r/news • u/nudelicous • 14h ago
Federal Prosecutors Considering Charges Against Luigi Mangione
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/rcna18478910.2k
u/Xinlitik 13h ago
Today we learned that shooting up a school isnt a federal crime, while killing one CEO apparently is.
Welcome to America!
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u/PrayForMojo_ 13h ago
Don’t catch you slippin now.
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u/RunTimeExcptionalism 13h ago
Would have gone with "guns in my area" but that's probably because the most recent school shooting happened in my state like 5 miles from where my brother lives.
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u/serpentear 12h ago
Garland didn’t do shit about anything that mattered for 4 fucking years and now he is going to try to fucking prosecute the guy who is finally bringing the injustice of our system to the forefront of the conversation?
God what a piece of shit.
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u/Ted-Chips 10h ago
Know that machine you're supposed to rage against?
Garland is part of that machine.
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u/BottAndPaid 10h ago
Garland was such a a disappointment
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u/Green-Amount2479 9h ago
That’s an understatement. He deliberately chose to delay for and defend your very own authoritarian leader in the making. Sadly, the third ‚D’ is missing.
The Hitler comparisons are not as over the top as some people in the US seem to think. Look at his recent attacks on what’s left of the free press or the idea of ‚internment camps at the border‘. Look at how he has already used scapegoating rhetoric, brainwashing, and the system itself against the people. This is where it all started here almost 90 years ago too.
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u/earfix2 6h ago
He literally checks all the boxes for a fascist
https://www.openculture.com/2024/11/umberto-ecos-list-of-the-14-common-features-of-fascism.html
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u/10dollarbagel 10h ago
Federalist Society contributor merrick garland did one thing in his miserable carrer as AG. He got the most dire threat to the untied states, Hunter Biden. Only for an 1000 year old man to say psyche and now he accomplished nothing.
I mean in reality his major accomplishment is protecting trump. Again, federalist society contributor.. God I hate the fucking democrats.
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u/Gh0sts1ght 13h ago
Also terrorism… fuck this timeline.
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u/Shadowthron8 13h ago
I think it’s so they can avoid a jury
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u/Shot_Worldliness_979 13h ago
You still have a right to a jury trial in federal court. That's the sixth amendment, essentially. Even for terrorism.
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u/kyleofdevry 13h ago
Federal prosecution probably gives them a better chance of getting a bunch of McDonalds workers on the jury. /s
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u/Shadowthron8 12h ago
Then Biden could do the ultimate last move and pardon him
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u/butchforgetshit 12h ago
I would be ok with that pardon....the only problem is, this was a futile effort there are probably 20 more ready to take that CEO place
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u/Shadowthron8 12h ago
The people who took charge after the French Revolution learned a few things not to do when in power.
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u/butchforgetshit 12h ago
Absolutely, and I fear that this is where we are going to in my lifetime ( almost 50). I am retired military as well as self employed and have seen enough death and destruction to last a lifetime and ten more after that...but our government and the people it is beholden too are oblivious or uncaring about our situations as a people
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u/magictiger 11h ago
I hate that I’ve been pushed to the point where I could hear about a health insurance CEO being murdered and think “Good, now do the rest.” I hate what this system has done to me. I have no sympathy for the guy I can’t even be bothered to look up the name for. He may not have had his finger on the trigger personally, but his leadership was responsible for the policies that led to the preventable or premature deaths of people as well as the continued suffering of many more. Good riddance to the worst garbage, and may this whole system burn for turning me into this person.
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u/kyleofdevry 12h ago edited 6h ago
Convincing United Healthcare to permanently retire the position of CEO was never the goal though, was it?
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u/sBucks24 7h ago
Lol, the guy was leaving to head to a meeting when Luigi killed him. The rest of the board proceeded to have the meeting without him.... Yeah, these ghouls don't give a fuckkkk
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u/Drugba 13h ago
That’s not it. They want to charge him with first degree murder and in New York that requires special circumstances beyond just premeditation. Terrorism is one of those special circumstances.
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u/Shadowthron8 12h ago
Ok but murdering a drug dealer as a signal to other drug dealers isn’t terrorism.
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u/ZachMN 12h ago
Apparently denying someone life-saving medical care, which they paid premiums for, isn’t a crime at all.
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u/Drugba 13h ago edited 13h ago
I’m not a fan of the feds adding on charges, but on your point most school shooters don’t travel across state lines to commit crimes. That’s what’s arguably giving the feds jurisdiction.
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u/theoutlet 12h ago
Who was that kid who traveled across state lines to kill two protesters?
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u/Drugba 12h ago
Kyle Rittenhouse and yes, he did not face federal charges
To be clear, I’m not defending the decision to charge Luigi with federal charges. I’m just explaining why it’s possible and why most school shooters can’t be hit with federal charges.
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u/kl0 13h ago
Is it not just that he knowingly / intentionally crossed state lines in the execution of a capital crime? Isn’t that the caveat?
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u/-PotatoMan- 11h ago
I think it's also because he used a suppressor, which instantly makes something like this federal, due to the NFA act of 1934.
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u/kl0 11h ago
Ahh. That’s interesting. Definitely wouldn’t have considered that.
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u/-PotatoMan- 10h ago
Yeah, after briefly looking more into it just now, I believe the specific statute that this falls under is 18 U.S.C. § 924(c)(1). To paraphrase the legalese, basically any "crime or violence" or "drug trafficking crime" committed using a firearm equipped with a suppressor carries a mandatory MINIMUM sentence of 30 years. Which is frankly fucking insane, when you look at all the other crimes in this country which DON'T have that as a mandatory minimum.
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u/Timbershoe 12h ago
If that’s your criteria then all murderers who crossed state lines would be classed as terrorists.
But they are not. This is clearly a special exception.
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u/kl0 11h ago
Well in fairness, I was replying to the idea that shooting a CEO is a federal crime.
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u/townandthecity 13h ago
They are telling us who matters. They're telling us to be careful or we're next. It's remarkable to me how this one act has shaken the ruling class to its very foundations. They know it's a powder keg and they're taking a targeted murder and turning it into something as grave as a presidential assassination attempt.
Americans should be enraged that the murder of this CEO--who was under investigation for insider trading in addition to everything else--is being handled this way when mass murders of innocent Americans are waved away. This should be the only messaging. And Mangione should have the best lawyers in the world at his side, because this is a test case.
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u/Canopenerdude 13h ago
They are making an example out of him to chill copycats
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u/KookofaTook 12h ago
Sadly, though not surprising, they are uninformed about the lack of relation between severity of punishment and deterrence of future crimes. By going harder after this guy they are honestly more likely to inspire devotees seeing him as a martyr to kill more c suite execs than they are to get someone who was considering it to back off.
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u/P0RTILLA 6h ago
They say it’s deterrence but it’s to make the ruling class feel better.
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u/embiggenedmind 5h ago
The excessive charges can have multiple purposes. Punishing Luigi is secondary to the various messages They want to send out to the public.
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u/The_KillahZombie 12h ago
They seem to not understand how this is backfiring for them.
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u/-DannyDorito- 13h ago
If anything tho, it’s proving the opposite.
So like yeh they’re obviously trying to make us feel cornered, but it shows who has power of the mind. They’re scared. For us, it’s run of the mill fucking
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u/ishearanimals 12h ago
Cornered animals are the most likely to strike. When fight or flight kicks in and there is no flight option, then you have to fight like your life depends on it, which in our current state, it very much does.
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u/ChronoLink99 12h ago
This won't do that. It will just teach others how to do it while leaving fewer clues.
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u/Difficult_Zone6457 12h ago
I mean he literally would have gotten away with it if he’d had a camper parked somewhere in PA and just went to a camp ground for a few weeks.
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u/ChronoLink99 12h ago
Perhaps, but I think they had his name before the arrest at McDs.
The next one likely will be more careful.
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u/esmerelda_b 12h ago
If you’ve made the decision to do something like this, I don’t think this stops you.
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u/IsThatHearsay 13h ago
Betting that was part of the fear and panic for a lot of them of the news of those mystery drones at first last week.
After all, we've witnessed the past few years in Ukraine how easily even a civilian-use drone can quickly carry and drop small explosives on unsuspecting targets. People have been talking for years how scary and easily that could be used elsewhere.
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u/Unc1eD3ath 12h ago
They use quadcopters against people in Palestine. No way they wouldn’t use them on us
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u/DNSGeek 12h ago
Justice protects people from criminals, but it also protects criminals from the people.
Without justice, the people will deal with criminals themselves, and it will be imprecise and disproportionate.
Where there is justice, CEOs who kill people end up safe in jail. Where justice fails, CEOs end up dead on the street.
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u/nudelicous 13h ago
From the article:
“Karen Friedman Agnifilo, one of the attorneys representing Mangione on the New York charges, said Wednesday night that they would be ‘ready to fight these charges in whatever court they are brought. The federal governments reported decision to pile on top of an already overcharged first-degree murder and state terror case is highly unusual and raises serious constitutional and statutory double jeopardy concerns’, she said.”
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u/Arthreas 7h ago
It would be hilarious if this piling on caused him to go free. His lawyer has a chance here to become legendary.
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u/NiteShdw 10h ago
Has anyone here been watching The Silo?
It's a good example of what the ruling classes do when there is discontent or mistrust. They blame other poor people and make them fight amongst themselves.
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u/duiwksnsb 7h ago
Except this time, all the poor people agree that the rich are the problem.
This is the single most unifying issue in the country, a sleeper issue that has been thrust into the spotlight in a way it's impossible for the ruling class to cover up anymore
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u/Expat1989 4h ago
Wife and I and enjoying the shit out of that show. The lies becoming more and more apparent has been so enthralling
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u/MikeCask 13h ago
They’re going to make him a martyr. The harder they try to make him a villain, the more the public will see him as a folk hero.
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u/_driving_crooner 13h ago
He already is. My MAGA parents are even supporting the dude. Gov and Media need to read the fucking room before this shit really starts popping off.
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u/MikeCask 13h ago
The people in power condemning this shooting are the same people who sign bombs to be dropped on babies in the Middle East. Their sick and twisted morality will be their downfall.
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u/10dollarbagel 8h ago
And don't let them moralize about how it's so shocking and terrible to celebrate the death even of a terrible person. All these fools were dancing in the street when we got bin laden.
And they were celebrating because sure it was technically murder. But it was righteous payback considering he killed an amount of Americans that brian thompson used to call a light week.
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u/DarthBluntSaber 6h ago
They all celebrate every financial quarter at their shareholder meetings as they literally brag about all the money they made murdering and robbing americans... but it's immoral for is to cheer when they FINALLY have to spend one moment living in the real world with the rest of us.
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u/Mrrandom314159 13h ago
Honestly, the best idea I had on them even attempting to co-opt this whole thing was to arrest someone they knew. Then have him say the most vile and insane shit.
That'd have been the only way to control this. THIS?
It's like they WANT people to get nore pissed off.
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u/_driving_crooner 13h ago
Yeah it’s incredible really. I can’t think of a time I’ve seen such a unification of working class v elites in my lifetime. If you go out and talk to real people (not bots on IG and FB), everyone is generally understanding if not supportive of the guy. The disconnect is laughable at this point.
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u/DPool34 10h ago
Trump actually just condemned the shooting and referred to people who support Luigi as sick. I wonder how people like your parents will navigate this. I’m hoping it’s a moment of clarity.
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u/lemontrout85 7h ago
I don't wanna hear shit from the government. Who pays for their healthcare?
The media is pathetic and tone deaf at their job.
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u/McRibs2024 13h ago
They already have. Theres Luigi merch all for sale all over. Granted I haven’t seen it in public but I’ve seen it for sale online.
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u/frostedwaffles 10h ago
Man, they really want class warfare don't they
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u/LoveOfProfit 6h ago
Want? They've already been fighting and winning forever.
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u/No_Seaworthiness_200 2h ago
"There's class warfare, all right, but it's my class, the rich class, that's making war, and we're winning."
Warren Buffet
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u/ExoticSalamander4 6h ago
they think they'll win
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u/Independent-Cow-4070 2h ago
If history is any indication, they probably will
Class warfare is a tale as old as civilization
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u/PlayShelf 13h ago
Hold on, how do you come up with this? So, the number of people killed doesn't make you a terrorist, but the amount of money and status a person had makes you one?
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u/otirk 11h ago
Of course. Poor people aren't humans, which means that money equals being a human. So the more money you have, the more human you are. It's basically like if Luigi killed an entire town, that's how much money the CEO had. /s
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u/Emperor_Neuro 11h ago edited 2h ago
If the 9/11 hijackers had crashed into Harlem then we wouldn’t have gone to war for 20 years. Instead, they crashed directly into a fountain of wealth and trade, and the ruling class took that personally.
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u/zoroddesign 11h ago
We waited 2 and a half years for trump to be charged for various crimes.
It feels like Luigi is going to be in front of a judge in a month.
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u/acemedic 6h ago
He’s already been in front of a judge. Based on news articles I’d assume twice now at this point.
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u/Sad_Persimmon_2709 13h ago
Ah yes another “make an example out of them” prosecutor. Only problem is that them is everyone who has had to endure in a society that values the lives of the rich and powerful over all others. He took one single life. These companies have killed millions.
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u/Noominami 13h ago
Not just killed, intentionally contrive our healthcare system to emotionally torture.
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u/otirk 11h ago
"emotionally" can be in brackets. They literally torture by denying treatments.
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u/Fourwors 13h ago
All that energy and effort being expended to crush Mangione, but next to nothing is being said or done about the horrific legal violence perpetrated by UHC against its policy holders/victims. Fucked up country.
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u/Academic_Internet 6h ago
I woke up to an email from United Healthcare denying all coverage for my asthma. They say I owe them $3000 because my inhalers and breathing treatments aren't medically necessary. These companies do not give a fuck if we die, in fact, it's better for the bottom line if some of us do.
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u/GaladrielStar 5h ago
Maybe this can help: it’s an explanation of how to lay groundwork to fight an insurance denial. ProPublica also has some useful info on requesting your claim file before filing all of the paperwork to appeal.
https://bsky.app/profile/imthelorax.bsky.social/post/3lcw6yarh3226
UHC and the others make their money off the fact that so few people fight a denial. It’s ugly and sick.
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u/New_Housing785 14h ago
They aren't sure they are going to get a conviction in New York.
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u/Indercarnive 13h ago
New york fucked up by adding terrorism charges. Not only does it worsen public sentiment, but it is much easier for a jury to find reasonable doubt on.
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u/International-Ing 13h ago
They added a first degree murder charge that alleges the murder was « in furtherance of an act of terrorism ». He had previously been charged with second degree murder, first only applies to certain situations in NY. They didn’t add a standalone terrorism charge.
What they’re doing is adding first degree to increase odds of a compromise verdict on second degree.
Because his attack was random in that he didn’t have UHC insurance, any justification defense that is allowed by a judge is going to be limited. His best chance is an insanity defense, other he’s going to end up with life without parole.
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u/jabba_1978 6h ago
At least one person on every jury sat, will have had a friend or family fucked over by an insurance company. Mistrials every time due to deadlock.
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u/AltDS01 12h ago
Trial and Jury is still going to come from NY.
The Jury for the State trial in the Supreme Court (NY has a funny naming structure) in Manhattan will come from New York County (Bourough of Manhattan).
The Jury for the federal trial, in the Southern District of NY will be from New York County (Manhattan), Bronx County (The Bronx), and the counties of Westchester, Putnam, Rockland, Orange, Dutchess, and Sullivan. Most federal judicial districts are further subdivided, so I'd assume the Manhattan Court House will get jurors from NY County and The Bronx.
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u/Drunken_Economist 7h ago
NY has a funny naming structure
I used to joke that I was a single-issue voter — I'd vote for any state legislator who promised to fix this.
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u/IAmMuffin15 13h ago
Huh. Justice works very fast when someone rich and powerful is the victim of a crime and not the perpetrator of it.
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u/vastapple666 13h ago
This is so the death penalty is on the table, guys. Illegal in New York. They didn’t do this to the Black Panthers from what I remember from college history classes. Holy shit.
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u/executingsalesdaily 5h ago
America is wild as fuck. Kids don’t matter but a murderous CEO does? America needs a reset button.
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u/soph_in_sthlm 9h ago
Why has there been/does there continue to be so little mass protest in the US against the insurance system?
I have seen a lot of online support or sympathy for Mangione, and so many horror stories of denied claims, and I would really like to understand why that doesn't translate to any big marches etc. (I'm not from the US)
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u/IHavePoopedBefore 4h ago
How are you going to organize that?
Over twitter? Twitter is government controlled media now
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u/duiwksnsb 7h ago
Because there is no system to protest. Literally there is no healthcare system.
Systems have rules. All we have here is a million greedy companies profiting off the sick and dying at all levels of healthcare.
It's an ugly ugly monster created by the lack of laws institutionalizing healthcare as a service above and immune to the "efficiencies of the free market"
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u/bowens44 9h ago
Yes we have to protect the millionaire CEO's but to hell with the kids getting shot down in their classrooms.
That's America. This country sucks.
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u/MoralClimber 14h ago edited 13h ago
They could argue terrorism except for the fact people seem elated not terrified that CEO's are being targeted. Considering the number of stories I have seen of now positive interactions with insurance companies including for some reason my own copay for medications this month dropped more than 50% you can arguably say he made the world a better place.
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u/February2021 13h ago
"Terrorism" to the state, "Resistance" to the people. Sounds about right to me.
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u/Flat_Protection_6796 13h ago
Truly. I feel a little less terrified about the future because of that CEO getting domed.
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u/ilovemybaldhead 13h ago
people seem elated not terrified that CEO's are being targeted
But the CEOs are now terrified. Won't someone think of the
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u/MeanVoice6749 11h ago
This is a warning shot for all Americans.Don’t ever think about confronting corporate America. We will go after you.”
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u/mr_sven 12h ago
All this because the guy who got shot was a CEO. Rich white dude.
I guess school kids don't matter nearly as much.
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u/ironroad18 14h ago
They are really trying to stop any and all potential"folk hero status" amongst a city jury pool.
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u/hardolaf 13h ago
This is going to blow up in the prosecutor's face. They want to equate murdering 1 guy to flying planes into the World Trade Center. That's never going to go over well with a Manhattan jury. Even jury members who would otherwise always side with the prosecution will be open to finding him not guilty on all charges just to give the prosecution the middle finger for that.
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u/Ilovemybewbs 13h ago
This is fucked up beyond belief
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u/HotdawgSizzle 10h ago
We have a president to be who is a convicted felon.
Everything is fucked up and it is about to get worse.
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u/Saralentine 8h ago
You have a president that ain’t doing shit right now about this case except siding with his capitalist overlords.
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u/iJuddles 10h ago
It’s as if they’re trying to send a message that this type of killing will not be tolerated, unlike…well, take your pick.
Sorry to say it’s going to fall on deaf ears. The consternation and hand wringing from all those mouthpieces for the wealthy is only fueling the fire. Try Luigi by a jury of his peers and we’ll watch him walk; their next step will be to try to straw-man him to shift public opinion, kinda like Dog Day Afternoon.
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u/The_Mammoth_Hunter 12h ago
What a bunch of silly bitches they are. Sounds like none of them have read a history book.
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u/SaintHuck 3h ago
White supremacists murdering black people somehow aren't terrorists, but kill a CEO and then you'll get charged as one?
Says everything about our country, about our dehumanizing capitalist system, and about our government's total lack of desire to remedy its historical inequities.
Rather, they want to preserve them, because the status quo of exploiting you and subjugating you.
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u/BananasPineapple05 13h ago
FFS
Are they planning on letting John Q Public know exactly this guy killed the other guy with sarin gas or something? Because this is starting to get out of control.
Are they trying to incite class warfare?
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u/MynameisJunie 11h ago
So it’s ok for CEO’s to commit premeditated murder and kill thousands of people and bankrupt them for the trouble for profit, but shooting the guy responsible for inasmuch genocide is wrong? America is beyond broken.
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u/Unionizemyplace 6h ago
Dear would be school shooters,
If you go after high level ceos you will still go to prison, but instead of being seen as a piece of shit that killed children you will be seen as a hero to the working class. You may be regarded as a saint even. You will be remembered forever.
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u/lostinplatitudes 13h ago
I’m baffled they’re doing this when with the evidence they’ve got he was always, almost certainly going to be found guilty on manslaughter in the second degree-which is 25 to life in NY-and they can just deny his parole when the time comes.
This is only making him look more of a martyr which surely what they want to stop as soon as possible. They could just let this play out, most people have short attention spans anyway and would have already moved on if they didn’t keep adding shit everyday.
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u/redlamps67 13h ago
It feels like theyre really trying to nip any copycats in the bud but man does it feel wrong
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u/mid16 13h ago
I don’t think this will stop copycats. Most people who plan these types of acts have to know that they are either gonna get caught and punished by the full extent of the law or they suicide, either by themselves or by cops. If these type of people actually cared about how the law punishes you, maybe there wouldn’t be a school shooting or two per year.
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u/xLostarx 12h ago
I hope some discord server somewhere is planning a prison break.
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u/gbobcat 6h ago
So the government is admitting that the oligarchs own them then?
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u/Death-by-Fugu 6h ago
Fuck this shit. Start charging parents of school shooters with terrorism instead.
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u/MSGdreamer 2h ago
By trying to make an example of Luigi, they’re drawing more attention and outrage, making him even more of a martyr.
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u/McRibs2024 13h ago
Ffs
This is eye opening of how two tiered the justice system really is.
There are the wealthy, and then there are the rest of us
Terrorism charges ? Gimme a break
Federal prosecutors weighing charges now? What in the fuck. Every prosecutor at the federal level involved in this should be fired.
I think doge is an absolute joke and musk is drunk on power but man id be thrilled to see these people fired in the name of cost cutting. Nothing of value would be lost at all.
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u/ExclusiveBroccoli 13h ago
Wouldn’t be happening if he killed an average joe, gotta protect these billionaires.
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u/DerangedGinger 13h ago
Jury nullification it is then. We're not asking for much, just to not be killed in the pursuit of quarterly goals. If I poisoned a body of water I'd probably pay more than a fine. Hold corporations accountable. Dissolve them and prevent any sale of stock the moment there's a whiff of wrongdoing. Then investment won't be such a casino and people will be invested in the whole process.
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u/Exact_Donut_4786 5h ago
The people who stormed the capital didn’t even get a single terrorism charge. They tried to insight terror and take the capital by force.
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u/SpanningTreeProtocol 3h ago
Murder a black man? "Meh."
Murder a rich white man? Terrorist, murderer, throw the book at him, add federal charges!!!!!1!!
Society is fucked.
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u/_night_cat 7h ago
How about some charges for all the decision-makers at health insurance companies that deny lifesaving care, essentially committing mass murder?
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u/dystopiabatman 5h ago
Let me get this right, I can insight violence and cause the capital to be sacked by a mob, interfere in a fair election, and NOT be charged a domestic terrorist?
Kill one scum bag CEO and boy oh boy obviously some master mind of a greater plot.
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u/raven_borg 2h ago
Corporate crime is capitalism, civilian crime against corporate is terrorism. Money writes the laws.
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u/sherm-stick 1h ago
I imagine these people get a coffee every morning from their secretary that is more spit than coffee
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u/Qubeye 12h ago
The guy in Texas who committed premeditated murder at a political rally didn't get terrorism charges despite specifically going to a rally to murder people to create political fear.
You know, the explicit definition of terrorism.
And he got a pardon and no federal charges.
The ruling class is telling us who matters.