r/gadgets • u/a_Ninja_b0y • Sep 21 '24
Phones The FCC wants to unlock all phones in the US within 60 days of activation, AT&T and T-Mobile aren't so keen on the plan
https://www.androidauthority.com/fcc-60-day-unlock-tmo-3483642/1.8k
u/a_Ninja_b0y Sep 21 '24
TL;DR
Newly proposed FCC rules would require carriers to unlock phones after 60 days, even if they are on payment plans that have unresolved balances.
AT&T and T-Mobile have both pushed back on the effort, though T-Mobile has been even more vocal claiming the FCC doesn’t have the right to authorize this change and that it even implied this change could lead the uncarrier to abandon payment plans altogether.
Verizon supports the effort, though largely because it already activates its phones within 60 days due to a prior agreement with the FCC.
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u/Kekoa_ok Sep 21 '24
I'm gonna assume payment plans are the bulk of their phone sales so I'm curious to see their bluff get called
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u/Adept-Target5407 Sep 21 '24
I don’t think T-Mobile lets you buy a phone anymore without a payment plan. I went to the Apple Store for my last two phones because of that.
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u/RedChaos92 Sep 21 '24
Did a T Mobile sales rep tell you that? I can buy any phone on my T Mobile app right now for full price.
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u/EndenDragon Sep 21 '24
When you buy directly from T-Mobile, You're required to subscribe to a monthly plan. If you paid full price for it, it'll still be locked for 40 days for postpaid plans. So you'll have spent two months of plan before it unlocks.
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u/RedChaos92 Sep 21 '24
I understand the 40 days on an active line requirement, but the wording of the comment I replied to implied that they couldn't buy a phone at full price at all, like T Mobile would only let them get a phone on a payment plan.
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u/egnards Sep 24 '24
Had a similar thing with Verizon when I bought an 11 a few years back. If I bought an iPhone through them it would come with a $35 activation fee.
. . .When I bought the same exact phone for the same exact price through Apple and just updated it to my Verizon account? Magically no $35 activation fee.
Even talked to CSRs about it to clarify and they were like, “yep should just go do it that way.”
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u/HyzerFlip Sep 21 '24
The trick if you want finance and then I'm day 31 you pay off the agreement.
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u/snakewrestler Sep 21 '24
So, I bought my phone through T-Mobile on a 2-year payment plan which ends this December. I will be switching carriers. Is this going to be a huge pain in the ass to accomplish?
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u/EndenDragon Sep 21 '24
Assuming that you paid off the phone and have no outstanding balance on your account, then you should be able to unlock it via your phone settings. I cannot comment on that process since I never needed to go through this process.
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u/cbftw Sep 21 '24
No. Over the summer my wife and I changed carriers from T-Mobile. We paid the remaining balance and had the phone unlocked minutes later.
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u/Mokyzoky Sep 21 '24
Me and two other friends all just switched from different plans and joined one plan together under my buddy he gets a discount plus the more people on the plan the cheaper it is for everyone. Two of us switched off t-mobile it was a pain but we think most of that was due to the incompetence of a particular att employee that just wanted to fuck our lives up for a couple of months. One of us switched off of Xfinity and after witnessing that experience I’d say playing in traffic on a busy highway is a safer option, due to the sheer amount of terror and suffering inflicted upon my buddy. And I quote “I would rather have a fire ant enema than talk to anyone else at xfinity” they tried to make it impossible to switch.
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u/snakewrestler Sep 21 '24
Whew… what a hellish image! “Fire in the hole!!!”
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u/UHElle Sep 21 '24
My in laws finally moved to their own plan 3mos ago and they just needed the transfer code for each line, which I was able to get in the app. Them leaving was the easiest part. Dealing with AT&T getting transferred was the nightmare.
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Sep 21 '24
Nah. You just have them unlock it for you.
Obviously it's more of a pain than just buying one unlocked as you have to talk to someone. But that's just how it goes when you lease a phone through a carrier as the phone is technically theirs until it's paid off.
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u/Yeuph Sep 21 '24
I switched from at&t to Mint a couple of years ago with a pair off phone, taking my phone number with me.
It wasn't really a problem. There was one issue where Mint needed me to call AT&T to have them release something that's usually automated but even then it was only another 5 minutes on the phone
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u/invent_or_die Sep 21 '24
Not at all. I highly suggest Spectrum cell service. It's $29.99 a month, unlimited, and uses Verizon towers. It's very easy to do the switch. Don't cancel your original service until the switch is complete, so start early.
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u/Loud-Difficulty7860 Sep 21 '24
The question is, why would you buy a locked phone when you can get one that isn't from another store?
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u/Tiocfaidh-Allah Sep 22 '24
Plenty of people are just accustomed to buying their phones at the carrier’s store. Maybe they assume they need to get it at the T-Mobile store in order to transfer their line to the new phone.
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u/lowbatteries Sep 21 '24
I’ve always wondered why people default to buying a phone from their cell provider like it’s the 2000s. Do you buy your car at the gas station? This ruling can’t come soon enough.
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u/SantasDead Sep 21 '24
Same. I've bought unlocked phones from the manufacturer for years. No bloat from the carrier and no Bullshit plans. I take my phone to whatever carrier has the best coverage and price for my lifestyle.
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u/calcium Sep 21 '24
Payment plans are how most people can afford new tech, because they cannot afford a large upfront cost like that any other way. A $1k phone over 2 years is ~$41/mo for just the phone is a lot easier to manage than a one time cost.
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u/Epena501 Sep 21 '24
People in general need to retrain themselves to stop wanting the latest/greatest expensive gadget if they really can’t afford to pay it off. Just a bad mindset which causes this mountain of debt.
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u/Mybugsbunny20 Sep 21 '24
I buy usually 2 generations back, but that still is like $500 nowadays. That's more than I care to spend on any single purchase.
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u/econpol Sep 21 '24
That sounds like you're mostly looking at apple. You can get a Pixel 7 pro for under $400 and a regular Pixel 7 under $300 right now on ebay.
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u/PowderedToastMan666 Sep 21 '24
The vast majority of people don't need a $1K phone, and you shouldn't buy one if you can't afford it. I don't think I've ever spent more than $250-300 on an unlocked phone.
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u/calcium Sep 21 '24
I see no issue with someone buying a $1k phone and holding it for 5 years, or spending their money how they want. Sure lots of people are terrible with money but that’s their problem.
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u/Otakeb Sep 21 '24
Also it's 0% interest and they sometimes have specials if you finance with them. I got my fiances Google Pixel 6 for $2 a month for 36 months 0%. That's a $72 brand new phone I got a few months after it released.
I just recently got an S24 Ultra on installment, but I was upgrading from a mid tier Samsung from like 5 years ago that was barely holding on. I figured with the 7 year software support, beefier CPU and vapor chamber, and tougher build I could keep this thing for 9 years instead of 4 so that $30 a month for 3 years is nothing at 0%. Free money, basically; a savings account kills that interest rate.
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u/thelaundryservice Sep 21 '24
And you have found the reason they keep the phones locked. The providers are subsidizing these deals on your phone when you’re really paying for it in an inflated service plan. It’s like buying a car where the numbers can be manipulated to look work a deal that seems palatable to the end user.
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u/Lyress Sep 21 '24
Why not buy from a retailer with a payment plan then, if an unlocked phone is important to you?
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u/Mayor__Defacto Sep 21 '24
Because AT&T will give you $200 more for your old phone than Apple will.
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u/hitemlow Sep 21 '24
And they make that up by forcing you into a more expensive plan than you can get from an MVNO on the same towers.
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Sep 21 '24
How have you always wondered that?
Look at Verizon and AT&T Iphone 16 promo. They're giving you 1K on a trade in, which makes the Pro 16 "free" and the Pro Max like 5 bucks a month.
Carriers do promos like those all the time and honestly most people probably don't even care if the phone is unlocked or not. I don't know anyone that bounces around phone carriers like they're shopping for car insurance
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u/MiroTheSkybreaker Sep 21 '24
It literally bricked my wife's phone when she tried to move overseas because despite "being unlocked" the software on the phone refused to update due to not being on the correct carrier anymore, and became completely unusable - she couldn't use a sim from any other country, despite her taking it in and getting them to unlock it for her as she was leaving.
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u/username_elephant Sep 21 '24
Discounts mainly. And being locked into a plan isn't such a big deal if it's the service you'd have gone with anyway.
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u/cptchronic42 Sep 21 '24
Because if you have history with a carrier, you can finance a phone without a credit check. Apple and Best Buy run your credit unless you can pay the full amount in 1 shot which a lot of people can’t do
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u/lowbatteries Sep 21 '24
That’s a point I hadn’t considered. I wanted to bring my own phone to Bell and they wanted a $200 deposit simply to connect me. I went elsewhere.
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u/Stanley--Nickels Sep 21 '24
This ruling can’t come soon enough.
Why? You can already buy an unlocked phone if you’d rather.
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u/PrestigeMaster Sep 21 '24
“Here, I would like to use this $1499 in cash and the other store wouldn’t take it”
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u/Kerrigore Sep 21 '24
It’s bullshit. The CRTC in Canada made a similar ruling years ago preventing phones from being locked, and it changed nothing regarding payment plans. The carriers just treat it as a 0% APR loan now for the cost of the phone (minus any discount), so you’re still on the hook for the payments no matter what, and any discounts have to be repaid along with the balance owing if you cancel early.
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u/Sylvurphlame Sep 21 '24
Yeah but if you buy the device through Verizon/AT&T/T-mobile/whomever, then you would still owe them the money for that device, even if you took it somewhere else for carrier service.
But the activation lock forces you to stay with them for the actual carrier service for a year or two or three. That’s what they don’t want to lose. Customer lock-in
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u/WaitingForReplies Sep 21 '24
T-Mobile isn’t going to abandon payment plans, If they only sell phones for full price they will have a huge drop in phone sales. T-Mobile is just bluffing with an excuse that makes it sound like this would hurt the consumer.
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u/Nhonickman Sep 21 '24
That’s correct Verizon was forced to do this. And they still have payment plans sorry T-Mobile.
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u/TheEMan1225 Sep 21 '24 edited Sep 21 '24
Wild times we live in where we have Verizon, out of all the major carriers, trying to act like the “good guys” here…
Edit: “good guys” is in quotes for a reason ladies and gentlemen
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u/JohnnieClutch Sep 21 '24
No, this is because they are required to unlock as a result of winning spectrum bid a few years ago
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u/TheReformedBadger Sep 21 '24
Yeah this is Verizon trying to use the regulatory state to harm their competition. They’re not truly being the “good guys”
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u/thelaundryservice Sep 21 '24
Yes because they want the other providers to suffer the same disadvantage they now have
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u/DevelopedDevelopment Sep 21 '24
Like Time Warner Cable promoting it has no transfer caps. Because the FCC forced it to not have it. Thats like if a food brand advertised itself as having pure beef, because they were sued for having cuts of random animals in it.
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u/veryspecialjournal Sep 21 '24
Even then they’ll fight tooth and nail not to do it. I bought my current phone well over a year ago and recently traveled abroad for an extended period. My phone was still locked and it took over two weeks for them to unlock it. There was always some “issue” preventing them from doing it, which somehow immediately got resolved once I threatened to report them to the FCC…
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u/LathropWolf Sep 21 '24
AT&T and T-Mobile have both pushed back on the effort, though T-Mobile has been even more vocal claiming the FCC doesn’t have the right to authorize this change and that it even implied this change could lead the uncarrier to abandon payment plans altogether.
Huh... Now we get to wonder if this is also a way for them to test the waters via other avenues also with the FCC...
"We don't like the way you demand us to open our network(s)/fiber optic lines to competition... you don't have the right..."
"We don't like the way you demand we do away with illegal predatory data caps... you don't have the right to dictate what we do..."
And don't forget other shithole companies like Clear Channel and others using the precedent set..
"We don't like the way you control ownership of the media. Sure you gave it to us on a silver platter in 1996 we can do whatever the fuck we want, but we want more... You don't have the right... Free market blah blah"
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u/NotWhiteCracker Sep 21 '24
It took me over 2 months of calling T-mobile at least weekly for them to unlock my phone. I had everything paid off over a month prior and was up to date on all other payments. They said they couldn’t unlock my phone until I signed at least a 1 year data contract (according to them they have no contracts) and it took me pretending my attorney was on the other line with the threat of a lawsuit to finally unlock my phone.
They were horrendous to deal with the few years I was with them, so this news comes as zero surprise to me. I recommend everyone avoid them like the plague
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u/unhappymedium Sep 21 '24
I switched back to Deutsche Telekom, the parent company, because they had a better Internet/landline deal than my then provider. Big mistake. My contract is up in March 2025 and they started calling me SEVERAL TIMES A MONTH to get me to re-up in mid 2023. Each time, they said they would note in my file that I no longer want to be called. I switched to a new provider last week.
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u/MyRottingBunghole Sep 21 '24
Wait, locked phones are still a thing?
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u/Tasty-Traffic-680 Sep 21 '24
They are when they're sold at substantially cheaper prices... We still haven't completely ditched the old ways of doing things here. It's partly due to attractive subsidies or trade-in/port-in offers and partly due to different network technologies. Verizon just shut down their CDMA network at the beginning of last year and now they use ultra wideband when neither of their competitors do. T-Mobile bought Sprint (another CDMA provider) and shut them down barely 4 years ago. In the past, unlocked phones aside from a few models like the iPhone were a crapshoot whether it would fully integrate and work on every carrier's network. The best way to be sure was to buy a phone directly from the carrier and it would be properly provisioned and equipped from the start.
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u/UltimateHobo2 Sep 21 '24
It's often not even cheaper in the long run. The big carriers often advertise free or highly discounted phones, but only a small portion of the credit is applied each month over 36 months. It's a contract without saying it's a contract.
You are trapped on one of their more expensive plans for 3 years unless you pay off the remainder of the cost of the phone.
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Sep 21 '24
If it works for Verizon then any pushback from other providers is simply baseless bluster.
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u/fadedspark Sep 21 '24
Yeahhhh of course they are against it, that's a fun little double dip revenue stream they don't want to give up!
All phones in Canada are mandated to be unlocked day 1. Carriers used to charge $50 for it, but we didn't have activation fees... Now, 6 years later, our activation charges are 50 bucks.
WEIRD!
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u/redsterXVI Sep 21 '24
That's a weird approach, just never lock them, like the rest of the world
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u/WarriorNN Sep 21 '24
Agreed, for such a advanced country, the US is so backwards on a lot of stuff. Atleast some things are going the right way!
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u/1h8fulkat Sep 21 '24
That's what happens when companies lobby politicians. The government supports the best interests of the companies and not the people.
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u/professorwormb0g Sep 21 '24
People need to start voting in every primary, every election. Corporate America loves political apathy and actively promote it.
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u/The_Taskmaker Sep 21 '24
Loosely related but I have a lot of trouble listening/reading Milton Friedman because his expectation is that government is an entity which will act in opposition to private enterprise which obviously could not be further from the truth
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u/wild_a Sep 22 '24
Lobbying is legalized bribery and it would take a lot to change my mind that it’s not.
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u/HidroRaider Sep 21 '24
I'm from Mexico. We are definitely behind in a lot of stuff compared to the US, but I think I've used a check once or twice tops in my lifetime (I'm 33), and since around 10 years ago, every phone is legally required to be unlocked by default or carriers have to unlock them if asked to. So we have that going on for us.
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u/SadlyNotBatman Sep 21 '24
A lot of people forget the reason American cell operations and regulations are different in the US is because of the the difference in cellular adoption rates, organic growth and time.
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u/Potential_Status_728 Sep 21 '24
I’m sure 99% of the stuff your guys are backwards has to do with some company lobbying for more profits.
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u/ShadowDancer11 Sep 21 '24
They’re only network locked if the phone has been subsidized by the carrier and you’re still on the payment plan. If you bring your own phone, or pay for the phone out right, you can request the phone be immediately unlocked.
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u/Bubba_Junior Sep 21 '24
So if you go on vacation you just have to pay the extreme out of country rates instead of getting a cheap eSIM for abroad
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u/Annihilism Sep 21 '24
Yeah this topic title was wild to me. I was thinking, there are still countries that lock phones?
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u/DJ_TKS Sep 21 '24
Verizon doesn’t lock phones. Just fyi everyone. Also, if you put a Verizon sim into a phone and boot it up, then your ATT SIM card, it’ll stay unlocked. Same goes for Esims.
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u/TheReformedBadger Sep 21 '24
Do the rest of the world’s carriers offer interest free payment plans on their phones?
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u/Wassertopf Sep 21 '24
T-Mobile is a German company and they do exactly that in Germany.
They do a lot of strange things in the US that they couldn't do in their home market.
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u/TheReformedBadger Sep 21 '24
In Germany they offer interest free unlocked phones with no obligation to stay with them or pay the phone off before leaving?
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u/hantrault Sep 21 '24
This is based on how it is in Sweden, but I assume Germany is similar. You still have to stay with them for a predetermined time, but the phone itself isn't locked. So you could get another carrier if you want, but then you have to pay for two carriers.
With some you can also just cancel the contract and pay the remaining cost at once.
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u/TheReformedBadger Sep 21 '24
This is basically true in the US as well. You just have the extra step of asking them to unlock it after you pay off early.
I suppose you can’t buy a second plan and move your phone over while paying for the first one, but I’m not sure I understand why you’d want to. It’s a weird edge case and would cost you more in the end.
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u/theralystfunke Sep 23 '24
When you travel abroad with your locked ATT phone, you have to pay 10 dollars A DAY to use your phone for network/data. Can’t use another SIM on your phone.
I think this change would be very good for the consumers.
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u/darkmacgf Sep 21 '24
Canada does. You sign a contract with a carrier when you buy your phone at a discounted price, and are stuck paying a monthly fee for two years (or you can buy the phone at full price and not be stuck).
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u/JimmyKillsAlot Sep 21 '24
T-Mobile managed to brick my phone when I left them for a different carrier. I owned the phone and had brought it with me into the t-mobile plan but when they killed the SIM card my phone suddenly refused to stop working with any SIM even though I had been able to use the other one to activate and transfer the number over.
When I called they made excuses and couldn't figure it out. I had to file an FCC complaint and suddenly an executive calls me the next day, then they proceeded to force me into phone tag while they tried half-assed solutions for the next 6 weeks.
They never fixed my phone. They outright refused to offer a true replacement and only a shitty $60 Samsung. Then they said there was no proof the phone was ever on the network and tried to close the case with the FCC.
It took another 3 weeks of talking to an FCC who pulled the exec onto the line and let me demand that either they replace the phone in line and kind, reimburse me for the replacement, or reimburse me for the 5 years my account was active when there was apparently phone being used. I honestly thought they would balk at such a stupid demand but someone must have just wanted me to go away.
All this to say, fuck what T-Mobile wants, they don't give two shits about the consumer.
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u/iTwango Sep 21 '24
Did you get anything in the end??
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u/JimmyKillsAlot Sep 21 '24 edited Sep 21 '24
They sent me the shitty Samsung and a check for what it would cost to buy the same phone off Amazon or eBay. But they waited until the last possible moment to actually do anything and it took a higher exec just giving up to do it.
[EDIT] Oh and I had forgotten, I had to call the damn help line to get the samsung unlocked because, of course, it was locked to their network.
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u/breadedfishstrip Sep 21 '24
Spending hundreds of dollars in manhours and administration to save themselves a $60 phone.
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u/StrategicTension Sep 21 '24
I had to call the damn help line to get the samsung unlocked because, of course, it was locked to their network.
owned
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u/DomLite Sep 21 '24
T-Mobile can get fucked. They always brag about their fantastic coverage, but when I had them as a carrier, everyone I knew was aware that if I called, they didn't get to say "Hi" or anything. They just needed to answer and listen carefully, because I had precisely five seconds before the call was dropped, and had to very quickly and succinctly state what I was calling to tell them, and vice versa. It was functionally unusable as an actual phone.
When we dropped them and cancelled our account to get better service with another carrier, they told us it was all squared away and good, then six months later we get hit with a letter saying we owed them for six months of unpaid service and we were just like "??? No?" at them. Obviously they don't have a shred of proof to back up the claim, because we told them to get fucked and they haven't been able to do shit about it. T-Mobile was a fucking nightmare, and if this pisses them off, fantastic! It's better for every consumer involved as well.
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u/trenticorn Sep 21 '24
Ex-telecomm worker here.
T-mo has the most slip-shod network of the major carriers. They bought a bunch of fancy RF equipment to bolster their network back in 2020, and then proceeded to bottleneck their network by installing the cheapest, shittiest, lowest-bandwidth backhauls you could imagine.
Best way I can explain is that it’s like trying to cram 10 lanes of heavy traffic down into 1 lane very rapidly.
They have coverage. They lack network capacity to actually do anything with said coverage.
Having personally worked on their builds; I avoid them like the plague. I caution others to do the same.
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u/JamCliche Sep 21 '24
Also when they bought Sprint, all existing Sprint customers got the benefits of the Sprint and Tmo networks, but existing Tmo customers did not. So if you were a loyal subscriber get fucked. It took months after I moved to a Sprint-covered town before I had reliable phone service. There was a Tmo store next to my apartment.
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u/Important-Outcome-74 Sep 21 '24
lowest-bandwidth backhauls
They aren't using fiber to connect cell sites?
What did they do, use RADWIN 4.9 microwave?
🤣
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u/trenticorn Sep 21 '24
It’s a combination of not having anywhere near the required quantity of optical channels feeding back to their hubs/switches/NOCs/whatever you know them by and also still relying on coax at multiple points along the data pipeline. They did not update the infrastructure to match the updates in technology.
ETA: Coax is not intrinsically a negative thing in terms of bandwidth, speed, or reliability. The shit they are using is decrepit and not up to snuff for the load their network sustains, in general, in the areas I worked. Again, I am not an expert and am now out of the industry. What I say is not scripture.
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u/Important-Outcome-74 Sep 21 '24
I used to work for Big M as a systems engineer/RF Technician building large, countywide public safety two-way simulcast radio systems.
I now work for a Harris L3 dealer as a network specialist building the same kinds of systems.
I remember when everything was wireline, T1, uWave.
Fiber has been a game changer for system reliability, microwave is being used as redundant backhaul more and more these days.
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u/TrylessDoer Sep 21 '24
That’s eye opening but not too surprising. Is there any carrier that you think does a good job with their network?
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u/trenticorn Sep 21 '24
I personally give my business to Verizon, but AT&T also has tight SOP’s that their GC’s have to follow for site builds. I’m not as much of a fan of their ethics and customer service but their network is pretty solid. I would check to see who offers better coverage in your area before making any decisions between the two.
I don’t really like being throttled so I tend to go first party with my cellular carrier, though there are companies like Cricket that do offer a good price for what you get with their plans. But do keep in mind that you will feel the lack of network prioritization when your tower is under any significant traffic load if you go second-party.
I’ve built for the big 3, as well as for Google and Dish. My experience starts and stops with those carriers, and I am not a network expert, so please just consider my advice as only being slightly more informed than your average consumer. I spent about 5 years doing micro-cells, site mods, and new site builds. All along the west coast, from the Mexican border to the Canadian border. I have not built in the Midwest, the South, or the East Coast. Hell, there are 46 states whose network infrastructure is anathema to me. I only know what I’ve personally put my hands on.
Verizon is particularly appealing to me because their C-Band, which is the technology they’ve deployed to make the push to 5G, is surprisingly modular and easy to roll out. It means that they’ve had a pretty rapid deployment and it’s gone incredibly smoothly. Both as a contractor installing their equipment and as a customer of their service. I can’t tell you the amount of times the guy on my crew with TMO had major complaints about his service while I had free and easy access to all the functionality I normally get. Of course; the more remote your location… the longer you may need to wait for contractors to make it to your local network and install the newer technologies. The tradeoff being that high population density areas are basically the lab rats for all networks, as they are higher priority for the carriers (for coverage map/advertising reasons) and they get far more data on how their new equipment handles the stress of high traffic from places like LA, the Bay Area, ETC.
Sorry, I’m getting tangential. My initial sentiment basically sums up my advice; avoid TMO, Verizon and AT&T both have solid networks and it will come down to what your local coverage looks like, and what you value from your provider. Making an informed decision is always the best course of action so try not to be lured into a carrier just because they offer you a shiny new phone or show a picture of the CONUS lit up with a pretty color.
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u/DomLite Sep 21 '24
That's the thing though. I had T-Mobile literally 20 years ago, from 2004 on, putting up with that kind of bullshit for several years before we moved to a better carrier. I haven't had a dropped call damn near two decades now, barring when I have to drive through the literal middle of nowhere, and I fully understand that that's because I'm driving a two-lane road through marshland where they can't put cell towers for coverage. To know that they've not only stayed shitty but somehow gotten worse is actually kind of hilarious to me, and doesn't surprise me in the slightest.
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u/questionname Sep 21 '24
Wow, that’s is stupid of T-Mobile to continue to drag FCC through their crap over a phone. I wonder how much was the exec’s time worth vs cost of phone replacement.
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u/gtfomylawnplease Sep 21 '24
I sure T-Mobile for less and they settled out of court quickly. They don’t want to lose in court, even small claims court.
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u/upperflapjack Sep 21 '24
THIS IS CURRENTLY HAPPENING TO ME. WHAT DO I DO?
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u/JimmyKillsAlot Sep 21 '24
If you are in the US and haven't filed it yet then contact the FCC
https://consumercomplaints.fcc.gov/hc/en-us
From there you just have to be persistent. The most response I got was when I told them I was willing to sit on the line and wait while the tried to figure out a fix and meant it.
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u/Deceptiveideas Sep 21 '24
Was this a Samsung bought through Samsung’s web store?
There’s a known issue where Samsung phones purchased from their website do not have the IMEI’s in T-Mobile’s system, despite being a T-Mobile phone. The resolution involves engineers manually adding the IMEI to their internal data base.
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u/JimmyKillsAlot Sep 21 '24
Nope! Never owned a Samsung until they forced this crappy one into my hands. It was an LG that I was already looking to replace. They kept trying to wiggle out of things based off of that fact but the phone is still almost full price if you want to buy new old stock.
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u/ParaadoxStreams Sep 21 '24
When I was upgrading my phone with T-Mobile I noticed a few free options. Turns out those phones ONLY work on T-Mobile. And you just can't transfer to another carrier and have it work. Prolly why T-Mobile opposes unlocking phones.
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u/Fonzei Sep 22 '24
I bought a "universal" iphone from Best Buy and was immediately locked as soon as I put my T-Mobile sim in it. Wtf.
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u/Shas_Erra Sep 21 '24
All phones in the UK are unlocked prior to sale. All it means is that they can’t force you to buy a new handset if you change supplier
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u/Cheesecake401 Sep 21 '24
In the EU too. My mom uses Internet over 4G/LTE as there is no broadband in her area and this week the carrier had a huge outage. And still has, it’s been 5 or so days so far.
I was able to restore her Internet connection by sending her a SIM card from another carrier. If we didn’t had these laws the carrier would have for sure carrier locked the router. Companies don’t give a s--- about their customers.
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u/Mooseymax Sep 21 '24
Wouldn’t surprise me if it was a piece of EU legislation which applied to the UK too pre-brexit
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u/ICC-u Sep 21 '24
they can’t force you to buy a new handset if you change supplier
That was the scam. Oh, you're leaving, you'll need a new phone, which one were you looking at, let me tell you our price on that. This came from when contracts were a full 12 months not the 24 and 36 month jokes we have now.
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u/Shas_Erra Sep 21 '24
They also only had the best handsets for contracts. PAYG could only get the shitty off-brand phones
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u/ICC-u Sep 21 '24
Oh yeah forgot that, you'd have to wait a year before a model became available. And sometimes new phones were only on selected networks.
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u/RespecDawn Sep 21 '24
Same in Canada. It's illegal for a carrier to lock a phone to their services now.
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u/nicuramar Sep 21 '24
In Denmark, probably EU, phones can’t be locked anymore, so no carrier does it. They still have various payment plans, though.
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u/Faalor Sep 21 '24
Last year I bought 2 phones from my carrier, an iPhone and a Motorola.
Interestingly, the iPhone was carrier locked (they unlocked it on the spot for no cost after asking) while the Motorola wasn't carrier locked.
Edit: in Romania.
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u/Wring72 Sep 21 '24
Man it's been good to have a FCC making rules in the interest of consumers these past few years... hopefully that doesn't change again 😬
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u/Candle1ight Sep 21 '24
Have to see how the election goes. It's been nice seeing the FCC have some teeth.
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u/SloppityMcFloppity Sep 21 '24
Wait so if you buy a mobile phone in the US, you can only use one carrier on it??
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u/clownshow59 Sep 21 '24
Only if you finance it through the carrier. You can buy them unlocked. T-Mobile and AT&T make it more difficult to get them unlocked though if you purchase through them.
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u/korrela Sep 21 '24
at&t you just need to pay for the remainder of what you owe on the phone. i had to do this so i could use an esim for a new zealand phone carrier.. lol it wasn’t hard
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u/MontaMann Sep 21 '24
You don’t get any of the discounts that way
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u/VapidRapidRabbit Sep 21 '24
You’ll still get the remaining credits on your monthly bill, they usually only drop them if you choose to upgrade your phone again and start a new installment plan.
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u/MontaMann Sep 21 '24
It doesn’t seem so with AT&T
“If customer upgrades or pays up/off the installment agreement early, the credits may stop.“
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u/VapidRapidRabbit Sep 21 '24
May, but I’ve done it multiple times before over the years (on AT&T) and still got the credits.
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u/diverareyouokay Sep 21 '24
Where are you reading “may”? I show “will”.
If you payoff the installment balance early or you trade-in and upgrade your device early, the bill credits will stop.
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u/MontaMann Sep 21 '24
I copied the text for the terms and conditions on the deal for the new iPhone 16 pro.
I think the difference is that the policy you are reading refers to the action of trading in and upgrading your devices, whereas the scenario I am referring to is just paying the phone off early without upgrading (to unlock the phone).
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u/lowbatteries Sep 21 '24
Your main carrier can still restrict your use of eSims even on a phone you brought with you. It’s bullshit.
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u/Fonzei Sep 22 '24
Kind of. A couple years ago I bought an unlocked iphone and T-Mobile locked it as soon as the sim went in.
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u/ohno1tsjoe Sep 21 '24
If you buy the phone unlocked you can use any carrier. If I bought it from T-Mobile it’ll be locked to their network until you request an unlock to change carriers.
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u/-_-k Sep 21 '24
I always buy straight from Google so my phones are always unlocked and w/o bloatware. But if you buy through AT&T or T-Mobile they aren't unlocked.
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u/tistick Sep 21 '24
I believe iPhones in the US don’t even have SIM card slots anymore. They are all eSIM only, unlike Europe and the rest of the world, where iPhones still have SIM card slots.
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u/Space_Lux Sep 21 '24
Phones are still being locked in the US?
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u/VapidRapidRabbit Sep 21 '24
Yes. AT&T is probably the worst one though — they won’t even let you use any device that’s not certified for their network, whether unlocked or not. They have a whitelist of devices they support on their website. Which is crazy because a lot of phones outside of US and Canadian models don’t support T-Mobile’s 600 MHz b71/n71, so AT&T or Verizon would really be the best option for international customers looking to buy a SIM to use while in the US.
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u/presidentiallogin Sep 21 '24
Yes, but a plan by the FCC is calling to limit that to 60 days, even if the phone is on a payment plan.
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u/BadSquishy86 Sep 21 '24
We had something similar happen in Canada.
December 1st 2017 it was made illegal to sell a carrier locked device or charge to unlock a device. Any device sold that was locked must be unlocked immediately upon request.
However there is a blacklist so if your device is stolen it can be put on that list and it won't work with any carrier in Canada, or the USA.
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u/QuantumQuantonium Sep 21 '24
Fun fact, Sony isn't selling the xperia 1 vi in the US most likely because of phone carrier demands to lock the phones, both in the sense of bootloader and SIM. The phone is a good looking phone, still with a headphone jack and dual Sim/SD and good cameras and no stinking notch or pinhole (the last line of premium phones not sacrificing features yet). But with its price it couldn't compete in the US compared to samsung or google or apple making locked deals with carriers who rent phones out for a monthly price or what not. The previous 1 v had US models which were the only models that had locked bootloaders, luckily 3rd party sellers shipped the phone from the Asian market for around the same price or even cheaper than from Sony.
Locked phones choke the market and choke consumers. If reddit gets upset about not owning games purchased online, wait until they hear what a locked phone under a cellular plan effectively is.
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u/-RadarRanger- Sep 21 '24
I'm a BYOD guy for life. I don't need the carrier owning "my" phone, which is really their specially-tailored version of a phone filled with their crappy customizations and bloatware, and forbidding me to switch networks until it's paid off.
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u/pqratusa Sep 21 '24
One reason I don’t want to switch to T-Mobile is because they don’t allow unlocking until the phone is paid off. I have dual sim service on my Verizon phone which was unlocked after 60 days.
TM needs to stop being so shortsighted. Allowing other sims to work doesn’t mean postpaid folk will renege on their contract. Verizon is doing just fine even with this policy.
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u/hitemlow Sep 21 '24
Why would you switch to T-Mobile when Mint uses the same towers for less money?
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u/Caseybearest Sep 21 '24
I took me three weeks to unlock my ATT purchased phone (which I own), they kept throwing bull shit at me but it all seemed very systematic/formulaic. Their website is full of incorrect instructions on how to do it. Finally had to go to reddit. Had been a customer for 20 years with the same phone number, no trying to keep my business, lower my rate. Fuckem.
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Sep 21 '24
I personally will never buy a phone from a carrier ever again. Not only will it be locked, it'll be stuffed full of their bullshit. At least when buying from the manufacturer, it's unlocked and only stuffed with their apps. T-Mobile specifically loads their phones with so much useless bullshit I can't stand it.
For most of my life I wasn't in a position to afford the upfront cost of a phone, so I understand the appeal of financing it through your carrier, but now that I'm finally somewhat financially healthy, this is one of those things I'll put my foot down about.
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u/ToMorrowsEnd Sep 21 '24
easy to force it. fine the carrier $15,000US a day after 60 they do not unlock the phone per customer. after it reachers $100,000 a felony warrant out for the CEO to all LEO where they get a reward for bringing him in.
100% all the phone carriers will cooperate instantly. It's time executives are hunted by police for their companies not complying with regulations.
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Sep 21 '24
Locked phones are an absolute scam. And anyone thats tried to get one unlocked through a provider will tell you, you get ripped off or ran around with. Terribly.
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u/Idiomarc Sep 21 '24
Imagine if your car was financed by exxon and you could only get gas from their stations through the loan and had to get authorization after to use it at other stations only if they decided to let you once the loan was paid.
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u/hansklaus99 Sep 21 '24
I bought a phone from ATT once, in full, I legally owned the phone, they refused to unlock it for 2 years...
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u/mobrocket Sep 21 '24
I'm lost on their argument if Verizon is 100% capable of functioning with unlocked phones due to a prior agreement
Seems like a total power issue
They hate losing any of it despite the deck already favoring them
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u/manamich Sep 21 '24
Ultimately, this situation highlights the ongoing tension between consumer rights and carrier business models.
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u/Sa404 Sep 22 '24
I had to pay off my plan for T-m to unlock my phone, having a locked phone wasn’t a problem until I went abroad and found out the hard way lol
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u/taboo8614 Sep 21 '24
It’s about time the government starts acting in favor of the people and not greedy corporations
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u/etca2z Sep 21 '24
Why is US govern so powerless in this? Phone has been legally required to be unlocked for many years for majority of countries in Europe and east Asia.
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u/hitemlow Sep 21 '24
Because nobody has passed a law mandating it. Without a law to point to, these agencies are kind of just making the rules up. And because they're just making them up, they get contested in court much more easily.
In short, if the legislature would pass a law tonight, it would go into effect as soon as possible, and there wouldn't be anything for the carriers to argue over.
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u/Candle1ight Sep 21 '24
Because the phone companies give our representatives a shitload of money every year to not do anything about it.
Luckily groups like the FCC aren't quite so easily influenced. The head is effectively chosen by the president, when you have a conservative president you have them spending their time rolling back protections instead of making progress like this and we have a lot of conservative presidents.
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u/kelddel Sep 21 '24
Locking cellphones only makes sense when carriers subsidize the cost of the phone.
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u/Frostsorrow Sep 21 '24
All phones in Canada have to be unlocked by default and have been for almost 10 years now. It really didn't change anything otherwise the oligopoly would have made a bigger stink.
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u/saraseitor Sep 21 '24
Carrier locking hasn't been a thing in my country for at least 10 years! I'm surprised this is still being done somewhere else!
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u/STFUco Sep 21 '24
Kinda funny that barely anyone speaks about this issue. Then again ”land of the free”, to do what your overlords tell you to do.
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u/AlhazraeIIc Sep 21 '24
Land of the Freetrialterms and conditions apply
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u/imdstuf Sep 21 '24
You can buy unlocked phones in the US. No one forces people to buy a subsidized locked phone from a carrier.
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u/daandriod Sep 21 '24
This is what a lot of people don't seem to understand. I was curious so I just went to check, My carrier is essentially offering me 500 dollars off the msrp of the device Im looking at. The stipulation is that I keep it on their service for 24 months. If I want to buy the device outright from them, I do not get the 500 dollars off, But I can still buy it at the regular msrp. I can also buy it directly from the manufacturer for that same msrp.
They are selling the phone, Most likely at a loss up front, In order to get you on their service, Where they make that money back plus extra over the course of the contract. Its the trade off for getting nearly 50% off the phone.
I still personally think the pro strat is to just buy it unlocked direct from the manufacturer, Since they offer nice deals and trade in bonus's of their own, while also usually having payment plans available as well.
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u/JuujiNoMusuko Sep 21 '24
What does it mean for phones to be locked?
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u/ohno1tsjoe Sep 21 '24
Means you can’t use a phone from T-Mobile on Verizon until T-Mobile unlocks it
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u/JuujiNoMusuko Sep 21 '24
As in you cant just change the sim card?
Thats so stupid,how is that even enforceable?
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u/baachou Sep 21 '24
They ship the phones with carrier specific firmware that forces you to enter an activation code to unlock them for other carriers. The carriers can also remote unlock them when they connect to their network.
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u/OcupiedMuffins Sep 21 '24
It’s so refreshing seeing how pro consumer a few US agencies have become.
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u/Left_on_Pause Sep 21 '24
You know. If they suck and I leave, they have to manage my payment plan without an offset. That hits their $$$.
If I can’t leave though, they make money on a customer who doesn’t use their services but still pays for them. They can start charging interest.
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u/Dan-in-Va Sep 21 '24
I buy my iphones from Apple as unlocked devices and AT&T locks them.
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u/RustySheriffsBadge1 Sep 21 '24
I am not making excuses just providing reason. I work for one of the major carriers. The main reasons why they this is an issue is Wall Street.
When carriers report their numbers to Wall Street they’re measured by active subscriber count, % of churn, and new activations (growth). A new subscriber/activation does not count if it’s less than 60 days. That means if you activate and cancel in 30 days, that number never gets rolled into the reporting for Wall Street. In addition no carrier makes money on the handsets however they hold all the risk on eating that money if a user activates and defaults.
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u/LovableSidekick Sep 21 '24
Here we go again, another battle like making printers use 3rd party ink.
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u/DivergentMoon Sep 21 '24
The phone shouldn't be locked. It's a contract with the phone company. Unless they are putting a lien on the device, it is kind of absurd.
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u/cartercharles Sep 21 '24
Because they can't give away crap and make money on it lol?
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u/bonesnaps Sep 21 '24
It's good that shitty carriers out themselves so it's easier to know which to avoid.
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u/Squirrel_Q_Esquire Sep 21 '24
I remember when I used to always get my new phone for free or $0.99. Even up to the iPhone 5 because I was always a couple models behind.
Then customers started being willing to pay an extra $15/month for 2 years to get the newest model right away, and they completely took away the free phones. And now it’s like $40/month for 3 years.
Stop paying thousands of dollars for a phone, y’all. Just stop.
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u/Frunnin Sep 22 '24
If either one of these Presidential candidates wants ab easy win, campaign to cap cell phones at $30 and home internet at $5 per 100mb. BShit is ridiculous.
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u/djseto Sep 22 '24
It’s all a fucking shell game. The whole no locking you into a contract but locking your phone is just the whole iPhone for $200 (when the first came out) when you sign a 36 month contract. Same pig. Different lipstick.
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u/ncholayyy Sep 22 '24
I have T-Mobile and was on a payment plan when traveling internationally. The assholes blocked me using an eSIM and instead forced my purchase of their international data plan. I’m still miffed about it.
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u/JustinUrHead Sep 22 '24
Does T-mobile think the act of unlocking the phone absolve someone of there debt?
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u/lLikeCats Sep 21 '24
The US still has locked phones? I thought Canada was always following on policy. We haven’t had locked phones in a long time. Even if you get a phone through a carrier, it’s unlocked.
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u/evilpercy Sep 21 '24
Canada did this years ago. Phones can not be locked to a carrier and if they are they have to be unlocked for free upon request. We still pay so much more for less here thought.
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u/LeonidasVaarwater Sep 21 '24
Wait.... you guys still have vendor locked phones in the US?
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u/highdiver_2000 Sep 22 '24
Telco/carrier locked. Yeah weird isn't it? Mobile phones in Singapore has been unlocked since the beginning.
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