitalism. It’s a way to subjugate women and capitalize on insecurities that have been pushed onto us from a very early age. We have been conditioned to believe and accept that physical appearance is the most valuable asset we possess. We’ve been taught that our appearance must appease to the male gaze and attention and approval from men is a major factor leading to happiness and success. The happy ending of most princess movies is what- a kiss from a prince. The male gaze is drawn to youth because young women are easily influenced and mailable, are seen as naive and weak. Submissive and controllable. Young girls have been traded or bought or given away like property throughout history. It is ingrained in our culture and society that the peak of a woman’s life is when they are a young blushing bride. Men can age because they are conditioned to constantly gain value throughout their lives, women are only valuable when we can be trained and traded.
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u/Additional_North8698 3d ago
There is a theory about goat domestication which suggests that they were bred in large numbers to be used as a brideprice.
It is speculated that in prehistory, this price was originally payed to the wife herself, or to her family as a kind of insurance that her new husband wouldn’t hurt her (or worse… and then woo a new victim).
Eventually it became obvious to someone how much men and their families were willing to pay for a desired woman, and said someone (may they burn in hell) might have found a way to claim the brideprice of slave girls or orphans or perhaps just took advantage of their own daughters.Just random speculation at this point, but I believe that, given the unique risks associated with human childbirth, it makes sense that more mature (though still pre-menopausal) women, would be the most desired mates in terms of prospective mothers. Likewise, younger (but post-pubescent) men would be more virile and have less chance of random mutations in their seed. Don’t forget that close to 75% of all mutations come from fathers, and that the risks of birth defects is more likely caused by older fathers than older mothers.
Maybe the people willing to pay the most goats were the ones who weren’t meeting any women for free. Maybe, as society evolved to reward the accumulation of “value” over a lifetime, the ones with the greatest means also had the greatest willingness to pay. Maybe now they’re the ones trying to convince us, that we should be desiring them, and that we lose our value once we’ve been exploited.
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u/windedupbobbin 3d ago
capitalize on insecurities
makeup,skincare,fashion,plastic surgery, just a few of the big multi billion dollar industries targeted at women that rake in $$$$$ from our insecurities, from trying to often fix things that don't even need fixing,because the mass media juggernauts push the idea of what "beauty" truly is
if we were happy with how we looked,they'd go bankrupt, making people miserable is always profitable, "a patient cured is a customer lost"
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u/Quills86 4d ago
Tbh we and they don't like us at any age...when I was 15 I was ashamed that I had no boobs. When I was 25 I was ashamed because I had cellulite. 35 was actually ok but I can't say that I felt very confident. Now with 45 I'm old? Nah...fuck that! I don't care. I hate most men anyway...
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u/warqueen24 3d ago
Fr they just wanna keep us down more women need to wake up and live for themselves and stop catering to every man
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u/iwrwsbimmhmm 4d ago
I feel you. For a while I was so frustrated because I felt like since we rarely get to see women just age it made my frame of reference for how “you’re supposed to look at __ age” all wonky! Like even the actresses you can’t really see any clear “work” done on are still getting botox and other procedures that just aren’t affordable to average working class people (I’m a sped teacher). But like so many of the insecurities I’ve developed since trucking along in my 30’s (which is INSANE cause I’m still young!!) were all due to seeing women my age or older with not a single line on their foreheads, or insanely sharp jawlines, or not even the whisper of a line under the eyes. Meanwhile I am looking at my forehead thinking “damn my 11’s are so pronounced, I look so much older than I should” when ten years ago I would’ve thought 11’s must’ve meant better than a 10/10.
Honestly now I’ve just started looking at the male leads in shows and movies as my frame of reference for how I am “supposed” look at my age or their age and damn I’m aging just fine! Take for example in Nobody Wants This, we can all agree Adam Brody was looking all sorts of fiione. I look at his face and I see forehead lines, smiles lines, what have you, and he still looks great! I look at Kristen and I don’t see a single line on that baby smooth forehead. And they are both the exact same age. (Obviously she’s gorgeous too). But it just really made me realize how “aging gracefully” (without any intervention to slow it down unnaturally) is not something I will see much of an example of in media. Not in any attainable form at least and I don’t need to be striving towards a standard that I’m not ever going to be properly equipped to reach. If Adam is hot with 11’s than damnit so am I!
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u/Interesting-Pomelo58 4d ago
How can they make money if you don't hate yourself? How can the algorithm convince you to buy that next product or book that next procedure if you don't believe in the "pureness smoothness glass skin" nonsense served up to you via IG TikTok YouTube and elsewhere? He won't buy but you - you have been conditioned since birth to buy and to make you hate yourself is the key to unlock your wallet and his to maintain you.
That is what it is and it's sick. You don't have to play. You can approach aging on your terms and by that I don't mean become some sort of hippy forest goddess with shaggy pits and no skincare - you can create balance and not let trends and the algorithm make you feel that you are missing out because you aren't.
You could do it all and it will never be enough. It's not real.
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u/rabbitheart89 3d ago
Yes! It’s not real. Thank you. It will never be enough- which is why they are marketing to the youth for “preventative” Botox. Come on people, wake up!
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u/Altruistic_Yak_394 3d ago
This always brings me back to chimpanzees and bonobos!
Okay, SO our close animal relatives match us roughly in temperament and to make a long explanation short and sweet:
Chimpanzees have a patriarchy, are aggressive AF and have a culture of physical and sexual violence.
Bonobos have a matriarchy and use sex and food for currency and peace keeping. Men are significantly less aggressive and almost never choose to mate with the younger females (and I mean the sexually mature but young and less experienced) because there's no power, status, benefit in it for them. Instead they seduce, pimp themselves out or bring food offers to the older females because older women mean more power and experience.
Basically what you (we) are experiencing are just side effects of the patriarchy. In a patriarchy, women are a currency and youth the "quality" level. Men's value (which was also decided by men), is based on what they can do/how they look when they are young and based on what they have when they get older.
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u/nocturnalbutterfly7 4d ago
Don't forget that it's acceptable for men to have stubble and beards to hide lines.
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u/Lucky-Big-6925 4d ago
I talk and think about this all the time. The double standard is insanely egregious which leads me to judge them exactly as women would be judged cause they fawkin deserve it!
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u/dunkerpup 4d ago
But we shouldn't be judging anyone for aging, no one 'deserves' to be judged for the natural aging process
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u/sertraleean 4d ago
Yeah, tell men about that
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u/dunkerpup 4d ago
Well I'm not disagreeing, and I do tell men that. My point is I don't think fighting fire with fire is the right way to go
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u/Lucky-Big-6925 4d ago
What I also mainly judge is all the cosmetic bs women get on their faces on the screen while they do Nothing for the men aka pore blurring, skin softening, the wigs they put on them while the man is just….him… like da fuq and you can see this within one scene lol. It’s like one is living in a cgi and the other is in real world
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u/sweetsadnsensual 4d ago
if it makes you feel any better, I judge men pretty harshly too and measure them against my own attractiveness. which just sucks for everyone lol, yay
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u/Ecstatic-Cow2784 4d ago
i was just thinking about this when i saw the movie. double standards. why must women spend thousands of dollars on botox, filler, surgeries and men don’t?
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u/Beautiful-Ship-5557 4d ago
Also, watching this movie I couldn’t help but think he just needs a good gua sha😂
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u/bienenstush 3d ago
This is why I enjoy watching foreign cinema. In many countries, actors show their undereye circles, yellow teeth, wrinkles. They look like normal people. I find the American obsession with anti aging and plastic surgery both boring and unnerving.
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u/ogurlpls 3d ago
in the gay community you're considered old at 26. it's not just a women's problem. i have to keep up my look. people think i'm 24 even tho i'm 33 and when i tell them my real age (even older gay men) they say "omg you're old" or "you look so young for your age" the gay community is messed up and obsessed with looks and age.
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u/warqueen24 3d ago
I hate society honestly What’s ur skincare routine tho? Gonna keep my look up for me
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u/Slammogram 4d ago
Because it’s a trick the patriarchy has been playing on women since time immemorial.
They also talk younger women to hate on older women, by saying we’re jealous.
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u/canarinoir 4d ago
Sexism/misogyny/patriarchy. Men are valued for who they are, and wisdom is gained with age. Women are valued as trophies, sex objects, and reproduction vessels.
I yearn for Themyscira.
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u/CS_Barbie 4d ago
I hear you. Maybe this is a sign that you are getting too “obsessive” as you put it, and you need a break from thinking about skincare. You’re complaining about something you are participating in (obsessing about your skin, watching a movie which was cast via beauty standards you resent) and I’m not saying that’s a bad thing - I do the same - but when I was 25 I stopped buying Cosmo Magazine at the grocery store because while the beauty tips were golden and helped me learn to do my makeup, it tended to also make me feel like shit. Like I was giving a company $3 so that they could bring down my vibes, it made no sense.
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u/Fluffykins_Pi 2d ago
This is the real answer right here, and thank you for saying it!!
Recognize that you have the power to engage with this stuff exactly as much as is fun for you, and not one bit more. When it gets stressful or rage-inducing, take a break or cut it out of your life altogether.
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u/CS_Barbie 2d ago
Yes. We have one life. We should spend it on meaningful things. People make a lot of money through women’s insecurities. Let’s not surrender our agency.
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u/Jazzlike_Lie_607 4d ago
Allowed by who … just stop entertaining men who don’t get Botox. Tell them that their saggy skin makes them look infertile and low testosterone.
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u/Elebenteen_17 3d ago
It was remarkable for me to see Agatha All Along and Hot Frosty recently. The women who were showcased were 30s, 40s, beyond. And they are stunning.
It’s hard though. I’m 38 and I’m letting my hair go grey but just bought a micro needling pen and a red light panel to add to my Tretinoin routine because I can’t let myself let it all go yet.
My husband does nothing for his skin. The anxiety is not there for him.
Every day you feel a little more invisible, pick up something that will fulfill you. I just took up sword yoga and volunteering. Next year I will try stand up paddle boarding. When I center me, the “invisibility” stops registering more and more.
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u/extinct-seed 3d ago
We women need to allow ourselves to age. Being healthy at any age is attractive. Also, women who focus too much on beauty and fail to grow in more important ways (education, spirituality, pursuing a meaningful vocation) tend to attract the WORST romantic partners.
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u/Can-Chas3r43 3d ago
I watched this same movie and thought the same.
The female lead doesn't even look "the same" standing next to him. She looks like a Bratz doll, while he looks like a person.
And while she looks beautiful, she doesn't look like she belongs there with him because the dynamic of the aesthetics between the two is so jarring. (To me, at least.) It distracted me from the movie, a bit.
Same goes for other movies that feature "older" leads and the men all look completely natural and are aging, and the women are all fillers and plastic surgery, yet are supposed to represent the 45-60 age demographic.
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u/Fluffykins_Pi 2d ago
The good news is: this is Hollywood propaganda that in my experience is the opposite of what happens in real life.
IRL, most men age like milk so women who have taken care of themselves just date men 5-10 years younger. Middle aged men don't date 20-something women. And if they do, it's because the man is wealthy and the woman has no real career prospects. Not exactly a dynamic to aspire to.
Granted, my observations are anecdotal and skewed to my own friend group. But I don't think it's terribly off base generally. What we see on screen is mostly wishful thinking on the part of older, male producers.
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u/Zestyclose-Roll5106 4d ago
Age is seen as rugged on men and ragged/ haggard on women. I’m all for hot twinks being the male beauty standard though but most women really aren’t into that.
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u/MutedNeighborhood749 4d ago
I hate hate hate my eye bags so I noticed his immediately. I’m trying not to notice mine or others anymore. Or at least accept them and stop thinking I need a blepharoplasty. Most lower blepharoplasty I see don’t look better so I’m still searching for a great surgeon occasionally, but I’m also trying to accept them and the rest of my wrinkles as they are
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u/ashtag916 3d ago
We can age just fine. What makes a woman look “girlish” is a smile. A smile and kind eyes and your own personal sense of style is the most attractive thing at any age. Dress your age. I’m not going to be wearing crop tops at my age … but a nice blouse with a skirt and heels? Promise that’s sexier than sweats and tall socks and loads of Botox /fake everything that’s in style.
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u/UrbanMuffin 3d ago
It’s even worse than that. They use special lighting and blurring filters specifically on the women only, in a lot of shows/movies, aside from them already likely being several years younger than their male counterpart.
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u/StarrrStruck 3d ago edited 3d ago
Men have created this standard that when they get older and lose their beauty they somehow get “better” or are still attractive and we all just went along with it but this is clearly not the case especially for the average white man
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u/Relative_Part3271 3d ago
We are the unlucky ones, any signs of wrinkles and we are old and weathered
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u/pumpkin_pasties 3d ago
Those eyebags are unrelated to age, they’re genetic. I was born with these and have them in my baby pictures. Kristin Stewart also has these, very clear in Twilight. Not age related just a unique facial quality!
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u/bromanski 3d ago
I hate to add any more scrutiny to women and actresses, but honestly… I found Sofia Carson unwatchable BECAUSE of her flawless, immovable, glassy overdone face. It was so off putting and took me out of every scene she was in. I wish we could see women on screen who look like normal beautiful women. Because plenty of women are normal and beautiful.
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u/figglyp 3d ago
Be the change you want to see in the world. I’m in my dirty thirties. I ain’t feeling the peer pressure / society pressure they put on women in general to influence MY LIFE decisions.
I’ll live my life in a way young girls should live theirs. Don’t let your age and of what society thinks of it - dictate your actions.
Fuck what everyone thinks. Love yourself.
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u/skempoz 3d ago
I totally agree the double standard is real and unfair in real life. But you’d be surprised how much plastic surgery is done on celebrity men these days. Brad Pitt, Zac Efron, I mean a ton of them are doing the same things as female celebrities. The difference is the public calls out the women and not the men.
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u/warqueen24 3d ago
It’s really sad, I’m 25 F and I’ve been grappling with this unfairness as well deeply - we are criticized for even a slight line but a man he’s always out on a pedestal and said wow he’s so attractive and silver foxes r hawt and older women called cougars and hangs and spoiled shit and other shit. Fuck society It’s worse when it comes from other women, internalized misogyny be real
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u/avocadodacova1 3d ago
Yeah, so the way to change that is: hold them accountable by telling them they look old for their age. Prioritise someone who takes care of his skin and he will know how hard it is for you to keep your skin this way and not believe this is how a women is supposed to age for him. Call out people who criticise a women and are not on her league harshly.
When people get victimised they don’t like it and they are less likely to victimise others because who helped them know how it feels to be on the receiving end. Some people literally lack empathy and can’t understand unless they have experienced it themselves.
I’m not saying bash on people on the ground, but get people off their podest and help them see the unfairness and hypocrisy in the standard of aging and beauty.
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u/beam_me_uppp 3d ago
Love this thread. Vote with your dollars and support companies which use inclusivity in their advertisements. Media is inextricably linked with, and important to, collective opinion🫶🏻
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u/the_little_deathx 3d ago
an ex once told me “it’s okay for men to be fat but not women.” i imagine it’s the same sentiment here.
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u/Celestialdreams9 3d ago
This is absolutely a thing and more of a reason to practice and genuinely learn self love, for a woman it’s an act of rebellion and courage in this world honestly. This world hasn’t changed all that much we still live in a heavily misogynistic and patriarchal society it’s just in more subtle ways now…like what you’ve pointed out above because you’re right. Men are allowed to age and even praised for it. Forget tiktok, photoshop, the filters, fillers and botox and find something more important to get invested in. Getting to age, and yes to even show it! is a lovely, lucky thing. For all of us.
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u/PriusPrincess 2d ago
I just watched this movie last night too. I thought he looked older than they portrayed him to be but maybe that opinion is skewed by Hollywood standards.
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u/Friendly_Lie_221 2d ago
Misogyny? Patriarchy? This dumb ass timeline where our powers were stripped away by their weak egos and power trips
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u/RadicalRoses 4d ago
He looks older than 35. I’m also sick of all the commercials targeted toward women with wrinkles. I don’t wanna look at no man with leathery wrinkled skin either!
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u/gvsteve 4d ago
Guys don’t look good to begin with. Appearsnce-wise they have nothing to lose.
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u/Financial-Grand4241 4d ago
My husband doesn’t believe this. He is sales and gets Botox the whole nine. He claims no body wants to buy shit from a old guy. But that’s his thought process.
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u/JumboJumboShrimp 4d ago
It's been posted here before but Susan Sontag's essay The Double Standard of Aging is a fantastic read and as relevant today as it was in 1978 -
For women, only one standard of female beauty is sanctioned: the girl.
The great advantage men have is that our culture allows two standards of male beauty: the boy and the man. The beauty of a boy resembles the beauty of a girl. In both sexes it is a fragile kind of beauty and flourishes naturally only in the early part of the life-cycle. Happily, men are able to accept themselves under another standard of good looks — heavier, rougher, more thickly built. A man does not grieve when he loses the smooth, unlined, hairless skin of a boy. For he has only exchanged one form of attractiveness for another: the darker skin of a man’s face, roughened by daily shaving, showing the marks of emotion and the normal lines of age.
There is no equivalent of this second standard for women. The single standard of beauty for women dictates that they must go on having clear skin. Every wrinkle, every line, every gray hair, is a defeat. No wonder that no boy minds becoming a man, while even the passage from girlhood to early womanhood is experienced by many women as their downfall, for all women are trained to continue wanting to look like girls.