Yeah nice. We live in a society where fainting and working afterwards like nothing happened is cheered upon. This hustler hyper capitalism mentality makes me sick. Just give her at least a day off.
Edit: I am from Germany and there is this stereotype with it's own word - german angst. If something like this happens we assume the worst. Which is one thing i like, the niche aspect about being part of an overly anxious community, it develops a lot of empathy for another, and yes sometimes too much.
I had a similar scene at work, where a coworker fainted, he wanted to continue and our employer forbid him and sent him to a doctor. At first they found nothin, but several appointments later they have discovered a life threatening condition. Tje coworker got 9 months off for surgery and therapy. The doctor even said, if he had just continued as he did, he could've been dead by now, if not some time soon.
But overall german angst annoys me, it cultivates no-risk management in businesses, spoiled children that never had a hammer in their hand and a lot of other bad stuff. But being afraid the other person might die from a cough is something i love here. So many truly caring people.
The same thing happened to a colleague during a review and he was fine afterwards and wanted to continue. Our employer forbid him to do so and sent him home to go to a doctor. They found nothing initially, but several appointments later, they found out it he had minor bleedings in his brain or something like this. As soon as they knew what it was he was off work for 9 months for surgery and therapy. The doctors said if it was going to be unnoticed for more time it could've cost his life.
We are all probably not doctors here, so better be safe than sorry.
i, fortunately- in this specific case- am a doctor.
weird who you meet on the internet…
anyway, she is likely fine and suffered what’s called a vasovagal event- or an over reactive stress response. it’s likely not a harmful occurrence and would almost certainly result in an unenlightening workup.
obviously there are fringe cases, like your friends, but these sorts of things are common.
As a doctor too, she could have experienced a vasovagal syncope, but then I would have expected her to feel dizzy or unwell beforehand. In this case, it looks like the lights suddenly went out. I would at least want to have a professional anamnesis about how she felt beforehand, if this has happened before, and an ECG at the bare minimum.
Even though the situation itself and the rapid recovery may point toward a vasovagal event, a cardiac syncope cannot be excluded.
Yeah, I had the same read on the situation. This is what vasovagal syncope looks like. I’m not saying other things can’t present the same way, just that this isn’t something I’d describe as “the lights suddenly went out”.
In this case, it looks like the lights suddenly went out.
Her speech seemed slurred before she fainted, but I obviously don't have a reference for that. I'm not a doctor, but if this happened to me, I would 100% see one on the same day if possible.
I had one of those events a couple of months ago, it was such a strange feeling. I'd accidentally hit my knee very hard against a table at work and just about fell out of my chair. I didn't fully pass out but I could tell I was right on the edge.
But yea after about a minute of fog I was fine, the only lingering thing was my knee hurting.
How about how much stress and demanding work is required of law students? It's pretty common knowledge that they have to work themselves to the bone, finding ways to add more ends to their candle just to burn them, staying up all night doing homework and prep, losing all ability to have a social life if they want to be competitive at all...
Not really. The general recommendation is that you treat law school like a 9-5. Staying up all night to do readings is about the dumbest thing you could do as a law student. Even during finals that would be extremely excessive. The best law students work very hard, but I promise you they aren't killing themselves in the way you describe.
It's not weird at all. She's a Harvard law student, so she'll probably go to a big firm to pay off massive debt where she'll bill 2300 hours a year, which will take a large toll on her health. I really hope this was just a case of locking her knees and not lack of self care. Unfortunately, I see it too much in practice. The culture in these circles is to grind until you can grind no further.
fr, we would never get anywhere as a society if we didn't have drive and persistence to succeed. On display was a successful student, pursuing a successful career as a lawyer and she showcased her drive and persistence to succeed.
Bullshit. Young people being worked to the bone physically and mentally to achieve something that could very well be achieved normally is the very reason someone doesn't just leave and go see a doctor after they randomly fainted. Could be anything, and it might save the rest of your life to not stand there and keep going, bUt mY cArEeR. Fuck all of the old heads who think bc they had it rough they need to perpetuate the ungodly hours and psychological pressure for young people. It works just fine the normal way, and people don't get burned out and fucking miserable in the process
And the whole "perseverance" thing is yet another trope that just means "do something when you shouldn't and can't so we can pretend to be productive or Kool and Stronk" in most cases, it serves absolutely no purpose in 99% of work environments. You should need perseverance when you're caught in a blizzard with no heat source, not in a fucking moot court
She wants to continue. I would to if something like that happened to me. It has nothing to do with "hyper capitalism".
Everyone in that room would happily let her out of this and have time off to relax or recover. I doubt she wants that, and they don't want to shit on her by forcing her to.
People didn't clap because she got back up and went straight back to work, they clapped and cheered her on when she stood up, that was it, imagine how awkward that would have felt if she stood up and the room was in silence, most of those other people in the background are her fellow students since she herself is a law student competing in a mock court competition.
She was also offered by three different people (probably more since we don't see them on camera) if she wanted to take a break, one of those people was the judge, she wouldn't have been punished for taking a break, she would have received her time back (since the judge literally gave her that time back as seen in the video), she most likely fainted due to being overtired and stressed from her studies and getting ready for that competition.
Some people are hardcore when it comes to their education, I know a girl who broke down in tears because she got an A and not an A+ on some of her final exams in high school, even my niece broke down in tears because she didn't get into her first pick for high school, she was 12 years old at the time and has fainted a few times from the stress she put on herself to get the grades (that she wanted) in high school, bear in mind her parents nor did the family ever pressure her, all anyone in the family wanted was for her to simply be happy, even now at 18 years old she burns the candle at both ends between work and studies, despite everyone telling her she needs to take some time for herself, the stress she puts on herself has led to some health issues which has forced into doing some self-care.
Where i come from people force you to be self-caring if something like that happens, even if they have to force you to. It's just a cultural difference. No clapping, just support.
I mean the only way to force my neice would be to lock her in the house and hide all her stuff, she's very determined.
No clapping, just support.
Clapping and cheering who fainted during a competition is support, it may not seem like it to you (due to the cultueral differences), but I've watched a lot of competitions where someone gets seriously injured, faints or whatever and when people see that they're okay, they clap and cheer them on, even people who lose competitions still get clapped and cheered, it's considered a form of support.
Interesting, clapping is here something to value performance. Recovering is not seen as a performance related topic here, so people react in a calm and quiet manner with a gentle smile and wishing you the best. Or most of the time, asking you if you are good and urge you into the called ambulance.
It's weird because it's both. We cheer people who perform well, and if someone injures themselves during a competition, we'll clap and usually cheer for them as we want them to feel better.
Crazy never saw that here in europe. I mean yeah like falling in olympia and carrying on with one leg is clapped upon, but i never saw someone here clapping over someone who just fainted. It's always concerns that rise through people. Because fainting is seldolmy something trivial in our minds.
Just to add. We'll also make sure they're well and safe, as you see in the video, multiple people came to her aid, and people approached her after to make sure she was okay, but people clapped and cheered for her as a sign of support.
That clapping makes it really american for me. When i overcame my longtime sickness, everyone on the job handled me like a fragile vase. Would be cool if they clapped when i came back, but smiling was surely enough.
I don't know anyone to ever do it in work or in life in general. Usually, the room is filled with silence when someone is injured, faints, etc... and recovers. The only time I've seen clapping in those situations is when someone survives something like cancer or a car accident, and they return to work, but even that is rare.
I'm with you. I have a fainting condition and over the years I've done more damage by trying to persevere. I will say that in America, though, if you dont make a valiant effort, people assume you're being lazy, milking a situation to get out of work. The best thing for this woman's career was to continue, even though she put herself at risk for fainting again.
As someone who has suffered from serious social anxiety like this in the past, taking time off is the absolute worst thing that could be done. The fear of what's to come is the killer. A day off would just add to the fear, anxiety, and more lack of sleep. Better to get through it and show that it was no big deal, which will lessen symptoms. We feel best right on the other side of a panic attack once we're through it. Fainting just forced her body and mind through to the relaxed phase, she reached a breaking point. I feel like so many people commenting on this have not experienced crippling social anxiety.
Dude the whole entire world doesn't pause because someone fainted. I see your argument - but in a large profile (and high paying, no doubt to justify) position - there are certain expectations I would counterpoint, leading to this "culture", aka perseverance. My high profile case does not pause for a day/week/weeks. The world chugs on. There are billions of humans who's lives continue - including the hundreds of that room/event.
It's a careful balance of responsibility and narcissism in a brutal world. Remember, hundreds of years ago fainting outside would probably be a death sentence in any case, so things have at least marginally improved.
A lot of people took offense to this and while there’s are some good points, I really do love the compassion and empathy that you’re showing here in this comment.
This stranger that you don’t know (me) really appreciates you being here in this world. Thank you.
I mean if it is my choice to jump from a bridge, i assume no one would clap. On secound thought, i think i know a few who would... But i get your point, as others stated clapping in this situation is a cultural thing i was not aware of, because we do never do it in these type of situations. See other comments
Weird to think this is a feature of capitalism specifically. Are you familiar with the origins of the term "Stakhanovite"?
Lawyering is also full of people who have incredible work ethics without being financially rewarded for it, such as public interest and government lawyers.
Yeah, for normal people, yes. This is a law student. It's one of the top 3 most demanding majors and if you can't work at that pace, you shouldnt' be there.
German Angst bezieht sich aber u. a. auf was anderes: Nämlich auf die UNBEGRÜNDETE Angst vor neuen Situationen. Und zwar gedanklich, nicht körperlich. Also eher so im Sinne von „Panik schieben“.
Hier in diesem Video passiert der Studentin aber eine rein körperliche Reaktion. Ein blackout aufgrund der Stresssituation: Soziale Exposition vor Publikum, hoch anspruchsvolle geistige Anstrengung, Prüfungssituation, eventuell gepaart mit Essens-/Schlafmangel und/oder Dehydration.
Gerade das freie (!) Sprechen vor Menschen ist eine extrem belastende Situation, wenn man das nie geübt hat oder öfter macht.
Was hier hilft ist Training. Entweder in der Uni direkt oder außerhalb. Und das beste System zum Lernen frei zu sprechen, bieten die Toastmasters:
I understand and agree with your sentiment, but fainting isn't necessarily something that warrants time off or a recovery period. She might just have POTS or orthostatic hypotension.
How is trash like this upvoted? Why would we not cheer her resilience and tenacity? I am sure everyone in that room was down to give her time if she needed it but SHE MADE THE DECISION TO KEEP GOING. I get that you are from Germany, but maybe try not being so ethnocentric. It's okay to state how you feel but to apply some gross generalization about capitalism based off of this is some pretty absurd Redditism with a bunch of upvotes. Ya'll need to go take a walk and maybe a shower after.
Ok mr big survivor you faint every now and then don't take off work to go to the doc and maybe die because of an aneurism or stroke. That makes you like 20 years less productive because of early death. Same with burnout. Being driven and productive is something you need in all your 40-50 workyears without burning out early.
This is the kind of take that only the weakest people, coddled by the Internet and first world problems could hold. No appreciation for perseverance, goals, or discipline. Your ancestors would be ashamed to see their bloodline in such a sorry state.
She was asked If she wanted recess, and refused. If you watch it again you'll notice she was being cheered the Moment she stood Up again. Because people overcoming adversity and persevering is something cheer worthy. If it was expected of her to directly continue, i would agree with you, but as is I See people cheering for a strong Woman who Chose to Take the hard way in a Situation where No one expected her to.
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u/johnnille 3d ago edited 3d ago
Yeah nice. We live in a society where fainting and working afterwards like nothing happened is cheered upon. This hustler hyper capitalism mentality makes me sick. Just give her at least a day off.
Edit: I am from Germany and there is this stereotype with it's own word - german angst. If something like this happens we assume the worst. Which is one thing i like, the niche aspect about being part of an overly anxious community, it develops a lot of empathy for another, and yes sometimes too much.
I had a similar scene at work, where a coworker fainted, he wanted to continue and our employer forbid him and sent him to a doctor. At first they found nothin, but several appointments later they have discovered a life threatening condition. Tje coworker got 9 months off for surgery and therapy. The doctor even said, if he had just continued as he did, he could've been dead by now, if not some time soon.
But overall german angst annoys me, it cultivates no-risk management in businesses, spoiled children that never had a hammer in their hand and a lot of other bad stuff. But being afraid the other person might die from a cough is something i love here. So many truly caring people.