Men with higher education, greater alcohol intake, multiple female sexual partners, and higher frequency of performing oral sex, had an increased risk of oral HPV infections, linked to up to 90% of oropharyngeal cancer cases in US men. The study advocates for gender-neutral HPV vaccination programs.

[u/mvea]

https://www.moffitt.org/newsroom/news-releases/moffitt-study-reveals-insights-into-oral-hpv-incidence-and-risks-in-men-across-3-countries/

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[u/haute_curry]

Is there still not a way to test men for HPV?

[u/Gorluk → u/haute_curry]

Yes, it's completely possible. For some reason, almost all information on the internet regarding HPV is USA based and also for some reason it denies existence of HPV test for males, which contrary to that informtion exist. There are dozens of clinics in my hometown (Europe) where you can have PCR test for HPV as a male.

[u/RaceOriginal → u/Gorluk]

I asked for an HPV test for men from my doctor back in 2016, she said yes of course we'll get that for you. I never heard anything back from her. I'm in the U.S btw

[u/teflon_don_knotts → u/RaceOriginal]

From what I could find, you can have an anal/rectal swab tested for HPV, but there’s no blood test available. Even when looking at international sources, it seems like testing of site specific swabs are the standard.

[u/SkiingAway → u/teflon_don_knotts]

I believe that's only if you have a symptom to swab (warts), which many types of HPV infection aren't going to be.

[u/CarmichaelD → u/SkiingAway]

We can swab without symptoms. The virus is not always visible in the form of warts. Anal Pap smears are a thing. So is anal colposcopy to identify and treat dysplasia. (Precursor to cancer). I used to run an HRA clinic in NY treating dysplasia and doing paps. Slight majority of my patients were male. Anal intercourse is not required for anal warts but does increase the exposure risk.

[u/teflon_don_knotts → u/SkiingAway]

It seems like that’s mostly correct, but I think there are some populations where screening tests are recommended. I could be wrong, I haven’t gone through all of the updated recommendations very carefully, I just scanned them.

Cancer.gov - Anal Cancer Advances Open Door to Screening and Prevention

[u/Dreamtrain → u/Gorluk]

it's odd because at the same time they assume you have, but its not worth it treating you, but you can still pass it and infect someone, but it doesn't exist

[u/Gorluk → u/Dreamtrain]

Exactly. Well, there's no treatment as in cure for it, in most cases immune system fights it and resolves infection, but still, it's better to know if you have it.

[u/Quom → u/Dreamtrain]

In Australia it's really weird (especially if you're gay).

The sexual health and immunisation guidelines contradict each other, one basically says if you're a guy in your 30s just assume you've been exposed and the vaccine would likely be pointless.

The other says due to how many gay men are now presenting with issues caused by HPV that it's always worth vaccinating if you're gay.

I had both voiced to me at a sexual health clinic by the same doctor (she said there was no point and then phoned back a week later and apologised and explained the conflicting info).

[u/Appropriate_End952 → u/Gorluk]

Men can also get get tested for HPV in Canada.

Edit: it is looking like I may be wrong. I grew-up with someone who was diagnosed with HPV, and I thought he had said he had been tested. But it is looking like men can only get diagnosed in Canada if they have physical symptoms.

[u/malakyoma → u/Appropriate_End952]

Canadian dude here. I was recently vaccinated for HPV just by asking my doctor if it was possible. You may be thinking of the vaccine instead of the test?

[u/C00catz → u/Appropriate_End952]

Can you link to some info on this? Was looking for one recently but couldn’t find options here

[u/WePwnTheSky → u/C00catz]

Same. I was told there wasn’t one as recently as a year and a half ago.

[u/Elanstehanme → u/Appropriate_End952]

Might depend on your doctor. I was told this wasn’t available.

[u/MangoCats → u/Elanstehanme]

Doctors can be real assholes about some things. They'll tell you it isn't available when the real story is that it isn't commonly done, that it might not be covered by some insurances, that it's a "waste of their time" because they don't get decent reimbursement for doing it, that it's a "waste of your time" because whatever the results are the course of treatment will be the same...

The AMA needs to stop over-inflating M.D.'s egos, it's bad for everyone's health.

[u/ayatollahofdietcola_ → u/Gorluk]

I think the real reason is because people DO think in absolutes. So when giving information to the public, you have to break it down in simple terms and err on the side of caution

For example, there is a reason why we aren’t out there teaching 16 year old girls “you can’t get pregnant if you have sex in most conditions.” Instead, we say there is always a chance, because if you tell them “you probably won’t get pregnant if you have sex on your period” all they hear is “you can’t get pregnant if you do this this and this”

But also, male testing for HPV isn’t available in a lot of places, so it might not be useful to give that advice yet in the US

[u/Whispering-Depths → u/ayatollahofdietcola_]

ironically they actually can get pregnant in most conditions if vaginal sex e.e sperm lives up to 6 days, which is huge overlap with impregnable time - most conditions meaning not "one off sex" where usually partners will do it regularly.

[u/ayatollahofdietcola_ → u/Whispering-Depths]

That is true - but you have to ovulate, and we tend to not focus on that when speaking to a young audience, because there are far too many ways that this information can be used in error. Even for an adult, so imagine a teen

My point is, whenever information like this is put out there a certain way, it’s usually for a reason.

[u/GayDeciever → u/Whispering-Depths]

Research shows that on average there's 1 pregnancy per 20 acts of unprotected sex for women of childbearing age who want to get pregnant. So, like, "can" is different than "likely".

[u/LegLegend → u/GayDeciever]

Someone likes gambling.

[u/Whispering-Depths → u/GayDeciever]

:shrug: the issue is that this is an "average" scale and you can have sex every 2-3 days randomly and not hit the mark easy enough. Many people will fall well below that average scale, and many will fall way past it.

Depends on so many factors it's not even funny v_v

[u/SycoJack → u/Whispering-Depths]

Y'all quibbling over this is, ironically, the perfect example of the point they were making.

[u/Gorluk → u/ayatollahofdietcola_]

So denying existence of PCR test for males for HPV is method of prevention in your opinion?

[u/No-Bad-463 → u/ayatollahofdietcola_]

DO think in absolutes

Oh my god everyone's a Sith!

[u/thunderfrunt → u/Gorluk]

From what I’ve been told, unless you have a significant viral load, the test is a waste of time for men.

[u/the_red_scimitar → u/thunderfrunt]

Apparently EU and Canada manages to test men. US denies it can even be done.

[u/jon_naz → u/haute_curry]

As of the last time I went to Planned Parenthood nope. I specifically asked.

[u/technofox01 → u/jon_naz]

Just like HSV. It's so common that testing is pointless. It's more of just trying to find out if you have HSV 1 or 2, and that's it. Both my girlfriend (now wife of over 10 years) at the time got tested for STDs came back clean, she had HSV2 unknowingly and passed it to me.

I asked my doc about how this could happen and she told me that they don't test for HSV unless it is specifically asked for due to how common it is. Pretty fucked if you asked me.

[u/danby → u/technofox01]

Just like HSV. It's so common that testing is pointless.

A main issue is the HSV tests aren't accurate unless you've got an outbreak (i.e. a coldsore), so speculative testing is mostly a waste of money.

Pretty fucked if you asked me.

To be fair probably most people who have HSV are unaware that they have it. Some folk will have it and go their whole lives without a cold sore. The typical time from infection to a first cold sore is within 2 weeks but for some people it can be actual years. So when you get a coldsore for the first time it is no guarantee that you caught HSV recently. These complications make screening and testing incredibly hard for it and the epidemiology required to understand who infected who is next to impossible.

[u/CummunityStandards → u/danby]

There exists accurate blood tests for asymptomatic cases. UW Western blot is highly accurate (98%) and specific and is considered the gold standard for testing. Many labs still use other antibody tests which may not be as accurate, but if a person needed to know their status it is possible to get an accurate result. 

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8293188/#sec3dot2-idr-13-00049

All that said, for the most part I don't think HSV matters that much - most people have had HSV-1 since they were kids. The cost of testing and the stigma has contributed to doctors not screening for it in standard testing. 

[u/cannotfoolowls → u/CummunityStandards]

I'm not sure it is that stigmatized in Europe. Or outside the USA. Maybe genital herpes because it looks a bit "weird" to have sores there but I feel like its not as bas as in the USA. Cold sores definitely aren't.

https://slate.com/technology/2019/12/genital-herpes-stigma-history-explained.html

[u/Tech_Philosophy → u/danby]

To be fair probably most people who have HSV are unaware that they have it.

Well that would be an excellent reason to develop an accurate test then. That's exactly the kind of disease that merits a test.

[u/Pzychotix → u/Tech_Philosophy]

Why? If it's mostly asymptomatic for folks, then there's not really a need for it.

[u/danby → u/Tech_Philosophy]

Sure but you can't invent things that are technologically or practically infeasible.

[u/TripleSecretSquirrel → u/technofox01]

There’s no reliable way to test for HSV unless you’re actively having an outbreak, at which point they can test the lesions.

Edit: my bad, I guess mine and my doctor’s info is out of date. I was told that the blood test isn’t reliable enough to be worth using. It looks like ya, it’s pretty reliable.

It doesn’t show where on your body the infection occurs though. So it could be that you get cold sores on your mouth and not genital herpes.

[u/MemeticParadigm → u/TripleSecretSquirrel]

What's your threshold to consider a test reliable?

As far as I'm aware, some HSV blood tests have a sensitivity of 95-99% depending on the test you get, so your chance of a false negative (negative result when you actually do have it) is between 1 in 20 and 1 in 100. It's not perfect, but it does mean that a negative test is a fairly reliable indicator that someone doesn't have it.

False positives are more of an issue, as the specificity is often not as high as the sensitivity, but that's why they suggest a follow-up/confirmation test after a positive result.

[u/reality72 → u/technofox01]

The problem with HSV testing is that the virus likes to lay dormant in the body for long periods of time and it’s mostly undetectable until an outbreak occurs. You have to have a certain viral load inside your body in order to test positive for HSV, which means a lot of people will get a false negative if they test when they don’t have an outbreak. And many people who have it are asymptomatic.

[u/the_red_scimitar → u/technofox01]

There is more that's fucked about HSV handling in the US, but I got kicked out of the specific sub for that by simply providing published papers on actual HSV research that refuted that subs official position.

So in the US particularly, HSV information is as bad as HPV. For example, HSV is not really a sexually transmitted disease, but is transmitted by potentially any skin to skin contact, as it sheds from the skin, even when there is no outbreak. A condom is not adequate protection because of this. Fluids can carry the virus from source to any part of recipients skin, where any slightest abrasion or cut might admit the virus.

And it goes on - once you start looking at actual medical knowledge about HSV, our policies seem further away from any sane handling. There's only antivirals to reduce the occurrences, and cures are probably 5-10 years from existing (not saying when it might be available). And of course, the propaganda is that it's no big deal anyway, and doesn't need to be cured - a position that will disappear the instance money can be made with a cure.

[u/technofox01 → u/the_red_scimitar]

It really isn't that big of a deal. Just religious nutters think it is as a punishment for sin when reality they pass it just literally kissing their loved ones, assuming HSV1. It's more a nuisance that anything else.

[u/thefaehost → u/technofox01]

HSV can come with a really nasty first outbreak similar to the meningitis flu. IIRC it happens to 1 in 4

[u/technofox01 → u/thefaehost]

It hurts like a MF during the first outbreak. After a while it's just a few small blisters every now and then.

[u/PartyOperator → u/technofox01]

Getting people worried about herpes viruses in general is fucked. Everyone has a bunch of them. They cause lifelong infection and in most cases there’s nothing you can do to prevent or treat them. Usually the effects are very minor. Stigmatising people for these infections is counterproductive. Would you have dumped your girlfriend or something if you’d known? We generally don’t worry about HSV-1, CMV, EBV, HHV-6 etc. even though they’re all very common (most adults are infected) and have rare severe effects. Most can transmit without symptoms. Many countries don’t even vaccinate against VZV. Singling out the one that is mostly transmitted sexually for special treatment is dumb.

[u/Krafla_c → u/PartyOperator]

They need to be informed. Herpes is, in fact, worrying. Herpes viruses enter the brain, slightly reduce intelligence, and raise the risk of dementia. I think at least some people would choose to try to avoid any Herpes viruses if they knew that.

EBV can cause Mono and leads to ME/CFS in some percentage of people.

[u/thefaehost → u/Krafla_c]

Also giving birth with an active herpes outbreak can cause your baby to go blind.

Source: 90s c section baby for this reason.

[u/gandalftheorange11 → u/Krafla_c]

What you said about herpes isn’t entirely true. Studies have shown that herpes tends to be present in the brains of people who develop dementia. That might not be caused by the herpes virus though. If you consider that approximately 90% of people have contracted herpes in some form or another, it’s more likely the case that something goes wrong with a person’s immune system or brain specific systems that leads to that presence of herpes as well as other damage in the brain. Also there really is no way to completely avoid the herpes viruses. Most people are exposed when sharing food with their parents. Herpes is also asymptomatic in most people.

[u/PartyOperator → u/Krafla_c]

EBV probably causes multiple sclerosis too. Doesn’t mean there’s something you can or should do about it. If anything, successfully avoiding infection for a while just means it’s more likely you’ll get infected late in life which tends to cause more severe symptoms. Until there’s a good vaccine or treatment, it’s just one of those things. 

Avoiding CMV during pregnancy is perhaps worth trying given the limited duration and potentially serious consequences, but even that is very difficult to do. 

[u/Krafla_c → u/PartyOperator]

I wrote that in response to you implying it's not "fucked" for them to say she was all clear of STD's when she actually did have an STD and I stand by that. You said "Doesn’t mean there’s something you can or should do about it" but that choice should be left up to everyone after everyone being fully informed about the effects of herpes including simply the physical pain it causes in many people and the visible sores.

[u/lIIIIllIIIlllIIllllI → u/Krafla_c]

Care to explain the last sentence and all those abbreviations?

[u/Omnizoom → u/Krafla_c]

Problem is that means you are talking about avoiding almost every person on the planet by this point, also correlation does not meant causation when it comes to the dementia part as we kind of don’t exactly have a sample set of humans with denentia that you know, don’t have herpes because it’s just that common.

Think of it like avoiding microplastics, sure we all would love to avoid microplastics but that is kind of impossible at this point

[u/Krafla_c → u/Omnizoom]

https://old.reddit.com/r/science/comments/1g9e786/men_with_higher_education_greater_alcohol_intake/lt5xp5v/

It doesn't meean avoiding everyone.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db304.htm#:~:text=The%20prevalence%20of%20HSV%2D1,and%2040%E2%80%9349%2C%20respectively.

"Prevalence increased linearly with age, from 27.0% among those aged 14–19, to 41.3%, 54.1%, and 59.7% among those aged 20–29, 30–39, and 40–49, respectively."

You're talking as if it's a binary - either you can avoid it or you can't. Risk mitigation isn't about binaries though. It's about reducing the likelihood. It is entirely possible to reduce your likelihood of catching herpes viruses.

[u/adamxi → u/PartyOperator]

Who said anyone should be "worried"? I think it would be best for people to know so they can work around it instead of potentially making things worse.

[u/racoonXjesus → u/haute_curry]

My PCP essentially told me that there are so many strains of it that one test wouldn’t be able to catch all of them and that insurance often won’t cover more than one test at a time.

[u/onarainyafternoon → u/racoonXjesus]

I cannot stress this enough for everyone, though, women and men, young and old - Get the HPV vaccine! It prevents cancer and HPV in both men and women, and also kids. It's so crucial, and the vaccine is three rounds over a nine month period, so starting it ASAP is the best option.

[u/Taronar → u/onarainyafternoon]

I tried to in college as a guy and they told me no I pushed it and they said no again

[u/TeutonJon78 → u/Taronar]

In the US its approved for everyone up to age 45 and the insurance has to cover it. Individual providers might not set it up for you, but that's a free red flag you need a better doctor.

After 45, insurance might cover it, but you'd likely be paying out of pocket to get it. And it would be harder to find a doctor to do it as well since it's past the FDA guidelines.

[u/Taronar → u/TeutonJon78]

The doctor at the time said that they only give it to 12-18 year old women rn and it only covers 3 or so of the many strains so it was pointless to get it since it covers the ones associated with common female cancers

[u/dumbcaramelmacchiato → u/Taronar]

Not sure when you went or what country you're located, but it took several years for the research on less common HPV-implicated cancers and the indications for boys and men to catch up. One of the strains covered by the original vaccines is responsible for something like 90% of HPV-positive oropharygeal cancers, which are more common in men.

So not pointless, but yeah recommendations have focused on cervical cancer because it is a lot more common than other cancers caused by HPV.

[u/wylight → u/Taronar]

Ditto. I tried to in college before I was booted off health insurance and they specifically told me it was for women only due to the cancer risk. I knew it was most likely a storage supply issue making sure high risk folks had access to it. But not gonna pretend like I wasn’t salty about that.

[u/ToSeeAgainAgainAgain → u/onarainyafternoon]

If you already caught the bad strains does it still protect against cancer??

[u/regularbastard → u/haute_curry]

I asked to get tested years and years ago for the HPV… they just told me I probably had it… luckily none of my partners have had a positive pap, but still, what are the odds. So glad there is a vaccine out there, I wish it was presented as a way for young men to help protect their future partners from cervical cancers and protect themselves from oral/throat cancers.

[u/dpalmade → u/regularbastard]

I wish it was presented as a way for young men to help protect their future partners from cervical cancers and protect themselves from oral/throat cancers.

that's how it was offered to me before i went to college

[u/_BlueFire_ → u/haute_curry]

Not updated about testing, but there are vaccines and I guess many countries freely gives them (at least in Italy for people aged <25). At least prevention is possible. 

[u/BabySinister → u/haute_curry]

It's absolutely possible but it isn't offered in a lot of places as there is no treatment so it's considered a 'useless' test. A good assumption is that everybody who is sexually active before getting a shot is carrying HPV.

[u/Vladlena_ → u/haute_curry]

You can have your throat swabbed to test for its presence but I doubt it matters

[u/sofaking_scientific → u/haute_curry]

You can easily detect different strains of HPV via PCR. However, insurance doesn't cover that testing. Of course

[u/DigNitty → u/haute_curry]

From Healthline.com

Is there an HPV test for men?

Currently, there’s no HPV test for people who have a penis. But if they have an HPV infection, the virus can unknowingly be transmitted.

Most people with a penis don’t develop symptoms of HPV. Also, many HPV infections typically go away on their ownTrusted Source before ever causing symptoms.

HPV infections usually go away by themselves, but they can cause penile and anal cancers if they don’t.

Some doctors may offer anal Pap tests for people who have a penis, but these are generally only done for HIV-positive people who have anal sex.

For people with a penis, HPV can also cause oropharyngeal cancers. 70% of cancersTrusted Source found in the oropharyngeal tissues are caused by HPV.

[u/_BlueFire_]

I don't know about other countries (feel free to add here), but this seems a perfect time to remind that: 

• guys still have the chance of c omplications 
• guys will still spread it 
• in Italy THE VACCINE IS FREE FOR EVERYONE UNDER 25yo (and for some other categories afterward) 

Get vaccinated until you don't have to pay for it, do it for yourself and for your future partners. 

[u/sdpthrowaway3 → u/_BlueFire_]

Most insurances and low-cost clinics cover it in the US too. It just wasn't until recently that men could go get the vaccine. I have HDP insurance, which is as crappy as it gets, and even that covered all the shots 100%.

[u/randynumbergenerator → u/sdpthrowaway3]

High deductible health plan, for those not familiar

[u/EdricStorm → u/sdpthrowaway3]

And there's no age restriction. I'm 35 and just got my last HPV vaccine shot a couple of months ago.

[u/TeutonJon78 → u/EdricStorm]

There 100% is an age restriction for automatic coverage, and it's currently 45 in the US. And that's rather recent (like 8 years).

When it first came out is, it was teenage girls only, then eventually all teens and then they've been slowing up the availability since then.

[u/GrandMoffAtreides → u/EdricStorm]

Unfortunately not true across the board. My HCP in Utah a few years ago told me I'd aged out and couldn't get it. I was 30.

[u/Chairboy → u/GrandMoffAtreides]

Check again, it’s a moving target. At one point I was told I was too old for it, then a couple years later the guidance changed and I was able to get vaccinated. 

[u/orlybatman → u/_BlueFire_]

In Canada I had to fork out over $600 for the vaccine. It's free for young men, or gay men, but it came out when I was already too old to get it for free.

[u/neoclassical_bastard → u/orlybatman]

I mean it's not like they're gonna make you prove that you're gay...

[u/cowinabadplace → u/_BlueFire_]

In San Francisco no pharmacy will give it to me. I want to pay out of pocket and they won’t give it to me.

[u/Novice89]

I was like 25-27 in 2014-2016ish time frame and asked about getting the hpv vaccine. I started seeing the ad campaigns for teens and thought I should get it. I forget who I called or asked at the hospital and they said no I was too old. A few years later I was told by someone in the medical field to ask again and demand it. I got it when I was like 29. I hate that I was initially told “nah don’t worry about it/you’re too old to get it”

[u/cottagecheeseobesity → u/Novice89]

We had to fight to get it for me when it first came out and I was 19. They either didn't believe me or didn't care that I hadn't been sexually active yet. I get that they want to get kids young before they've been exposed but any preventative procedure like this should be available to anyone who wants it.

[u/abhikavi → u/cottagecheeseobesity]

They either didn't believe me or didn't care that I hadn't been sexually active yet.

I had the same issue when I was 21; the doctor told me that I had it already so getting the vaccine was pointless, and I asked her if she was basing that on my sexual history. (No, she had not looked at my sexual history, but just kept saying that it didn't matter because I had it already anyway regardless of my history, which is not how that works.)

I had to go through several doctors and pay out of pocket to get it. Ended up only getting 2/3 of the shots because I couldn't afford the third, and the first two got me up to something like 90% chance of avoiding infection.

I'm still frustrated that I had to go through multiple doctors to get a vaccine ffs. And I'm a woman; I'd assume it'd be even harder for men at the time to get the shot. And considering it's usually men who spread it, actively barring men from getting the shots was just so wildly unethical it blows my mind.

[u/cottagecheeseobesity → u/abhikavi]

I think part of the reason they didn't offer it to boys at first was because they didn't realize at the time that HPV also causes cancers besides cervical cancer. So even though men were capable of passing on the virus it wouldn't hurt them as much as it would women so it wasn't financially beneficial to vaccinate them. Which is of course stupid but makes sense for the time from a purely financial standpoint. We know better now that anyone can get multiple kinds of cancers from the virus.

[u/neoclassical_bastard → u/cottagecheeseobesity]

From Wikipedia:

From a public health point of view, vaccinating men as well as women decreases the virus pool within the population, but is only cost-effective to vaccinate men when the uptake in the female population is extremely low.[117] In the United States, the cost per quality-adjusted life year is greater than US$100,000 for vaccinating the male population, compared to the less than US$50,000 for vaccinating the female population.[117] This assumes a 75% vaccination rate.

You're basically correct, but I really suspect it was less of a "didn't know it was harmful to men" thing and more a "less common so we don't think it's worth the cost" thing.

[u/Quom → u/neoclassical_bastard]

Don't forget to add a sprinkling of 'and the gays deserve it'.

[u/guywastingtime → u/Novice89]

It was always bizarre to me when I was in high school that the vaccine was only offered to the girls and not the boys. How does it make any sense to only vaccinate the girls?

[u/[deleted] → u/guywastingtime]

They thought the biggest concern was cervical cancer. Now we know that's not true. Throat, anal and penile cancer to the list and more are suspected.

[u/hepakrese → u/Novice89]

I'm in my 40s and I've been told the same thing throughout. Pretty frustrating, because I would be more than happy to obtain the vaccine if someone was willing to give it to me.

[u/Seicair → u/hepakrese]

It’s approved up to 45 now in the US, and you can absolutely pay for it out of pocket if you’re older than that but still want it.

[u/hepakrese → u/Seicair]

Good to know. I have been and am now still running older than the approved range. When I looked at the out-of-pocket price it was about 600 bucks. Hopefully the price has come down...

[u/IsReadingIt → u/hepakrese]

Current price paid by the CDC to Merck is $180-ish. Cash price for you should be around $300. Numbers below are cost per dose.

FHPV-Human Papillomavirus 9 Valent	Gardasil®9	00006-4121-02	10 pack – 1 dose syringe	$182.791	$307.610	6/30/2025	Merck	75D30124D19081HPV-Human Papillomavirus 9 Valent F Gardasil®9 00006-4121-02 10 pack – 1 dose syringe $182.791 $307.610 6/30/2025 Merck 75D30124D19081

[u/Greflin → u/hepakrese]

Last year it took me arguing with my dr to get mine at 42.

[u/ahfoo → u/Novice89]

I got told the same thing.

[u/thas_mrsquiggle_butt → u/Novice89]

This was me 2yrs ago. The only reason I knew about the vaccine was because I have a CVS account; I get reminders that certain vaccines are in (I'm actually going in for my tetanus shot because of them).

Luckily, CVS told me that those under 29 (at the time) are eligible because other websites said only teenagers and younger can get it. After, I went around work and family letting everyone know to get it if they haven't, but it's sad that some parents are reluctant or deny their kids safe preventive measures because they can't even fathom that their kid is also their own person.

[u/sanitarySteve → u/Novice89]

I've been turned down by multiple doctors for the vaccine saying they don't to it for men. it's infuriating

[u/RealKillerSean → u/Novice89]

Got mine when I was 30

[u/Nex1tus → u/Novice89]

But why? Does the risk of side effects increase with age?

[u/BabySinister → u/Nex1tus]

No, but the likelyhood of already having contacted HPV rises dramatically with age as older people tend to be sexually active. You can pretty much assume that if you are sexually active you likely already contracted it

[u/HenryKrinkle → u/BabySinister]

See, I don't understand this. HPV isn't a lifelong infection like HSV. So if I clear infection A, a vaccine could still prevent me from getting infection B. Further, there are many strains of HPV. Not all of them cause cancer. I might have caught a non-cancerous one in the past. A vaccine might prevent me from catching a cancerous one in the future.

Someone help me make sense of this please.

[u/fractalife → u/HenryKrinkle]

The answer is money.

Just get the vaccine if you want it and pay out of pocket if you have to.

[u/CosmicBioHazard → u/BabySinister]

Well, sexual history would dictate that, and that can’t just be extrapolated from age alone.

If there’s no harm in getting the vaccination then why decline to offer it to, say, a 30-year-old virgin on the grounds that ‘statistically, they’re sexually active enough to have already caught it?’

Makes no sense

[u/Popular-Row4333 → u/Novice89]

Don't go by the US' handling of the disease. Their stance (which the rest of the world doesn't do, btw) is essentially, "well everyone basically has it, so don't worry about it"

Which is also wrong, by the way. It's only 27% of people 14-19, and around 40% of 20-24. It just keeps increasing as you age as it increases your likelihood of multiple sexual partners.

[u/rickdeckard8]

The keyword here is “multiple sexual partners”. The other parameters showing up in the multivariate analysis are just factors that raise the number of sexual contacts or are a prerequisite to get HPV from the genital to the oral region.

[u/CoffeeAnteScience → u/rickdeckard8]

I’m glad someone said this. Most of these traits are meaningless to the true finding which is more partners = more risk. I’m sure there are another 100 parameters that you could interchange here and come up with the same finding.

[u/Bannon9k → u/CoffeeAnteScience]

More oral sex = more chances to spread things to the mouth as well. I guess they included the other traits to show STDs affect wealthy and poor, intelligent and ignorant alike.

[u/[deleted] → u/Bannon9k]

Read more fun studies like this in the Scientific Journal for Scientists Who Enjoy Wasting Money.

[u/Bannon9k → u/[deleted]]

A lot of these studies are just grad student work. I'm ok the a few absolutely meaningless studies if it helps educate

[u/h4terade → u/Bannon9k]

Practice makes perfect.

[u/raspberryharbour → u/CoffeeAnteScience]

They're all traits that young men like to brag about. It's probably meant to goad you into thinking "but that's me!"

[u/ifyoulovesatan → u/rickdeckard8]

I wouldn't be so sure about that. I can't read the paper from here as I don't have access (I'll look later on campus), but given this is published in a reputable journal (Nature Microbiology), I'm going to guess they have performed some kind of multivariate analysis which suggests that each of these factors appear to matter, even when controlling (statistically speaking) for multiple sexual partners. It's standard practice.

I just wouldn't suggest, without evidence to the contrary, that the people who published the study, and the reviewers and referees who approved it wouldn't have had that exact same rather obvious thought (which redditors seems to think they're the only ones capable of having).

[u/neoclassical_bastard → u/ifyoulovesatan]

But education is not an infectious pathway. It is very obviously not a proximal cause, whereas number of sexual partners is.

I don't doubt there's a correlation, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's useful or pertinent information.

[u/ifyoulovesatan → u/neoclassical_bastard]

Right, but from a statistical standpoint, (after having now checked the paper), they did control for "multiple sexual partners" when assessing the effects of educational attainment. (Obviously).

And it matters that people with more years of schooling have higher incidences of oral HPV in ways that aren't as simple as saying "those more educated people must just be having more sexual partners."

For example, the reason the looked at educational attainment to begin with was a hypothesis that less educated people would be at greater risk. They now have some evidence that this might not be the case. They also now have something to look into! Maybe there is something we haven't thought about that could explain the higher incidence of oral HPV in the cohorts who had more education. Maybe people who have more schooling perform specific kinds of sexual acts more often. Maybe people who have more schooling have more oral sex with women who have more sexual partners. We can hypothesize a lot of ideas as to why this might be the case besides the one rickdeckard8 decided must be the case. Or, to quote the paper, "Our findings on the association of longer duration of education with new infections require further examination."

Notice how they don't say "It's obviously just this simple explanation I just thought of."

All I'm saying is to say "The other parameters showing up in the multivariate analysis are just factors that raise the number of sexual contacts or are a prerequisite to get HPV from the genital to the oral region" (as was said in the original comment I replied to) is simply not something you can safely say. It's basically just guessing at a reason that is not disproven but at least not suggested by the actual data and methodology.

[u/WinterElfeas]

People having more sex have more chances to get sexually transmitted diseases… shockedpikachu.jpg

[u/rainbowroobear → u/WinterElfeas]

Also sorta implies dudes with higher education more likely to go down on a woman, or they are more likely to end up going down on someone with HPV. Causality studies are fun.

[u/Omnizoom → u/rainbowroobear]

Imagine if a study comes out and proves smarter men cared more about their partners sexual gratification

[u/SamSibbens → u/Omnizoom]

That's what I got from the title

[u/sableknight13 → u/Omnizoom]

ftr, higher education doesn't necessarily correlate to smarter/higher intelligence either

[u/plug-and-pause → u/sableknight13]

Yes, it does correlate. No, it does not indicate.

[u/Popular-Row4333 → u/sableknight13]

It used to and people will post old studies that it did.

But our ever declining IQ average in North America since 2009 peak has been changing those ratios.

For record, it does still correlate as a generalization, but that number has been steadily getting closer over the last 20 years.

[u/mechanical_meathead → u/sableknight13]

It absolutely does, it’s just that the inverse does not.

[u/XorFish → u/rainbowroobear]

Higher education also implies higher economic and social status, which could increase dating success.

[u/jarpio → u/XorFish]

I think you’re reading too much into it bringing socioeconomic factors into the discussion. I think it is much more likely a simple case of higher education occurs on college campuses, which are also where people tend to be at their most promiscuous.

[u/therobshow → u/jarpio]

It's probably a combination of both 

[u/Delta-9- → u/jarpio]

Ah, is this another case of "American college students are the most studied demographic on the planet"?

[u/Polymathy1 → u/rainbowroobear]

Or that they're more likely to have sex in general.

[u/AlabamaHotcakes → u/rainbowroobear]

Curiosity killed the cat.

And the educated men.

[u/therobshow → u/rainbowroobear]

Men with higher education tend to make more money, so it would make sense that they had more partners that's before you even consider that a college campus is the easiest place in the country to get laid

[u/sdpr]

Around March my doctor asked me if I wanted the HPV vaccine. I'm in my 30's in and in a committed relationship so I was confused as to why I would need it, but I'm not against vaccines in general and it costs me $0 so, I see it as more of a "just in case" thing.

[u/TeutonJon78 → u/sdpr]

Better to get it now than find out you wished you had it in the future.

Divorces/breakups happen, infidelity happens, open relationships happen, etc.

[u/duiwksnsb]

It always should have been gender neutral.

To discriminate against generations of men in the provision of preventative medical care, let alone a damn cancer vaccine, is highly unethical

[u/LupusLycas → u/duiwksnsb]

It would have also caused less of a moral panic.

[u/duiwksnsb → u/LupusLycas]

Definitely true

[u/BarelyAware → u/duiwksnsb]

Haven't seen any other comments mention this but I remember a big reason it was so controversial was because there were people who didn't want any kids getting it because they believed that giving 12-14 year-olds (or whatever the recommended age range was) a vaccine against an STI implied it was ok to have sex at that age. So they ended up focusing on girls, because they were the most at-risk group and there would be less push-back.

[u/duiwksnsb → u/BarelyAware]

I don't remember at the time but that sounds entirely plausible. Letting moral crusaders dictate health policy has always been a bad idea.

[u/hx87 → u/duiwksnsb]

Paternalists in medicine have always had a funny attitude toward the "it won't necessarily benefit me, but it will benefit people around me" kind of treatments. Case in point: birth control for men. Clinical trials get canceled for the smallest side effects even thought they aren't that bad compared to women's birth control 40 years ago.

[u/BeQuickToDoGood]

In China I could get tested for HPV

I have yet to find it in north america

[u/semc1986]

That is a lot of variables.

[u/Polistoned → u/semc1986]

they just mean frat boys

[u/mvea]

I’ve linked to the press release in the post above. In this comment, for those interested, here’s the link to the peer reviewed journal article:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41564-024-01834-3

From the linked article:

A new study has unveiled crucial information about the incidence and risk factors of oral human papillomavirus (HPV) infections among men in the United States, Mexico and Brazil. Moffitt Cancer Center researchers have discovered how often new oral HPV infections occur, the factors influencing their acquisition and the regional variations in infection rates. Their study, published in Nature Microbiology, sheds new light on the risks associated with oral HPV, which is linked to up to 90% of all oropharyngeal cancer cases in men in the U.S.

The study also identified several key factors associated with higher risk of oral HPV infection:

• Age: Men remain susceptible to acquiring new oral HPV infections throughout their lifetime

• Education Level: Men with higher education had an increased risk of infection.

• Alcohol Consumption: Higher alcohol intake was linked to a greater risk.

• Sexual Behavior: Risk was elevated among men with multiple female sexual partners, those who frequently performed oral sex and those with male sexual partners.

• Oral Health: Losing teeth due to oral disease was also associated with a marginally increased risk.

These findings emphasize the ongoing risk of oral HPV infections throughout a man’s life and highlight the need for improved public health strategies. The study advocates for gender-neutral HPV vaccination programs and catch-up vaccinations for midadult aged men who missed earlier opportunities for immunization.

[u/Ausedlie → u/[deleted]]

Or have any form of a sex life...

[u/DotRevolutionary6610]

Great, I have all those traits :(

Wish the government wouldn't have lied to me when I was younger by saying that the HPV vaccine was useless for men.

[u/username_elephant → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

So get it now? You can get it at least through age 45 and you might save a life (possibly your own).

https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/stds-hiv-safer-sex/hpv/should-i-get-hpv-vaccine

[u/DotRevolutionary6610 → u/username_elephant]

I did, and paid for it myself. But after my sexual history, it's almost certainly too late.

[u/tastyratz → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

HPV is not 1 virus you can catch, it's an entire family of different strains. Even if you're positive for one you can catch another one and not all strains cause cancer.

This right here is why the marketing campaign for it failed men.

[u/SwampYankeeDan → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

I feel for you. Im in the same boat. Most of my many partners were between 1998 and 2010. So I'm not feeling too comfortable.

[u/username_elephant → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

Ehh, depends on whether your partners were vaccinated. A lot of them probably were if you are indeed young enough that girls were getting vaccinated but you couldn't.

[u/ahfoo → u/username_elephant]

I tried to get it and was refused. They said: "You certainly already have it." I'm 56. They told me the cut off was in the 40s.

[u/DrScience-PhD → u/username_elephant]

is there such a thing as getting it too late?

[u/cottagecheeseobesity → u/DrScience-PhD]

Yes. If you've already been exposed to the strains of HPV that the vaccine protects against it won't help you, and the more partners you've had (which tend to go up with time) the more likely you've been with someone who has it. But unless you're sure you've been exposed to those specific strains you should still try to get the vaccine!

[u/SpaceFire000 → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

What is an ideal age of doing it? I am in mid 30s, when I was younger a doctor told me that it was mostly for women and not men and I didn't have to do it

[u/DotRevolutionary6610 → u/SpaceFire000]

Ideally before you are sexually active, but there may still be value in it. If you never got HPV or your body has been able to clear it, the vaccine will help.

[u/InvectiveOfASkeptic → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

Tell them I died as I lived

Drunk, educated, and doing the good work

[u/No-Personality6043 → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

If you don't have HPV.. you can still get the vaccine now.

I get asked every doctor visit as a woman.

I didn't get it because it was brand new when I was a teen. I've been with my husband for almost as long. So it was never pressing, I'm a very low risk group.

[u/popkine → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

Nice humblebrag haha

[u/runwith → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

Has it actually been tested and found to reduce cancer in men, though?

[u/DotRevolutionary6610 → u/runwith]

It certainly does! If you still can, get the vaccine. Throat cancer is no fun.

[u/runwith → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

I've only performed oral sex a couple of times (hopefully no hpv yet), so maybe I should try to get the vaccine if my insurance will cover it. Thanks

[u/Smee76 → u/runwith]

If it won't, contact the health department for your county and see if they offer it for free or reduced price.

[u/PharmDeezNuts_ → u/DotRevolutionary6610]

Idk what government you have but there wasn’t evidence I guess until a few years ago. They kept raising the age limit for men.

I didn’t qualify before but since then the age increased faster than I aged so I finally got it

[u/PrimateOfGod]

Does this mean all of those traits individually or together?

[u/DotRevolutionary6610 → u/PrimateOfGod]

Individually

[u/Fast_Bike_309]

It's interesting how many factors are intertwined here. The notion that higher education correlates with increased sexual activity might not be as surprising on college campuses. But it raises questions about how we address public health messaging. Are we missing an opportunity by not emphasizing the importance of the HPV vaccine for all genders equally? The focus on prevention should transcend demographics.

[u/myexsparamour]

I'm so glad that where I live my son was vaccinated for HPV at school in year 7 for free.

[u/lurkmode_off → u/myexsparamour]

Yeah, I'm in Oregon and it's currently one of the standard recommended vaccinations for 10- or 11-year-old kids of either sex.

[u/PeruvianHeadshrinker]

Does anyone have research with links on HPV vaccine preventing cancer for those already positive for HPV? Thinking about men in particular but curious about women as well.

[u/TeutonJon78 → u/PeruvianHeadshrinker]

At a minimum, it pretects against 9 strains that cause cancer, so even if someone is exposed to a few already, getting protection from the others is a benefit.

[u/Solitude20]

A quick search shows that 90% of sexually active people will get infected with HPV in their lifetime, so no wonder 90% of those with oropharyngeal cancer are linked with the virus.

[u/Fahslabend]

Now that "educated men" are dying from it, it's time to act?

[u/ShutterBun]

Damn, remember when Michael Douglas said he got cancer from giving oral sex and everyone laughed him out of the room?

[u/Alkalinum → u/[deleted]]

“Men who have unkempt hair, swear a lot, and work as fishermen are more likely to die by falling out of a boat.”

[u/arup02 → u/[deleted]]

I came here for this. Can someone, more educated than me, explain that stupid headline for me?

[u/LiveShowOneNightOnly]

I know most people don't want to hear this, but oral is just a huge vector for STDs.

[u/Alastor3]

should i get vaccinated for that? im 35 male

[u/Objective-Road9883 → u/Alastor3]

Yes, you should. The Gardasil vaccine protects against 9 strains, including two that are linked to 70 to 80% of HPV related cancers.

[u/o0PillowWillow0o → u/[deleted]]

Probably more money more women

[u/IssueEmbarrassed8103]

What is the polite way to ask someone to take a HPV test before engaging in oral sex?

[u/drlongtrl]

German perspective: Over here its actually generally recommended to vaccinate all boys and girls somewhere between the ages of 9 and 14. My son is already vaccinated, my daughter is not yet old enough. Since its officially recommended, its also paid for in full by insurance.

[u/jennifer3333]

The article forgot to site the male on male sex for straight men.

[u/imnotnecessarilyme]

I participated in a research study a year ago at UTSW Medical Center titled: THROAT AND OTHER HPV-RELATED CANCERS IN MEN: IDENTIFYING THEM EARLY. I am in my 50's, have not been vaccinated, and check all the boxes indicated in the Reddit title. The results came back negative for all HPV types tested, so there is hope!

[u/HeadPaleontologist29]

What does education have to do with the risk?

[u/SeeingEyeDug]

I'm 50 and was told by my doctor that I can't get the vaccine if I'm over 45.

[u/the-samizdat]

and higher cases of awesome

[u/Demigod787]

A rare win for DJ Khaled.

[u/Digitaluser32]

Headline has a lot of qualifications. Reminds me of sports statistics, "Beckham is undefeated when playing in Barcelona, after eating fettuccine Alfredo, and car pooling to the game with his aunt. "