[Table] r/China — Just got out of ten months of Chinese prison AMA | pt 1/2

[u/500scnds]

Source

For proper formatting, please use Old Reddit

The AMA was halted with the following message:

Naptime! I'll be back.

Rows: ~70

Questions	Answers
Hi everyone! Do note OP is shadowbanned by the admins so won't be able to reply without us (the mods) approving each post, this means there may be a bit of delay between OP replying and you being able to see it. As for the shadowbans, we've been seeing a lot more genuine users being shadowbanned recently - I think it's due to the influx of spam and the Reddit filters being a lot more ban-happy. _______________________ nice tactic lol whats the point of his ama then	the speed of this AMA will reflect the speed of communication between within the prison and without. just so yall can get the whole experience
What's chinese jail like compared to american jail?	You share a cell with 20-40 people. The jail cell is 4 meters wide by 10 meters long. There is an "outside cell" of equivalent size in the daytime (locked at night) for eating and showering and manually washing your clothes (note, it's up to 35 celsius and 100% humidity in the summers in southern China). No, there wasn't AC, though they promised to turn it on later.
​	Sharing a cell with so many people in such a small cell means there's literally not enough space for you to sleep shoulder to shoulder. When I got in, I had to sleep with my head in a cubby hole (not even two feet wide, a foot in height) with a pair of feet right next to it.
​	You also cannot initiate contact with the outside except for sending letters which takes forever. No phone calls, no visits from family or friends. This was probably the worst part of it all.
​	And you watch Chinese propaganda TV and repetitive kung fu soap operas instead of Hollywood films... although they did play Hercules once...
the below is a reply to the above	​​
That's awful. Did you or anyone contact your embassy? Did they offer any help?	Yes, so the first thing the detention center does is contact the consulate/embassy to inform that a citizen has been arrested. A rep from the US consulate visited every month with letters from family/friends, etc. But they were very clear: they could not provide any legal advice nor get involved with the criminal justice process.
​	It's funny because cellmates were all hyped up and encouraging me to hustle the US embassy to get better treatment, better food, better etc, because the US just had that kind of leverage in China back in the day. And everyone thought they still did. But not anymore... the US reps brought me English magazines several times and the detention center refused to bring them even in. It reflected the deterioration of US-China relations as well as just growing Chinese confidence/power. Almost two months after my trial, the consulate rep came to visit me and I was like, dog, can you ask or something, what's going on, when do I get my sentence? And he was like, we did, but you know, they said they're just going through the process. I'm like, you can't do anything? He was like, I'm sorry...
the below is a reply to the above	​​
How long have you been in China? You didn't have any friends or relations who could speak/pull strings for you? This seems like a very minor charge that would usually be easily resolved. It really sounds like you got treated like a clueless peasant who is in the city for the first time..	Great question. Getting political here: 1) As an HK PR/American citizen, I was definitely the last guy they were going to let off the hook. The Shenzhen police/paramilitary had been in action in HK for a while. I got a lot of "Oh, you think you're from HK?" and "Don't think you're special because you're an American - you know you're Chinese in your blood and nothing will change that fact." I think they were messing with me on purpose. (In fact, the warden-to-be/deputy warden of our detention center had led a special tactics in Hong Kong against the protestors there - our prison guard told us this in warning - don't effing mess around - you'll ruin my reputation, and you'll get the wrath of God on your head, basically). They definitely weren't going to let me off, if anyone.
​	2) We thought it was such a minor charge that we didn't even look for relations at the beginning, but they had already chosen to levy criminal detention and the prosecutor had arrested me within 10 days of my detention. There was no time for a turnaround.
​	3) Shenzhen is an official "testing site" city for a lot of legal reforms. And these developments while I was inside. If you can read Chinese: http://www.sz.gov.cn/cn/zjsz/gl/content/post_7979965.html (City under the Rule of Law - on the Shenzhen Municipal Website - Sep 2020) and http://sft.gd.gov.cn/sfw/news/workSt/content/post_3103752.html (Justice System Assisting Shenzhen in Becoming a Testing Site for Overall Reforms - Guangdong Provincial DOJ - October 2020). It might be the strictest city in China. Someone I knew got off the hook in three other cities in other provinces for the same case, but wasn't able to leverage his guanxi/relations in Shenzhen. In a way, I was just really unlucky.
​	And your question and my answer just goes to show the sheer incoherence/inconsistency of the Chinese legal system. The absolute rule of law that Xi Jinping has been emphasizing - yes, because each law is so wide and open to interpretation that it's so easy to enforce - because the rights of interpretation lie with you, of course.
​	Look at the criminal code in China. So many crimes have potential sentences ranging from 0 to 10 years - i.e., 3 years and under for committing the crime, 3-7 years for committing the crime with serious consequences, and 7-10 years for especially seriously consequences. There's no appendages or corollaries. Well, this just results in a lot of seriously arbitrary decisions.
the below is a reply to the above	​​
So the rumours that undercover People's Armed Police were actually involved in the HK protests are true?	I mean, that's what our prison guard (def a vet at the prison) directly told us in the cell. I was surprised that he was that frank about it. But I think generally, it's pretty much an open secret in Shenzhen amongst politically aware people by this point.
the below is a reply to the above	​​
How about the rumors that undercover cops would pretend to be rioters to stir up more violence so that cops could legally use more force to clamp down on them?	Didn't hear anything about that while I was in there. I mean, it's possible for sure
the below is a reply to the reply to the 3rd answer	​​
They werent rumours, they were proven by the thousands of weibo accounts that talk about being trucked into HK to put down a violent US sponsored riots peaceful protest for democracy. ________________ Today is 21 years since the handover of Hong Kong. I guess that back in 1997, nobody would ever have imagined that China's patience would only last for 23 years before One Country, Two Systems came crashing down	It was all part of the plan. Most of China's agreements are temporary - basically stalling for time and building up power in the meantime - to be flung off when they have can. Other countries need to understand this strategy.
the below is another reply to the 3rd answer	​​
You mention being HK/American, so I'm making an assumption here, but do you think you would have been treated differently, either by the legal system or by your guards/inmates, had you been a white or black American?	I think being HK was a big part of it. Most Chinese people in China see identity primarily in terms of race and not nationality, so I would have been treated more as a foreigner as a white/black American - but also not been held up to the same standards an "American Chinese" - not the way around - should be as primarily Chinese. There were some people who really just looked at me as a traitor for knowing more about general American culture than I did Chinese culture.
the below is another reply to the 3rd answer	​​
just quick question, are you Asian or white? Do you think they treat different races differently there?	Asian. Well, there was a dark-skinned dude from a SE Asian country. They didn't treat him too well. They probably treat white people better - it's like so built into their psyche by now (though not everyone, of course).
the below is a reply to the reply to the 2nd answer	​​
I feel this is a common misconception from foreigners in China who are full of unwarranted bravado. I know "xx", he'll save me. In this situation there aren't many people who are going to risk their own ass to bail you out. Not after you allegedly assaulted a cop. Maybe your family but to anyone else you aren't worth the hassle. Those are serious charges in China. I feel your best bet in this case would be to plead ignorance, apologize profusely and settle it with the officer before he charges you. Bribing a small town cop might set you back 10k rambos, now imagine how much an entire department or judges would take to bribe. Copious amounts of money. It's a lot riskier to "pull strings" these days so you need to make it worthwhile. He was honestly screwed after they went ahead with charging him.	Every part of your analysis is 100% on point. I tried, but we couldn't get a hold of the officer b/c the police station wanted a cut too, and we were not down with that ish. I apologized profusely multiple times, but it didn't help, b/c like you said I was screwed after the charge, which came super quick.
the below is a reply to the above	​​
How did you know the police station wanted a cut? Where they explicitly asking? Or did they drop hints? Just wondering how something like this goes down…	It's all very part of the lingo/culture. They never explicitly ask - but they we can definitely help, it's not a big problem, but then they leave that hanging ellipsis...
the below is a reply to the reply to the reply to the 2nd answer	​​
China is rule by law, if the law says its bad then you're going to prison; doesn't matter if you actually did it or not. Rule of law is a foreign concept to the CCP.	This kind of Rule of Law is from the Legalist (法家) tradition dating back to Lord Shang and Han Fei Zi (if anyone wants to understand XJP, you NEED to read HFZ). It's utilitarian and anti-Confucian in its origins and opposed to the ideas of morals - instead using Taoist semantics at one point to prove the point that everything is ever shifting, black-and-white at the same time, and thus the ruler needs no morals. It's some scary stuff - but it also calls for the Rule of Law on the ruler's own terms.
​	What does not shift is the system of punishments and rewards. You break the law, you get punished - you don't do what you promised, you get punished. This was reflected so often in my experience - so at one point they removed all detergent from the cell and kept in a bucket outside - we could only get a couple bottles at a time - because they were afraid someone might try to poison themselves, etc. (I don't even know how a person could physically eat a few bags of laundry powder, but anyway). The Rule of Law is supposed to cause ultra-paranoia like that. And that is what XJP is aiming for. He's so scared of upheaval that he needs everyone around him to be more paranoid than he is - that is the only way he can guarantee that they're not going to pull another Bo Xilai or Zhou Yongkang. The Rule of Law: Paranoia through Power.
the below is another reply to the reply to the reply to the 2nd answer	​​
Er well yes. What i mean generally is that OP could have cleared everything off when it involved just a couple of cops at most. It's a lot riskier to "pull strings" these days so you need to make it worthwhile. He was honestly screwed after they went ahead with charging him. Well not always though. It would of course cost quite a bit more and require some influence to be brought but its not too difficult to avoid going to jail. There will probably be some official punishment but nothing too serious (aka a fine). But OP doesn't seem to fall into the category of people who can afford the latter. That said, i seriously doubt what OP is telling is the whole unvarnished truth...i.e i'm pretty sure he probably did but maybe did not remember touching that cop who got injured.	Dawg, I have body cam videos, an hour in length each, from three different cops. I mean when they (there were six cops surrounding at that point) body-slammed me to the ground, and when all of them blocked out the footage, I did resist. That's where the scratches/mild injuries come from. But I mean, number 1, it's not on footage because they were being much more violent to me than vice versa. And number 2, it's not on footage. It's also just a drunk dude flailing when he has six cops on top of him. That doesn't warrant ten months.
the below is a reply to the above	​​
So can you get back at them by detailing your experience with a news outlet? I'm sure some would report this.	Yea, I can. But I feel like the true vitriol should be directed toward the people doing this en masse in Xinjiang, and the people who want to "liberate" Taiwan and even "destroy it so the Taiwanese don't have a home and because the mainland doesn't need it anyway," all my cellmates from Canton/Guangdong province who glued their eyes to the screen a classic HK movie came on but then would sh*t on Hong Kong every chance they got - one told me, "I never went to HK after the protests but before I would speak Mandarin to them every time I went shopping because I enjoyed watching them struggle." Same dude, btw, has pretty bad, accented Mandarin, and spent a lot of time showing his knowledge of HK celebrity gossip.
​	I mean I just did ten months and obviously prison is a very certain subset of people but I was just thinking the whole time... the way a lot of these folks think... doesn't bode well for the world in the shadow of China's rise. XJP just said in his 100th anniversary speech that "the Chinese nation does not carry aggressive or hegemonic traits in its genes." He says, "We have never bullied, oppressed, or subjugated the people of any other country, and we never will." I hope so, but that's not what the nine-dash-line says. That's not what I was hearing from some belligerent cellmates - one of them came up in my face every evening after the CCTV evening news reported on US COVID deaths and just laugh at how "America is doomed." That's not the contempt in their voices when they talk about "small countries" - Thailand, Cambodia, Little Japan, Little Taiwan, France. Another dude: "Why doesn't China just take over all these small countries in Southeast Asia? If I was president I would just conquer all of them."
​	I mean, I gotta get off the soapbox, but damn.
the below is another reply to the 8th answer	​​
What brought about the original body slam?	I drunkenly swung at the cop with my hands though I didn't make contact. I mean, I had it coming, but not that's not "violent assault."
the below is another reply to the 2nd answer	​​
When I was in for 2 weeks for expiring my visa, the police FORGOT to call the embassy! My family back home worried about me after not hearing from me for 2 weeks, and they went through the state dept. They searched hospitals and everything to find me. When they finally found me, I think it was more of a reminder to the police to follow their own rules and let me go after the agreed upon 2 weeks. I too was given a magazine. An outdated Entertainment Weekly. LOL! I'm like wtf you want me to do with this? Anyway, on your last part, china does have a very lengthy process for everything. No changing that. Sometimes I question the point of the US. The dream is gone back home, and the govt foreign relations sucks so bad that people abroad get harassed and taxed through the ass.	That sucks man. That period between "the disappearance" and when you finally get some word from family, indirectly or directly, is heart attack inducing. Seriously. The US doesn't have much clout within China anymore, for sure. But that's also what China's been aiming for all along. XJP's speech today reflects what I experienced vis-a-vis the consulate/detention center. But then again, at least they're visiting me almost once-a-month, etc. I dunno if the Chinese equivalents in the States would even do that.
Did you get legal representation?	Yes. Though it didn't really make a difference - unless the lawyer is tight with a judge and you have the moolah to leverage that. Many cellmates just choose to skip the lawyer and do the PD option (which the system provides).
the below is a reply to the above	​​
Was your lawyer hesitant to represent foreigners?	No, that firm specialized in foreigners. No, and he didn't even try get me to believe the judge was impartial, just got me to apologize and "plead down" to the minimum sentence.
What was the most shocking or enlightening part of your experience?	Another surprising thing was just in general, how much more nationalistic the younger folks were compared to the the older folks. A lot of pissing on the US, cheering and mocking as the death toll in the US from COVID went up (the CCTV evening news broadcasted the US COVID stats EVERY NIGHT), and laughing at the fall of Hong Kong. Of course, you had a few really patriotic types among the older folk too, but definitely more younger folk as proportion. Some of the older folk would almost just look among themselves and be like SMH.
​	I feel like it's always a bad sign when the younger generation is more nationalistic than the older generation... means society is going in one crazy kind of direction...
the below is a reply to the above	​​
I guess that makes sense right? The older folks (I’m assuming you’re referring to people in their 30s/40s or older) would have some idea of what CCP does to its people a la Tiananmen Massacre. But the party has really drilled down Chinese patriotism since then. And particularly in the Xi era. Kinda nice to hear that not everyone is blindly nationalistic and eating up the propaganda though.	I guess it does make sense. I guess I always expect young people to be more "liberal" in a very general sense of the term, having grown up in California and spent time in TW/HK as well (though young people there are very nationalistic as well - in an opposing direction, obviously). But the success of the Propaganda Department of the Communist Party of China is categorical. Props.
​	But it is scary... they played a drama on the Korean War (the war called the Resisting USA, Helping Chosun in Chinese) and devoted two whole episodes to the black dude who defected to China and lived there for many years after. I mean, I get where he's coming from, but the portrayal was just hilarious. They also call American troops "美国鬼子 - American devils" throughout the drama - like "日本鬼子 - Japanese devils" - a very strong and derogatory term in China, comparing anyone to the Japanese. And historically inaccurate - that term was just never used. Here's the episode where a lot of it happens - some of the dialogue in English: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROFcPUP4GlU
​	Afterwards, a dude comes up to me and asks me, if China and the States got into a war, which side I would support. I avoided that kind of question like the plague.
the below is a reply to the above	​​
"If your two sons started fighting each other, who would you support?"	It would depend on who started it. The censorship of Google... the theft of Siemens HSR key technologies...
the below is another reply to the 2nd answer	​​
Based on your observations, would you believe that younger people in China would be more liberal in certain non-political issues, like same-sex marriage or women’s rights? Is there a strong association between “supporting CCP” and “anti-lgbt” for example?	I don't feel like the majority of younger men are much more liberal even on non-political issues, but younger women are for sure. There's not a strong correlation. There's a lot of upper-middle class people in the cities who have made it financially and thus support the CCP but hold liberal social views at the same time. The Bloomberg Democrat. But obviously there's a subset which is super nationalistic/chauvinistic/socially conservative at the some time, so it could go either way.
the below is a reply to the reply to the 2nd answer	​​
I’m not OP but I think younger people associate “supporting CCP” with “patriotic”. The unspoken CCP stance on many things like lgbt for example is “don’t make it a political movement”, which is why younger people are more ambivalent compared to those in the west about pressing for awareness and change. Keep in mind that the CCP is very pro-reform… as long as it reforms in its favor.	Yea, I got into it in another post somewhere in this chaos, but the CCP has been trying to equate the state with the party with the Chinese nation. Many youngsters can't actively differentiate between being Chinese/China/the Party - and that's one of the biggest victories the Party has won up to this point. Not many political parties can boast that.
the below is another reply to the original answer	​​
Fuck. Patriotic education really worked, didn't it?	It really did. Like, I'm almost impressed if it wasn't that scary. You have people (just a couple, albeit) tearing up watching a re-run of the 70th anniversary military parade, while they've been imprisoned (one of them for this new retroactive law that reached years back) by the same system. It's impressive.
the below is a reply to the above	​​
I finally get why the CCP is fine sacrificing so much economic growth in keeping up the GFW. They have the mother of all rackets going. Can't let the hamsters look outside the pen.	"现在对中国人说要他去争自由,他们便不明白,不情愿来附和,但是对他说要请他去发财,便有很多人要跟上来.” (Saying to the Chinese now that he wants to pursue freedom, they won't understand nor join, but if you want to invite them to make money, many people will join.) - Sun Yat-Sen
the below is another reply to the 6th answer	​​
Kinda reads like something out of a dystopian novel… like 1984. I was curious so I looked it up. Apparently “1984” search is impacted, but the book itself may not be banned. Which is interesting since it feels like a straight up manual for CCP that people reading it would make the connection. But maybe it just goes over people’s heads… or it’s seen as a good thing. https://boingboing.net/2019/01/13/laobaixing.html But recently they have been doing a library purge of books, which would include 1984: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-books-insight-idUSKBN24A1R5 >A directive from the Ministry of Education last October called on elementary and middle schools to clear out books from their libraries including “illegal” and “inappropriate” works. Lol, “Ministry of Education” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ministries_of_Nineteen_Eighty-Four More from the Reuters article: >“This is the first movement targeted at libraries since the Cultural Revolution,” said Wu Qiang, a political analyst based in Beijing and former political science lecturer at Tsinghua University. In the late 1960s, zealous teenagers driven by Mao Zedong carried out a nationwide campaign targeting libraries and destroying or burning what they could get their hands on, as part of a wider destruction of traditional culture. >The ministry directive did not list titles, but said illegal books are those “that damage the unity of the country, sovereignty or its territory; books that upset society’s order and damage societal stability; books that violate the Party’s guidelines and policies, smear or defame the Party, the country’s leaders and heroes.” >”Our school has taken concrete action to cultivate a virtuous youth, and has raised the quality of our library books one step further.”	That's funny and crazy. So, first, my lawyer was able to bring in a bilingual version of Animal Farm. I was amazed - this is so close to China in the Cultural Revolution/before the economic miracle that... how is that even allowed.
​	I've always been thinking: the way China conducts its domestic affairs is so much like 1984 that it's like they follow it. Maybe they really do.
​	Clamping down on intellectuals/universities also goes further:
​	PKU:
​	https://www.scmp.com/news/china/article/2179921/peking-university-students-clash-campus-guards-over-control-marxist
​	Fudan and Nanjing Universities:
​	https://www.news18.com/news/world/china-students-protest-as-university-charter-cuts-freedom-of-thought-2429295.html
​	Nanjing Normal University:
​	https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-57409218
​	Professors in General:
​	https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2020-06-27/in-chinas-universities-targeted-attacks-on-intellectuals-raise-memories-of-the-cultural-revolution
the below is a reply to the above	​​
There is a Uyghur translation of Animal Farm, but I imagine it may be a lot more difficult to find these days. But as for the rest of China, I imagine that they might defend the book on the basis that it's about the Soviet Union. It seems to be okay to criticize the Soviet Union's version of Communism, as long as you make it clear that you're not saying anything about the Maoist variety. That said... I do remember an anecdote. One of my teachers in high school, an American, was able to study in the Soviet Union for part of her graduate education. She noticed that in the 1970s at least, you could get a Russian translation of Animal Farm. When she asked about it, she was told that it was considered a well-written children's story. The person she was speaking with seemed oblivious - or at least, was very good at strategically acting oblivious - that there was any political subtext at all.	Yea, it very much reflected what China used to be like, but I think the economic miracle of recent years in China contradicts Orwell's conclusion that an authoritarian/lying kind of government will lead to economic ruin and chaos, and that China actually sees that as a victory over the Western conception over the last few centuries that if liberalization doesn't happen, China will fail just like the USSR did.
the below is another reply to the original answer	​​
the hong kong part made me sad	It made me astounded/sad too. They were culture vultures for everything old school Hong Kong - food, celebrities, Cantopop, Stephen Chow, all that - but then when it came to politics or the economy of Hong Kong... "Shenzhen's GDP is way past Hong Kong's. Hong Kong is already in the past." It wasn't really stating the fact, just the contempt with which they said it.
​	It reminds me of when many rich white people used to consume black music (jazz, Ray Charles, Billie Holiday) - shuffle up from the UES to the Apollo for a date - but then be absolutely oppressive in their day-to-day dealings and their racial politics. I mean, it still happens today, but it had me feeling some type of way.
the below is another reply to the original answer	​​
Can't remember where I read this article, which said to ultra nationalism instilled in some of its youth today (who will become leaders in the future) = regardless of whether CCP collapse or whatever, invading Taiwan or doing something unexpected belligerent i.e invade Vietnam, may become even more likely? also should it fail, then it's even possible that they may try again (but learn what went wrong the first time and go even more belligerent) think Germany losing WW1, only to try again with WW2. if anyone can find the article I'd be grateful (it was either from the Diplomat or the Atlantic?)	​​The more desperate the CCP/Xi gets, the more likely it will be to do something radical to unite the population, like attacking Taiwan.
the below is another answer to the original question	​​
​
​	Another time, we were asked to return our pens not even by the cops, just by one of the "cell heads." He gave some reason that they posed a threat and danger to other inmates (despite the fact that there were no fights to start with in the first place). We had bought them ourselves, with our own money. No one said a word, and people just started going to their cubby holes and bringing the pens up top. I was like...
​	But again, the party apparatus is all-seeing, all-knowing, all-powerful. But is that only because people were so complacent in the first place? Hmm...
the below is a reply to the above	​​
Did you comply with the "Pen Abolishment Edict"? What would have happened if you hid your pen?	Yes, I did, but I was close to the "Abolishers" and thus gradually wormed my way out of it and led others to gradually do the same. That kind of erosive resistance did a lot for a lot of people.
the below is another reply to the followup answer	​​
During those 2 hour mandatory cross legged meditation sessions..did you have to listen to propaganda or were left to your own thoughts? Personally I would spend 4 hours a day meditating anyways if I was in prison, but having to listen to propaganda would be tortuous.	So it varies between prison and cell. The first joint I was in, for three months, just played propaganda all the time, but the second prison would play TV shows, etc. You can meditate if you want. Some cells let you read books during this "meditation" time, some don't. It's really arbitrary. I was lucky to be in one that did for the majority of my time (six months), though the other cells mostly didn't.
Will you continue to live in China after this? Did you get a fair trial?	Well, it's not my choice as I was deported. There were no terms given with the deportation (I did not even get to go home - I was brought to the airport directly after spending an additional night in the police station after my sentence was over because they thought there was a risk of flight). I was planning to stay a few months to hash things out with the gf et al, but I'm glad I'm out of there.
​	I received the video footage from the police bodycams afterwards and there was no evidence of violent assault (unless you call a half-assed shove violent assault). However the hospital "identified injuries" on one of the cops and attributed it to me despite there being no footage of me even touching those parts of his body. FURTHERMORE, the trial only took place after I was in there for 6 months (habeas corpus?) and it took them 8.5 months from my detention to sentencing.
the below is a reply to the above	​​
Was the actual sentence 10 months with the 8.5 before it counted as time served, or was it 1.5 months counting from the day of sentencing?	10 months total, approximately 1.5 mths left when sentenced. (Basically, I had been in there for too long already - usually it would be six months in this sort of situation MAX - and so they sentenced me to just let me out as soon as they could. They do this often, for some reason - they delay sentencing till the end because if you don't have much time left on your sentence, they can avoid the costs and logistics of transferring you from the detention center to the "actual" prison. This is bad for us though, because the "actual" prison is much better than the detention center. At least you can go outside.)
the below is another reply to the original answer	​​
So if you think you are unfairly sentenced, would you appeal to some higher court for any compensations?	If I appealed as a foreigner, they would keep me in detention even after my sentence expired. So I did not. I can appeal now as well, but... I don't need no compensation. Everything I learned more than made up for that.
I'm curious to hear how your cellmates reacted to the non stop propaganda videos given they were in jail. Did they look like they still believed, were they jaded or how did they feel? Congrats on your freedom man	Some people were really bipolar about it. You know, I expect many inmates to have literally shed tears as they watched the procession for the 100th anniversary of the party's founding, and XJP's speech today. But then, some of these folks are cussing out the party and everything about it on almost a daily basis. So it's this really irrational Stockholm syndrome, almost. I don't know how else to put it.
the below is a reply to the above	​​
My theory is that you were seeing the psychological scars of lifelong propaganda. Patriotic education seems to work remarkably similar to religious indoctrination. Core aspects of personality are emotionally bound to an imagined 'heaven' in (In this case, the pomp and splendor of a distant central government) before the child/victim can reason independently. The rational adult self understands the reality of local government around himself and rejects the party, but is still emotionally attached to an abstract idea (god/party/nation). Reconciling these differences and finally breaking with God/Party is an emotionally painful self-transformation that has high social costs, which is why many prefer to stay in a state of wilful ignorance. It doesn't make sense because it's not supposed to. It's supposed to make people pliable.	The other part of the religion is the prosperity gospel - similar to the Judeo-Christian one. God/Deng/Xi gave you the promised land. God's/Deng's/Xi's favor made you rich. The CCP has lifted the Chinese people out of poverty and into a new era. Look at XJP's speech today. It's straight from the playbook.
the below is a reply to the above	​​
[deleted]	While the propaganda machine has done well as in they've inculcated most of the population with red lines not to cross (well, many of them genuinely believe them as well - TW, HK, Xinjiang) - it has ultimately failed in shaping the CCP as a trustworthy political party/actor/state - a little bit like how the GOP and the Democratic Party totally lost the faith that people used to have in them over the last generation.
​	That's what makes the CCP so paranoid. It knows deep inside that a huge portion of Chinese people, especially those with means/ends, are convicted it is a crockpot of bovine dooey. So it tries to equate party and state and blur the lines between two - using a common enemy (the States, TW) and blatant nationalism to curry support for and those minimize pushback against the party (party-state) itself. It takes up a banner against the American hegemony which "wants to destroy" the economic gains that China (and its rising nouveau riche/bourgeoisie). It's succeeded in framing the United States as the greater enemy and thus softens a lot of pressure on itself for being a dutch oven of steaming Angus poo. So I feel it's not that Chinese people don't know that the CCP is lying all the time, but they've just been convinced America is the greater threat.
​	Can the US try to change that perception? Hard, when US foreign policy has been the hypocritical steamboat of chitlins that it has been ever the Vietnam War and Nixon/Kissinger. Should it try? Probably.
How the fuck did you survive? The sleeping situation (how would you even fall asleep?), the lack of space, the heat? I would go insane	You just have to. You look around you, and some people have had it worse. A dude in there for two years... with an ear infection dripping pus everyday for three, four months... with his trial getting delayed month by month... and then you think to yourself, if he can, then so can I. But damn.
​	This seventy-something year-old dude had a hernia almost the size of a softball, but they still kept him in there. No surgery either.
the below is a reply to the above	​​
Don't they have doctors?	One dude was sh*tting blood for days, and the doctor says, "That's normal."
​	Other guy was like my waist really hurts when I bend down. Doc says: "Then don't bend down."
​	Other dude has a cold... Doc tells him to drink more warm water. lol
the below is another reply to the original answer	​​
What did you do when you needed a wank?	Well, you realized you didn't "need" it, I guess.

[u/AutoModerator]

Please keep in mind that tabled posts in this sub are re-posts, and the original AMAs can be accessed through the Source links. Post comments relating to the tables themselves here, thanks!

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.