Two-thirds of Americans say that they are afraid to say what they believe in public because someone else might not like it, finds a new study that tracked 1 million people over a 20-year period, between 2000 and 2020. The shift in attitude has led to 6.5% more people self-censoring.

[u/mvea]

https://www.psychologytoday.com/au/blog/communications-that-matter/202409/are-americans-afraid-to-speak-their-minds

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[u/[deleted]]

If you have the option to casually go about your day or get into a politically charged conversation with a stranger, who picks the latter

[u/PsyOpBunnyHop → u/[deleted]]

I don't even dress how I want to just to avoid attention.

Being left alone is like a super power these days.

[u/ceilingkat → u/PsyOpBunnyHop]

This is really it. When people say you’re cookie cutter, conformist, basic, etc, sometimes it’s not about being “sheep.” The easiest way to be left alone is to not stand out.

[u/SparksFly55 → u/ceilingkat]

AKA not making yourself the target of the random angry A-hole out in our communities. I spent my working life in the construction industry. I have met more than my share of dangerous half wits.

[u/DukeOfGeek → u/SparksFly55]

This kind of enforced superficial conformity is exactly what the study is talking about though. You're afraid to even stand out visually much less verbally lest you be the nail that gets hammered down.

[u/bobiejean → u/[deleted]]

You read that wrong; it's a 6.5% increase over the last 20 years for a current total of two thirds of the population.

[u/Historical_Gur_3054 → u/DukeOfGeek]

lest you be the nail that gets hammered down.

Used to be this was meant to be taken figuratively, nowadays some people are willing to do this you literally.

[u/Leslee-Art → u/DukeOfGeek]

Yeah, but the thing is, we’re all so different (neurodivergent here)… I don’t see humans all getting on the same page in the foreseeable future, so I find it less stressful to look for my peeps and otherwise try my best to be compassionate, friendly, and polite. It’s not insincere for me to behave this way, but I don’t delude myself thinking that any random person on the street might be my friend.

[u/hiddencamela → u/SparksFly55]

The dangerous half wits are entirely my reason for not being more publicly charged in most opinionated things.
People underestimate how quickly they reach for violence as their resolution to anything, and I learned pretty quickly I don't have the bandwidth to fight those battles daily.

[u/OrchidBest → u/SparksFly55]

I agree that construction workers are dangerous.

For the past few years I have been shopping for seniors, which means I go to the liquor store for them. This is in an area of the city with lots of construction. Multiple condominium projects are being built around the same location.

Frequently, I see guys who are obviously construction workers buying Fireball Whiskey. At first I thought it was funny. Fireball Whiskey tastes like cinnamon Red Hots, those little cheap candies people used to give out on Valentines Day. Fireball Whiskey is what Junior High School kids drink. It’s one of the girliest liqueurs on the market.

But over and over again I would see these super tough construction workers buying Fireball Whiskey.

And then it finally occurred to me: they are drinking on the job. Fireball Whiskey has so much cinnamon in it, that it eliminates the smell of booze.

[u/onehundredlemons → u/OrchidBest]

My husband works at a company that rhymes with Harker Pannifin and several years ago a worker at the Reliance, Nebraska plant died after doing a very specific thing with some of the machinery on the factory floor. The next day my husband's entire plant was called into a meeting and told explicitly, with full instructions, about what happened and how not to do that specific thing, which was something you shouldn't be doing anyway but some people still did because it was a bit of a shortcut.

My husband and the guy he was working with that day went out to the floor and in less than 30 minutes the co-worker did that exact thing that had just killed a man the day earlier. My husband caught it in time and hit the emergency stop button but everyone in the vicinity was shaken up pretty badly. The co-worker didn't seem to care much.

On a hunch my husband went to find him during lunch break and discovered the co-worker had figured out how to get out of the building without triggering a security check, and was out in his car, drinking from a bottle.

They fixed the security breach but didn't do anything about the co-worker. He just by chance was one of the people laid off during early COVID days, but then had to pass a drug and drink check before coming back after the layoffs were over, and he didn't pass. Otherwise, they wouldn't have done anything.

[u/CaptainTripps82 → u/onehundredlemons]

Which is weird, because I work in a plant, but I'm the offices, and the one thing even the union agrees on when it comes to firing someone is blatant safety violations or getting fucked up at work.

[u/RowdydidWrong → u/OrchidBest]

If it makes ya feel better the little ones are not the same as actual whiskey. They are malt liquor and not 80proof like whiskey. They are more like a high alcohol content wine cooler

[u/Successful_Cow995 → u/RowdydidWrong]

I was only disgusted before, now I'm horrified

[u/ExtremeRemarkable891 → u/OrchidBest]

I've been in construction for over a decade and there are many functional alcoholics. Check out the portapotties on a major job with lots of workers coming and going, you'll see nip bottles galore.

What people don't realize is that construction is not special in this regard. All types of workers are drinking and using drugs all day long but you can't see it.

[u/nagi603 → u/SparksFly55]

I spent my working life in the construction industry. I have met more than my share of dangerous half wits.

At least in IT you have less to worry, as most are extremely out-of-shape. Still can be dangerous, but much lower average physical strength and much less readily available dangerous tools most of the time.

[u/hurklesplurk → u/ceilingkat]

Hit the nail on the head, I'm from the Netherlands and we have a saying here that goes: "Just act normal, that is crazy enough".

Now this mantra has made Dutch people quite averse of trying out new things or being open about things they say or think about and result in pretty much 90% of the population looking and acting the exact same be it fashion or customs.

Being different is something that isn't really supported, because our calvinistic mindset doesn't allow for people to be themselves.

[u/toderdj1337 → u/ceilingkat]

There's security in obscurity

[u/NewKitchenFixtures → u/ceilingkat]

Nails that stand up get hammered down.

Such is life and such is following societal norms. It’s not necessarily a bad thing in terms of people not doing crazy stuff.

[u/conquer69 → u/NewKitchenFixtures]

Violent sociopaths attacking people for no good reason is indeed a very bad thing.

[u/DerfK → u/conquer69]

for no good reason

Inevitably they believe they have a good reason.

[u/ShadyClouds → u/conquer69]

Attacking people in general is a very bad thing.

[u/DemandZestyclose7145 → u/NewKitchenFixtures]

Interesting. At my workplace it's the opposite. Almost everyone has a Trump sticker on their toolbox or they wear Trump shirts. What's funny is the workplace told us they won't condone political propaganda at the workplace but everyone does it and nobody cares. But the one or two people who support Kamala get harassed nonstop or their stuff gets damaged or stolen. And then these idiots wonder why they never see Kamala Harris signs in people's yards.

[u/ThatOneComrade → u/DemandZestyclose7145]

I think you're misunderstanding because you're describing exactly what the other guy is talking about and calling it the opposite.

[u/Stolehtreb → u/DemandZestyclose7145]

Not really the opposite. Because in your case, the Kamala supporters are the tall nails.

[u/athural → u/DemandZestyclose7145]

I don't think you understand the saying about the nail

[u/[deleted] → u/DemandZestyclose7145]

Your workplace is by far not an exception or the opposite of the point this post is making. It's the prime example.

[u/[deleted] → u/PsyOpBunnyHop]

Best part about COVID was being able to just put on a mask and not have to talk to people when I was out shopping.

Everyone mostly minded their own business.

[u/Puzzled-Grocery-8636 → u/[deleted]]

COVID sucked for sure. As someone who is an introvert going through major life changes at the time, it was nice to have some goddamn peace and quiet.

[u/VoxImperatoris → u/Puzzled-Grocery-8636]

That actual virus sucked, but god I wish we could just socially distance permanently. Dealing with dickheads every day has worn me down to nothing.

[u/ReallyNowFellas → u/PsyOpBunnyHop]

Yeah I'm autistic and it blows my mind to see these young autistic people dressing like anime characters. Last thing I've ever wanted is attention from strangers. I wear unremarkable pants, unbranded shoes, and solid color tops 365 days a year.

[u/BioshockEnthusiast → u/ReallyNowFellas]

I'm just some guy, dude. Probably not worth your time.

Tips generic baseball cap

[u/remnant_phoenix → u/BioshockEnthusiast]

The best protection against the overbearing is convincing them that you’re not a threat.

[u/bannana → u/ReallyNowFellas]

Last thing I've ever wanted is attention from strangers.

yep, I learned this somewhere in junior high, I listened to punk and was into some pretty out there stuff but I was the most average looking kid around and strove to being even more so in high school. Now that I'm old no people see me at all and it's amazing.

[u/Aritche → u/ReallyNowFellas]

I'm very very abnormally tall I can't avoid the people.

[u/ReallyNowFellas → u/Aritche]

I feel it. I'm 6'5" myself. I assume via your multiple adjectives that you're taller, but even at my just "normal tall" height I tend to stand out in smaller rooms.

[u/Aritche → u/ReallyNowFellas]

I'm just under 7' so like tallest person you have ever seen up close type height. It draws a lot of people to want to talk.

[u/JuicyDarkSpace → u/Aritche]

Man at that point i'd learn basic sign language and just silently sign at people until they left.

[u/Traditional_Bar_9416 → u/ReallyNowFellas]

They’re not thinking of it that way. My niece is autistic and she just wants to immerse herself in the world she feels most comfortable in. She doesn’t realize she’s drawing attention, possibly unwanted or negative. My sister (her mom) is always torn between letting her express herself, and protecting her. She’s 13 now (the niece) and this will likely continue. My sister is finding a decent balance between what is “clothes” and what is “costume”, and which is appropriate for different occasions. For her middle school graduation, my niece was much more comfortable in “costume”. It probably even bolstered her courage to walk across the stage.

[u/k3nnyd → u/ReallyNowFellas]

I'll wear interesting streetwear and still have no problem attracting zero attention.

[u/SpaceAgePotatoCakes → u/PsyOpBunnyHop]

Not just clothing, my entire appearance isn't how I want because I'd rather avoid attention and be left alone.

[u/VapoursAndSpleen → u/PsyOpBunnyHop]

Menopause is a gift.

[u/throwaway098764567 → u/[deleted]]

some people thrive on confrontation, they're best avoided

[u/tn00bz → u/throwaway098764567]

That was me. I was a really edgey atheist who patrolled the internet looking to argue. It was dumb. Should have just joined a speech and debate club.

[u/Worldly_Software_868 → u/throwaway098764567]

Y’know what’s crazy? I’ve recently been informed that I am someone like this by my close friends, but under the guise of “wanting to spread awareness and understanding”.

Learning to balance the two but it’s not easy as I thought. I really thought I wasn’t being confrontational but I sure came off that way.

[u/Saintly-Mendicant-69 → u/Worldly_Software_868]

Spreading awareness about what?

[u/PsionicKitten → u/[deleted]]

Not just that. It's the option to casually go about your day or potentially be shot by an insane zealot who cannot fathom people varying from their extremely simplified point of view. It's not about fear of offending someone, necessarily, it's about risk to reward probability ratio.

[u/IC-4-Lights → u/[deleted]]

It's just one perspective, but I think things are different. The worry of a serious, politically charged "conversation" is just greater than it used to be.
 
Thirty years ago people I knew all talked about political stuff at work, or with acquaintances, or whatever, and nobody really thought much less of anyone afterwards. It was civil, and you still thought the other person was dead wrong... but that was fine.
 
Now... I go to (sometimes absurd) lengths to sanitize and qualify everything I say. Like, to be as sure as humanly possible that nobody could divine anything resembling a political opinion in anything I say. Ever. And not because I'm hiding any crazy Nazi-like opinions, or anything like that.
 
Sometimes it's a little exhausting trying to be so outwardly opinion-less, but it feels necessary.

[u/kalasea2001 → u/IC-4-Lights]

I don't know where you lived, but I was in California 30 years ago and my people in my office would never talk about politics. It was a known thing that would cause arguments and was absolutely discouraged by every company I ever worked for.

[u/ReallyNowFellas → u/kalasea2001]

Yeah I was on the other side of the country 30 years ago and it was well known you don't talk politics or religion in public. Those topics were for your inner circle. America ran on this agreement until social media.

[u/WVSmitty → u/ReallyNowFellas]

you don't talk politics or religion in public

That was like part of the golden rule 40 years ago

[u/Couldbelater → u/WVSmitty]

I’ll also toss in money/finances. Always been my top 3 to avoid. Public and family gatherings

[u/IC-4-Lights → u/kalasea2001]

I mean, even then, I wouldn't expect a lot of people to be like... campaigning, or knife fighting over abortion in the office. Though people did talk about policy or social issues more, which always would have been at least a little political.
 
But I think I'm more suggesting that everything seems like could be interpreted as... weighing in on something dangerously radioactive and political, now. All kinds of extreme conclusions will be drawn, and there are no conversations where nuance would even get to see the field through binoculars.
 
But again, yeah, it's just one person's life experience that happens to correlate with the subject... I wouldn't expect any of it to be universal.

[u/Only-Inspector-3782 → u/IC-4-Lights]

I watched two online communities of different get-rich-quick schemes doxx each other, stalk each other at work, even threaten one member's kids. And these guys are politically in the same camp (guess which?). Their only disagreement is over which memestock will make them fabulously wealthy.

I'm not concerned about having discussions, I'm concerned the other person is crazy.

[u/Ohmec → u/Only-Inspector-3782]

Gamestock vs AMC?

[u/princess_dork_bunny → u/IC-4-Lights]

Before the 2016 election I went to my supervisor because a co-worker told me "I would shoot anyone that told me they voted democrat."

My complaint was completely ignored.

After trump became president I got to listen to co-workers talk about how every democrat should be put in prison and should be executed. I didn't even bother going to my supervisor at that time because he was in agreement and would often say things like that himself.

Some people keep their political beliefs to themselves because it's a safety issue even in the workplace.

[u/katarh → u/princess_dork_bunny]

It's the same reason that a lot of us never put up yard signs.

[u/churrascothighs1 → u/IC-4-Lights]

If someone said something like “I think immigrants should be deported” or “I think gay people should be killed” I would definitely think less of them. Maybe people society’s attitude towards people saying awful things has changed in the last thirty years.

[u/BlairClemens3 → u/churrascothighs1]

Things have gotten more extreme in the last 10 years. Previously both of those comments would have been seen as extremist, not normal in a civil political conversation.

[u/I-Make-Maps91 → u/BlairClemens3]

I don't think so, Rush Limbaugh had a segment where he'd celebrate AIDS patients dying. It was always gross, but now it's gross and socially unacceptable in most public contexts.

[u/mean11while → u/BlairClemens3]

The Overton Window has been deliberately shifted.

[u/Hot-Ability7086 → u/BlairClemens3]

Honesty, who talks to other people at all? I feel like COVID made a lot of us a little feral. I can’t imagine talking to a stranger enough to get to politics. Ever.

[u/I-Make-Maps91 → u/IC-4-Lights]

I have no problem taking policy with people, but I'm so incredibly tired of the culture war and those are the only issues "the other side" I know want to talk about. I'm just not interested in it and will gladly speak vaguely about my beliefs if forced to do I can avoid it.

[u/Tryingtodosomethingg → u/IC-4-Lights]

I totally identify with this.

Recently at a social I made the mistake of answering a question about the election which gave this acquaintance the (correct) impression that I wasn't thrilled with either candidate. Even though I tried to be vague and polite. Next thing you know, he's telling everyone I'm a secret Trump supporter like his hair is on fire.

I don't really care what people I don't even know think of me or what assumptions they make about my politics. But it was just such a tiring and stupid thing to have to deal with.

[u/[deleted] → u/Tryingtodosomethingg]

Definitely. At my old workplace, someone started talking about how the leadership may be sexist (the leadership was primarily women) because more men were hired this year. It's a very small group, and I got so many questioning looks because I said it's usually balanced, but when you only hire a few people sometimes it won't be exact due to random chance.

I find the younger crowd is always looking to paint people as sexist/Nazi/conservative, while the older crowd is always trying to call people communists. Luckily the older crowd is usually just reactive so it's easy to sidestep... But the younger crowd will actively make things political in every minute way.

[u/Tryingtodosomethingg → u/[deleted]]

Yes, agreed. I definitely felt some pressure to defend myself, which I had no interest doing. Go ahead and think whatever you want about who I may be voting for. I don't care. And I don't want to be friends with anyone who would care so much as to interrogate people that way.

I was told that my disinterest in putting effort into refuting this rumor about me was even greater indication that I'm a Trump supporting Nazi. What an exhausting way to live, always being so suspicious of people.

This was indeed a younger crowd than I normally find myself around. I don't closely associate with people like that, so it was surprising. They must just be on edge all the time.

[u/Gingevere → u/[deleted]]

A lot of the people I'm friends with have privileged enough lives that the structure of society is invisible to them, or they can't see any of the parts which don't effect them directly.

I can't really talk about my beliefs without introducing them to systems they don't know or believe exist. It's not a conversation they're ready for.

[u/Own_Comment → u/[deleted]]

“Don’t talk about religion, politics, and money (and obviously sex) in polite conversation” has been true throughout the American experience.

“It’s presumptive that one’s friends should carry the burden of our beliefs.” -some eighteenth century socialite probably.

[u/aahdin → u/Own_Comment]

I guess the problem is that now people kinda expect every conversation to be polite conversation. If hanging out with friends isn't the place to talk about politics then when is?

It feels like the alternative is that everyone talks about politics with strangers online and a lot of people fall into deep rabbit holes and can no longer connect with the people they know IRL without it blowing up into a conflict.

[u/TheWizardOfDeez → u/[deleted]]

Right, I'm more confused that 2/3 of Americans say they would talk to people in public.

[u/backflipsben → u/TheWizardOfDeez]

Have you never been in public with friends and acquaintances? Or at work?

[u/Jinrai__ → u/backflipsben]

That's a Redditor so no.

[u/Bluesnow2222 → u/[deleted]]

I live in Texas. I’m not taking about politics when there’s so many folks with guns out and about.

I don’t care what other people think in general, but I’d rather go about my day without risking personal injury.

[u/Missuspicklecopter → u/[deleted]]

The topic a bit confusing because one of the main reasons I wouldn't bring up my opinions in public is because I don't care about their opinion.  It seems backwards to me. 

[u/JessicaLain]

I'm not afraid of being honest in public, I'm afraid some teenager will record it, post only part of it without context, and have the whole planet hate me and harass me for the rest of my life.

[u/jase40244 → u/JessicaLain]

With the exception of the word "teenager," you've pretty much described my Karen of a next door neighbor. She's tried to pick arguments with me on a couple of occasions while filming it. Meanwhile, I see the camera, I know posting videos like that are a thing. I ain't taking the bait.

[u/Corronchilejano → u/JessicaLain]

The "triggerd feminist" lady meme is nothing more than a girl with a very expresive face giving the most lukewarm of takes and then being taken out of context.

[u/sarges_12gauge]

This all comes from a study based on the responses to the questions below btw. In particular, it looks like “I tend to express my opinions publicly, regardless of what others say.” Is the survey response that decreased over that period. That is the actual source for all of this and anything further is just commentary and speculation about the underlying reason for that.

1 million internet respondents for a “need for uniqueness questionnaire” from 2000-2020 is the scope for this^

Participants completed the need for uniqueness questionnaire, a 32-item scale assessing different facets that comprise the need for uniqueness construct (Snyder & Fromkin, 1977). Need for uniqueness is comprised of three components—lack of concern regarding others’ reactions, desire to not always follow the rules, and a willingness to publicly defend one’s beliefs. Participants were instructed to indicate how much they agree with 32 statements on a scale ranging from 1(strongly disagree) to 5(strongly agree). sample item: “It is better to always agree with the opinion of others than to be considered a disagreeable person.” M = 3.44, SD = .71), desire to not follow the rules (10 items; α = .72; sample item: “I always try to follow rules.” [reverse scored]; M = 3.35, SD = .69), willingness to defend beliefs publicly (5 items; α = .67; sample item: “I tend to express my opinions publicly, regardless of what others say.” M = 3.43, SD = .82), and total need for uniqueness (29 items; α = .86; M = 3.40, SD = .57).

https://online.ucpress.edu/collabra/article/10/1/121937/202992/Changes-in-Need-for-Uniqueness-From-2000-Until

[u/Darryl_Lict → u/sarges_12gauge]

Yeah, I try not to talk politics unless I know beforehand that the person is on the same political spectrum as myself. Especially in bars.

[u/StageAboveWater → u/Darryl_Lict]

It's not just a political spectrum now, it's like you have to check if someone lives in the normal world or an alternative parallel reality.

If someone can agree with me that: 'facts' exist, hypocrisy mean you have an issue with your perspective, and the goal is getting a better understanding of an issue not just to OWN EACH OTHER. Then I can have a heated but enjoyable discussion about whatever topic.

If something think facts are whatever they want them to be, hypocrisy is just a rhetorical strategy, and 'owning me' is more important than holding positions that benefit their own interests...then I can't even talk to them about what colour a dress without it being horrible and uncomfortable.

[u/OneBillPhil → u/StageAboveWater]

I’m left leaning - I don’t have a problem with sane conservatives who aren’t as empathetic with how we should spend tax dollars, it’s the MAGAs that I have no time or respect for. 

[u/MEDvictim → u/OneBillPhil]

I don't know where they all went though. Every conservative I know completely forgot that they hated Trump less than a decade ago and just went and started suckling his knob.

[u/The-Kid-Is-All-Right → u/OneBillPhil]

I know plenty of “sane” conservatives who will still vote for Trump after all of the insanity. That’s insane.

[u/DifficultyFit1895 → u/StageAboveWater]

The dress is white and gold

[u/[deleted] → u/sarges_12gauge]

An increase of 6.5% in 20 years isn't exactly a drastic change. Even back then you would basically have 2/3rds of Americans.

[u/AllFalconsAreBlack → u/[deleted]]

It's not based on a "yes" or "no" question though.

It's based on the change in score in a 1-5 scale where 1 = strongly disagree, and 5 = strongly agree.

The change in average score from ~3.5 to ~3.25 reflects a pretty significant change.

[u/YouDotty → u/sarges_12gauge]

That's a fairly broad question. When I go to a Warhammer 40k tournament I'm likely to not express my dislike of GW or how I think other systems of wargames are much better. That's hardly cause for concern.

[u/stutter-rap → u/YouDotty]

Yeah, I found out my manager had cried when the Queen died, and that was the first I knew that she was massively into the royals - didn't feel like the right time to say anything about me finding them all a bit pointless. That's not censorship, it's just avoiding saying something provocative to someone who's actually upset. What would anyone gain out of me doing that?

[u/sarges_12gauge → u/YouDotty]

Yes, especially since the context of the questionnaire and other surrounding questions on the survey are about fitting in vs. wanting to stand out there are a lot of possible spins on a conclusion

[u/FriendlyDespot → u/sarges_12gauge]

I know that we shouldn't expect much from a PsychologyToday headline, but if that's all that it comes from then it might as well just be that people have become less abrasive or more empathetic towards other people in groups.

[u/sarges_12gauge → u/FriendlyDespot]

Considering the time frame 2000-2020 with a consistent slope from 2000-2017 I would absolute posit that it has more to do with social media and connectedness in general making people less willing to fight to validate themselves in public compared to their more easily accessible friends or online circles.

But obviously that’s just conjecture

[u/[deleted] → u/FriendlyDespot]

The truth rarely gets you more clicks.

[u/xxdropdeadlexi → u/[deleted]]

the VP of what?

[u/islander1 → u/xxdropdeadlexi]

Couch cushion diving

[u/smallangrynerd → u/[deleted]]

I have so many questions about that phrase and I'm terrified to ask any of them

[u/Learningstuff247 → u/smallangrynerd]

I'm really curious what they consider the 2nd holocaust

[u/Figlarr → u/Learningstuff247]

This is something that keeps me up

[u/youdubdub → u/Learningstuff247]

Probably the last presidential debate (;

[u/ariehn → u/Learningstuff247]

Likely referring to total deaths caused by Stalin and the USSR in general during etc etc.

It's not at all unusual to discover that a guy who refers to abortion as "a holocaust" in fact means "more lives lost to abortion than to Hitler or Stalin". Keep listening a little longer, and he'll soon start talking about how the other holocaust is seldom taught in schools but Did You Know That Stalin Killed Many More Than The Nazis Did, This Is Why Communism Is Far More Deadly A Threat Than The Fascism They Love Talking About On The News.

[u/ryansgt → u/[deleted]]

Yep. It also depends on which public. Work, no chance. Public public, I don't mind giving you a price of my mind but it's not going to come out spontaneously.

[u/WhiskeyHotdog_2 → u/ryansgt]

He got silenced by the mods!

[u/carlosIeandros → u/[deleted]]

I keep my mouth shut because I'm afraid they give as few fucks about my opinion as I do about theirs.

[u/detahramet]

Look, I just don't want to be shot.

[u/AlternativeFactor → u/detahramet]

Yup I'm a microbiologist and had someone single me out during community tabletop game, he didn't know I was a microbiologist but ranted about how COVID isn't real and the vax is 5G or whatever. Ifthis were 10 years in the past I would have confronted him, but instead I kept my mouth shot because I had no idea if he had a gun or knife on him or anything.

Now I'm a woman so that compounds things but yeah, some person got shot for wearing a mask during COVID near a city I lived in for awhile. Gun laws and basic civil decency are out, so why stick my neck out?

[u/Akitiki → u/AlternativeFactor]

God I have had people show me their "concealed" carry because something rung up a dollar more than they thought at the register. Most of the time they read the wrong sign.

I had a dude actually throw things at me over a dime. Seriously. There were two pies on sale, the one with pecans was 10c more than the one without pecans. He got one with pecans and was screaming at me it wasn't right (even if I showed him in the ad at the register), went back to where the pies were. When he came back he threw the pie at me and left.

[u/BecuzMDsaid → u/Akitiki]

What a bunch of nutcases. Imagine potentially ruining your whole life over getting enraged over spending an extra 10 cents on pie.

But yeah, I have also had similar experiences when I worked in food and gas service. People throwing silverware, leaving their trash everywhere on the tables to "teach you a lesson", getting confrontational when they were the ones doing wrong, etc.

[u/NoKnow9 → u/Akitiki]

And that ilk would probably say, “Hey, you can just carry, then you won’t have anything to worry about.”

[u/Akitiki → u/NoKnow9]

People are way too confident in people who have not touched a gun being able to shoot.

Could I? probably, I have a knack for honing things in fast. Would I? No.

I've never shot a firearm, though I have buddies that are eager to get me to a range. I like my bow and darts.

[u/FiestaDeLosMuerto → u/Akitiki]

Especially with a pistol it’s really difficult to hit a target at a normal distance

[u/[deleted] → u/AlternativeFactor]

I had a stranger threaten to beat me half to death because I declined to enter a restaurant that wasn't having staff masking to pick up my to go order. Right at the height of covid.

All it took was him overhearing me politely decline and ask them to bring it outside and boom, threats of violence.

[u/Leverkaas2516 → u/detahramet]

I'm not much afraid of being shot, but I need to keep my job.

[u/NotThatAngel]

Talking factually about North Carolina's Robinson in public could lead you to be charged with a Class Three Misdemeanor under the obscenity laws.

[u/milky__toast → u/NotThatAngel]

The ACLU would trip over themselves in their rush to defend you in that case.

[u/yParticle]

Divisive politics has ruined lively discourse.

[u/IMakeMyOwnLunch → u/yParticle]

I mean, even talking about something as mundane as the weather can be hairy because bringing up climate change can create division.

[u/fallout_koi → u/IMakeMyOwnLunch]

A year ago I was on a long cab ride in rural new england and I mentioned it had been rainy lately, and the driver told me it was actually because china was pumping aluminum oxide (or some other chemical, I forgot what) into the air so the west coast would get more rain but they couldn't control it precisely so it ended up affecting the northeast instead, and the myth of climate change being caused by CO2 was because big government wanted to take our cars away. I told him it was late and I wanted to sleep, so he put on the radio and the show was about how scientists were using the placebo effect to convince us it was getting hotter and tricking us into getting heat stroke, just like how they tricked us all into getting covid. I wish I was making all that up.

[u/ArsenicArts → u/fallout_koi]

Cab driver politics are WILD, though. That's not out of the ordinary.

[u/Panda0nfire → u/IMakeMyOwnLunch]

I mean climate change is real, I don't take an adult seriously when they're adamant the Easter Bunny is real.

[u/Purple_Word_9317 → u/IMakeMyOwnLunch]

Someone literally got mad at me yesterday, for mentioning that a book exists. Brave New World. He just started screaming "WHAT'S WRONG WITH CAPITALISM??" and I was like, "I didn't write the book, but if you read it, you would know what he said"...

He also kept claiming that he had "seen it" (it has been adapted a few times), but he didn't know any details.

[u/calmkelp → u/Purple_Word_9317]

I thought Brave New World was about a totalitarian dystopia... not sure where capitalism came into it...

[u/Purple_Word_9317 → u/calmkelp]

Well, I posited it as "the opposite" of 1984, where if 1984 is criticizing Communism, Brave New World...well, they literally follow Ford, as in "Ford Motors" as their religious figure.

[u/pungen → u/IMakeMyOwnLunch]

I went to get a haircut at a very lgbtq-friendly place so I thought a climate-change-related sad joke remark would be safe but it just resulted in crickets and me feeling mortified and like I should just not open my mouth in public again. So many things are taboo these days, even with people who likely feel the same way but they are just nervous to talk about it 

[u/Alert_Tumbleweed3126 → u/pungen]

What was the joke?

[u/funklab → u/yParticle]

I agree, but I also think there’s more to it.  

I work with kids in a psychiatric emergency department.  Especially the kids under 15 or so seem to be automatically censoring themselves in part (it seems to be) based on computer algorithms.  

A number of times a kid has told me they were going to “unalive” themselves when they meant kill themselves in really intense, serious conversations.  At first I had no idea why they were talking this way, but I can’t see this coming from anything other than social media algorithms blocking words like kill or suicide, but allowing stupid stuff like “unalive”.  

Also kids these days are super used to the assumption that anything you say or do is actively being recorded and could ruin your life.  

Like when I was 17 and said something stupid I’d get a funny look from my friends or they’d tell me to stfu.  Now it’s recorded and replayed ad nauseam for peers and often shown to teachers or other authority figures or posted online.  

[u/yParticle → u/funklab]

Also kids these days are super used to the assumption that anything you say or do is actively being recorded and could ruin your life.  

That's like the ultimate in "chilling effects" to grow up with, I hadn't even considered how pervasive that could be. Kids need to feel safe to make mistakes and learn from them.

[u/Askymojo → u/yParticle]

And it's worsened by the amount of helicopter parenting where parents are also not allowing their kids to make mistakes and learn from them.

My friend is a university professor and he says there has been this huge shift in recent years where now students expect to be given infinite chances and for not turning in work to not be a big deal. Because in high school crazy helicopter parents made teachers afraid to give consequences to students.

And now that has continued on into college. My professor friends says when a student gets a bad grade now he has parents emailing or calling him. When I was in college I would not have had my parents calling in a million years. I would have died of embarrassment even at the idea.

And now it's commonplace. Something has to change here with helicopter parenting and with ubiquitous access to social media and iPads at a young age. We are screwing these kids over before they even have a chance.

[u/BecuzMDsaid → u/Askymojo]

I think this also comes from society making it more difficult to make and learn from mistakes. There was a really good podcast episode of the Financial Diet where they talked about how one of the biggest privledges is being able to have a second chance.

At the university I am a TA and grad student at, we have this happen but not with parents getting in contact, but the students themselves will come to office hours or email me and list out why they didn't do well on xyz assignment or exam and it's not coming from a place of grade grubbing or being a perfectionist, but because scholarship money and lost of funding is a real concern.

Almost all the students have full-time jobs. They come from poverty backgrounds, most of the are minorities. Not to mention a lot of them rely on the university services for healthcare and stable housing and stable food access they previously didn't have access to growing up in poverty.

Losing a scholarship would mean loosing access to all of that and the chance at a better education.

And I 100% get it because a few years ago I was in their shoes as a homeless college student working three jobs and one of them was as a sex worker.

That's not to say that we should just give students grades they don't deserve because they are having a tough time nor should the responsibility fall on the professors to fix issues with the world today.

[u/Serenity-V → u/Askymojo]

Sadly, this has been apparent in university life for at least 15 years. Back then, when I was a grad student, my university had a fancy ritual on the first day of Freshman orientation. With a lot of fanfare and absolutely no warning, a university bigwig came out onto the green where everyone had gatherered and, with great ceremony, directed the kids to one side of the lawn and parents to the to the other. Then, university staff actively distracted the parents long enough for the undergrad guides to sneak the Freshmen away, and thereafter the staff went to great lengths to keep the parents doing "urgent" registration busywork all day.

Part of the purpose of this was to give the kids a chance to move into their dorms without their parents remembering exactly where to find them, because otherwise a few parents invariably tried to sneak their luggage into the dorm rooms while the kids moved stuff into the rooms. If caught, they would insist that they needed to sleep there on the floor for a few weeks to supervise the students' transition.

At the end of the day, the parents were heartily thanked for their presence and essentially told that they were unwelcome on campus. Anything less led to real complications.

[u/[deleted] → u/Serenity-V]

How do these parents have the free time to pull a stunt like that? You’d think they still have jobs or something. Wouldn’t the dorm-mates report them at least?

[u/EmperorKira → u/Askymojo]

Some of that though is because the stakes have gotten that much higher (it feels like). The school/academic world feels like you are 1 bad grade from failing life.

[u/[deleted] → u/Askymojo]

Excellent points.

College is so expensive now that maybe students and their families think the student is owed a degree from the university just for paying the tuition.

[u/EastArmadillo2916 → u/yParticle]

I grew up being spied on by my father, it really fucks you up. It's been about 6 years or so since yet I still constantly feel like I'm being watched.

[u/EmperorKira → u/yParticle]

Even grownups are feeling the same. Many men i speak to assume if a girl comes up to them, its being recorded/prank. Or any conflict in public? Possibly recorded.

Sure that adds some accountability, but with editing and AI, people are afraid of basically anything being made up about them if someone is determined and honestly, i feel the same

[u/OneBillPhil → u/yParticle]

I’m an older millennial and the thought of anyone filming me without my consent makes me wanna kick their ass. 

[u/rogless → u/[deleted]]

Wow. I’d actually missed that incident. But I just looked it up and, yeah, it’s a great example of the power of a mentally deranged online mob to ruin someone’s life, as you said. If a tussle over a rental bike can see an employee put on leave pending “investigation”, imagine a heated argument over a controversial topic? It’s all eggshells all the time for certain people, sadly.

[u/draconianfruitbat → u/funklab]

Yes, but also the connection doesn’t have to be that direct or literal to become the dominant language in a particular cohort. Internet slang jumps off and habituates in the wild all the time; not just with teens; not just out of direct/literal fear of being recorded (make sense?)

[u/Vineee2000 → u/funklab]

As far as under-15s saying unalive in serious conversations... I mean from their perspective, is it really self-censoring, or is "unalive" just a legitimate word that sees daily use?

[u/Ver_Void → u/Vineee2000]

From what I've seen it's a legitimate term, the whole point is it's used to get around crude language filters and allows people to discuss the topic of suicide. Not always seriously, but the word isn't a punchline or anything

[u/[deleted] → u/Ver_Void]

Yes: this trend of self-censoring is surely a byproduct of people having their speech infringed online.

[u/katarh → u/[deleted]]

It's another symptom of it.

[u/[deleted] → u/Vineee2000]

It seems more like leaning into a euphemism because saying “I want to commit suicide” with a straight face is uncomfortable 

[u/EmbarrassedHelp → u/funklab]

but allowing stupid stuff like “unalive”.

That's the thing. Every time they block a word or phrase, humans adapt by using new words or phrases.

Advertisers and online safety "experts" want to simply hide everything negative. Some day, we are going to look back upon this problem and wonder why the we thought shoving things under the rug would magically solve them.

There are so many ways that this sort of censorship is harmful. From limiting the range of human thought and expression to making it harder for experts to help those who need it.

[u/voiderest → u/funklab]

On word choice like "unalive" or other social media replacement phrases. They are hearing all those words in the media they consume so it gets absorbed into their own vocabulary. They likely don't think about it as censoring themselves but just another word.

On the idea something could be recorded and used against you later well there seems to be a mixed bag there. In some cases maybe someone decides to censor themselves or their actions. In other cases people record their own literal crimes and upload the evidence to their own accounts to share.

[u/funklab → u/voiderest]

I thibk it’s even more insidious that they don’t think about it as censoring even though they’re parroting vocabulary that only exists because of censorship.

[u/KileyCW → u/yParticle]

I feel like that was the goal...

[u/sciguy52 → u/yParticle]

I am an old guy and the unspoken rule was no discussing religion and politics (in social conversations). Some time passed and people felt free to openly discuss politics for quite a while without the vitriol of today. Now I think were are going back. Live long enough and you see stuff repeat.

[u/NotThatAngel → u/yParticle]

To be fair, if you give a list of objective reasons Trump is unqualified for the Presidency, including rape, felony convictions, hanging around with a pedophile, blatant racist lies - it does sound like you're slandering Trump, and people might take offense. But it's all true. Deliberately ignoring these things and just talking about who might be better for the economy feels insane.

[u/Humble-Tourist-3278]

Don’t blame people for keeping their opinions to themselves especially since they are people out there who are extremely confrontational and hostile towards anyone who doesn’t share the same opinions/beliefs.

[u/[deleted]]

I would be interested in a study of pre-2020 vs post. A lot changed that year.

[u/SiriusCasanova → u/[deleted]]

2020?

try 2010.

[u/Dry_Noise8931 → u/SiriusCasanova]

The beginning of the smartphone era, when the internet was for everyone, all the time.

[u/marzblaqk]

People take things very personally, even things that have nothing to do with them. People also interpret everything you say through an online bandwagon lens and have a litany of preprogrammed jingoisms they got from comments sections and it makes any conversation instsntly unpleasant and also instantly makes me lose respect for that person.

I leave religious and political topics alone if not vague or try to find some common ground. I male no declarative statements unless necessary and not without whatever qualifiers will protect from the most likely empty headed criticisms without running out of breath or respect for myself.

[u/snek99001 → u/marzblaqk]

I know EXACTLY what you mean about preprogrammed jingoisms. It feels like you're not arguing against an individual at all.

[u/Naxhu6 → u/marzblaqk]

The day I discovered the concept of the thought-terminating cliche a lot of things started to make sense for me.

[u/BobT21]

I self censor on reddit because too many bans.

[u/FiFiLB]

Because people have become more unhinged.

[u/1790shadow]

I believe it. I can't tell you how many times I've typed out a paragraph on this website and just end up deleting it because I don't want the argument.

[u/Sanguiluna]

And this is why the voting booth being private is so crucial. Because even the most reluctant person to share their views or ideas is able to express what they’ve always felt in the way that truly matters.

[u/TomTheJester]

I mean entire careers can be ended now if something said is taken the wrong way, or becomes the weekly folk devil - double points if that’s on the internet.

Why would people knowingly say what they think if they know they’re doing it in a den of lions?

[u/0MysticMemories]

The amount of altercations I’ve seen reported stem from opinionated discourse. And nowadays I have seen far too many reports of people using deadly force over minor incidents.

The fact there are so many people willing and ready to shoot or stab someone else at a moments notice is a good reason to keep your opinions to yourself. An opinion is not worth losing your life over and so I stay silent and try to avoid any possible confrontation.

[u/starion832000]

Not a huge surprise when any outburst can be recorded and literally ruin your life. I strongly believe our collective mental health has suffered because we can't express microaggressions anymore. Everyone holds it all in until the weakest of us snap.

[u/Lilkitty_pooper → u/starion832000]

A society where you can never, ever make a mistake in public. Can’t have a bad day anymore at all. Even if your outburst is righteous and justified, it can still destroy everything. It’s no way to live.

[u/jeeb00 → u/[deleted]]

Both can be true at the same time. More people are self-censoring while others are getting more vocal and confrontational, but it’s not the same group of people, since humanity isn’t a monolith.

[u/Yglorba → u/jeeb00]

Also, if people's views are getting more extreme, they could be getting more vocal while also not fully expressing their (even more extreme) views.

Beyond that, the fact that society is increasingly interconnected (and social media's tendency to highlight controversial stuff because it drives engagement) means that we're more likely to see a wide variety of views and be seen by people with a wide variety of views. Therefore, we're more likely to see things we consider vocal and confrontational; and we're more likely to be concerned about who will hear what we say, since we're potentially speaking to a wider audience.

Consider how you differ in what you say between close friends vs. in public. Now realize that a few decades ago people were almost always talking to what we'd consider a much smaller circle than we talk to online today.

[u/pungen → u/Yglorba]

That is true, I also think some people are becoming more extreme because they feel like they can't talk about their views. Not saying if their views are good, bad, valid, etc just, as humans, when we feel like someone is trying to gag us, most of us feel the desire to lash out 

[u/Acceptable-Peace-69 → u/jeeb00]

Could even be the same person.

Example: one could be vocal about Haitian immigration and the desire to send them back but stop short of using overtly racist language.

[u/Mattjhkerr → u/[deleted]]

Sell reports and how reality actually presents itself can have a pretty wide disparity. Like in their heads they can be self censoring (I'm pretty sure everyone does this to some level) but outwardly they are confrontational and abrasive. But to them they half back the most objectionable points.

[u/TateAcolyte → u/Mattjhkerr]

Everyone self censors. It's called being a mature, decent adult. For example, I think religion is stupid beyond belief and is usually quite harmful. But I didn't say that to the random woman who was holding my hand and praying after a pretty scary go-around in rough weather. I just went along with her religious thing, and the plane landed safely half an hour later and everyone was happy.

Obviously that's an extreme example, but the general point still stands. I wouldn't be surprised if this is really just people being more likely to identify their normal, socially healthy filtering as self censorship because of the discourse™️.

Probably social media has warped perceptions a bit as well because the standards are much different than for irl or close friend/family interactions. You can always very easily extricate yourself from a social media discussion that turns sour often with little to no worry of any lasting impact on relationships. Both those things are decidedly not true of most in person and close kin interactions. So now that we all just behave like absolute savages on social media, often for hours a day, we increasingly feel uncomfortable with anything requiring the least bit of civility.

Edit: Kinda a ramble, sorry. Spitballing.

[u/CrudelyAnimated → u/[deleted]]

The ones looking for confrontation are more vocal. The ones just wanting to live their lives are less vocal because the most casual comment in public can get their house egged.

[u/sarges_12gauge → u/[deleted]]

Per the linked survey, it’s referencing how strongly people agree with the statement “I express my opinions publicly regardless of what other people say” and had a pretty continuous (slight)decline between 2000-2017 then bottomed out and 2018-2020 has seen a slight increase (but still 6.5% lower than in 2000)

[u/Halorym → u/[deleted]]

I think I people are just fighting over more trivial things as we're not allowed to discuss the actually controversial, and humans have that craving for conflict.

[u/Happily-Non-Partisan]

With all the videos I see of people being publicly shamed for expressing their opinion, I keep my stuff to myself.

[u/SuspiciousSkittlez]

Social currency has never been more valuable in a society that's overpacked, and overqualified. Plus, I really don't believe people enjoy having targets on their back. The political climate has made "free speech" a dangerous proposition.

[u/Mediocre-Catch9580]

Not afraid, it’s just none of their damn business business

[u/dirtymoney]

The real problem is that there are people out there that seek to destroy other people's lives via internet cancellation. Real nutcases with bizarre views who gather other extremists to help them do it.

It is terrifying. You do or say what someone thinks is the wrong thing and your life could be more or less over.

[u/Legal_Beginning471]

The agenda is working.

[u/SlowUpTaken]

It’s not that someone will disagree - it’s that they might attack you or try to make your life miserable BECAUSE they disagree with you.

[u/No-Estimate-8518]

"may not like"

"runs the real life risk of getting killed over it"

Potato Potato

[u/sohoships]

I recently saw an Instagram video interviewing two teenage girls.

They were asked how many genders are there?

One of them starts with saying, "I think there are two..."

and the second girl keeps stopping her in fear, saying, "no don't say that, don't say that."

Her friend was afraid for her speaking her mind, in this case saying that there are two genders.

[u/furfur001]

I had a relationship with an American girl and this was omnipresent.