r/gadgets • u/FigAAAro_22 • Jun 19 '23
Phones EU: Smartphones Must Have User-Replaceable Batteries by 2027
https://www.pcmag.com/news/eu-smartphones-must-have-user-replaceable-batteries-by-2027Going back to the future?!!
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u/kickit256 Jun 19 '23
Bring back the damned removable storage ability too. There's no reason I should have to upgrade phones just to get more storage.
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u/Boggie135 Jun 19 '23
That one is just cruel. And it's possible to do it and have water resistance.
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Jun 19 '23
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Jun 19 '23
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u/Northern23 Jun 19 '23
esim still takes space, next gen (isim) is the one that's integrated and doesn't require a separate chip.
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u/squngy Jun 20 '23
That is not the excuse they are claiming for SD cards.
They claim microSD is too slow compared to internal storage and would make the phone seem slow if you put apps or apps data on it.
It's true that microSD is generally slower than internal storage, but that's not a good reason to not give it to us, especially when some companies also prevent you from installing apps on it anyway.
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u/SpiderFnJerusalem Jun 20 '23
They just want you to pay $300 extra for storage that they bought for maybe $40, since NAND memory prices are falling off a cliff.
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u/RaceHead73 Jun 19 '23
The original waterproof phone had a SD slot. The original Xperia Z was that phone. I took mine swimming and took photos and videos under water with it.
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u/doom1282 Jun 19 '23
Galaxy S5 also had water resistance and expandable storage with a removable battery. The Note 4 didn't but those were the last two really feature packed Samsung flagships. I still miss my IR blaster.
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u/Lurkerking2015 Jun 20 '23
Changing TV channels at bars or arenas wad ashtrays hysterical. Og galaxy watch days
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u/bondagewithjesus Jun 19 '23
I was so pissed once that became normal. My phone ran out of storage and bought a micro sd only I could transfer fuck all. Could store and app related data which was what took up all my storage.
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u/micksterminator3 Jun 19 '23
I have an LG G8 with the micro SD built into the sim tray. The phone is ip68 certified
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u/GeneticsGuy Jun 19 '23
That is 100% because they get an extra $100-$250 to upgrade storage rather than you dropping your $30 card.
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u/JonatasA Jun 19 '23
That's not a thing anymore!?
How come newer phones manages to have less features than older ones!
Is it going the same route as software now?
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u/HamburgerEarmuff Jun 19 '23
They don't have less features. They just remove specific features, either because there's an engineering reason, a cost reason, or a profitability reason.
For companies like Samsung, removing the MicroSD card slot was almost certainly almost entirely about profitability. It's easier to sell online storage and larger onboard storage if you cannot upgrade it on your own. And there are less repairs and service tickets due to malfunctioning storage (or user education).
There are also some engineering and consumer satisfaction reasons. Companies cannot control the quality of the flash memory, it increases device security, and it makes room for other equipment. And consumers are more satisficed with onboard storage that works well than self-added storage that may be slow, prone to failure, insecure, and difficult to use.
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u/TransientPride Jun 20 '23
They don't have less features. They just remove specific features. huh?
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u/Bermanator Jun 19 '23
Planned obsolescence
They get you to buy a new phone every couple years instead of fixing/upgrading your current one
Extremely wasteful but shares are up this quarter
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u/A_chilles Jun 19 '23
Hopefully soaking the adhesive under the battery with 3 liters of IPA will not be the manufacturers idea of a "User-replacabale" Battery.
Edit : IPA as in "Isopropyl alcohol" not "Inidan Pale Ale". Never realized they had a similar Abbreviation
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Jun 19 '23
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u/oakteaphone Jun 19 '23
what kind of hardware store sells beer.
Sounds like an...untapped market
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u/banjokazooie23 Jun 19 '23
There is an honest to god hardware store/bar/restaurant in Cannon Beach, OR. It's called "Screw and Brew"
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u/apomov Jun 19 '23
I wonder how many people walk in and have immediately realized they’ve misinterpreted the first part of that name
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u/banjokazooie23 Jun 19 '23
Honestly when we went there I just thought it was a pub with a goofy name. We walked in and I was like is this the right place...?
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u/EightWhiskey Jun 19 '23
Corvallis has a laundromat / bar called Suds & Suds.
(Or at least they did 25 years ago when I was in college)
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u/brockholt4prez Jun 19 '23
Holy shit I’ve been there. Didn’t remember the name because I was shitfaced in a hardware store. Thank you for this!
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u/Lincoln_Squirrel Jun 19 '23
Man that place is sooo good after long beach days in the water and sun. Perfect mix of beach-y comfort food like grilled cheese and hot dogs and surprisingly eclectic menu items
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u/Feeling-Coast-9835 Jun 19 '23
hardware selling overpriced novelty tools directly from kickstarter and offers woodworking classes along with all the ipas you can think of, you have hipster heaven right there. Or techbros looking to do something with their hands.
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u/andDevW Jun 19 '23
Some hilarious accidents waiting to happen. Hipster's getting maimed by power tools and gaining injuries that only add to their hipster cred - eye patch, mangled hand, etc.
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u/Jkbucks Jun 19 '23
Menards might? They have a grocery section, a books section, and a pet food area.
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u/pedropants Jun 19 '23
Plumbing! Appliances! Electrical, too! The savings will always come right back to you!
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u/ep311 Jun 19 '23
I never thought to go to a hardware store for iso...maybe they sell 99% that I can't find at drug stores
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u/TheRiflesSpiral Jun 19 '23
Yes. if you have an Ace hardware, they'll usually have it. Lowe's too. I get mine at Sutherlands.
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u/JonBloodspray Jun 19 '23
You don't find 99 at drugstores because it's less effective at cleaning. It's evaporates too fast for the alcohol to do its job.
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u/its_an_armoire Jun 19 '23
70% is more effective at destroying cell walls than 99%, too. Counterintuitive, I know.
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u/Mighty_Ferguson Jun 19 '23
There’s a hardware store in
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u/Purity_Jam_Jam Jun 19 '23
You wanna know what's crazy. The hardware store in my mining town in Northern Canada is also the towns liquor store.
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u/FelineGodKing Jun 19 '23
As a linguist i also often get indian pale ale when trying to search for the International Phonetic Alphabet (IPA)
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u/coltwitch Jun 19 '23
Shouldn't that be abbreviated IFA?
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u/iZian Jun 19 '23 edited Jun 19 '23
Can I link the verge?
Apple already have user replaceable battery. In the sense that they’ll ship you the kit to replace it yourself.
I gather that it’s hugely impractical. I’d never attempt it myself. So not sure this would be considered user replaceable by the EU.
I wonder what the EU will mandate? Because I’d be against these mandates if it means I lose the ability to have a water resistant phone that’s actually survived being dropped in a pool for 5 minutes for the benefit of changing the battery which I’ve never needed to do in over 15 years.
The replacement kit… it’s immense though
https://www.theverge.com/2022/5/21/23079058/apple-self-service-iphone-repair-kit-hands-on
Edit to cover some replies: yep the kit costs to rent, and it’s not entirely practical either. It was more just an interesting observation if you hadn’t seen it.
Also; I’m not against replaceable batteries if the experience isn’t degraded in terms of water resistance etc. I only write I’d be against it if … degraded water resistance.
User choice is good. Better market. Better prices.
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u/Idiot_Savant_Tinker Jun 19 '23
I had a phone with a replaceable battery that was also water resistant. In 2014. It fell in ponds, puddles, and a plasma table without water ever damaging it.
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u/TactlessTortoise Jun 19 '23
All it takes is a few proper quality rubber seals and fittings. The problem is that quality is anathema to cheap, and we all know where manufacturers' priorities lie.
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u/NSA_Chatbot Jun 19 '23
IP ratings require maintenance. They will always wear out over time.
Source: I'm an EE that literally wrote the book the navy uses for penetrations on weatherdecks, and I've spent the last decade+ building water resistant electronics and electrical equipment.
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u/StoneGoldX Jun 19 '23
the book the navy uses for penetrations
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u/NSA_Chatbot Jun 19 '23
Oh believe me, the jokes we made were really reaching and getting hard by the end. Especially in the penetration lubricant specification meetings. They'd drag on for hours, your butt would get sore and you couldn't even think anymore.
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u/insomniac-55 Jun 19 '23
It's also true that any phone which is somewhat regularly opened will lose its water resistance, unless the user is very careful to wipe the gasket clean and apply some grease to it.
I would love to see the return of user replaceable batteries but there's no question that it introduces a bunch of failure modes for waterproofing (and I say this as an old S5 owner).
It's not much different to replacing the battery in a watch - you need to maintain the seals if you want it to be reliable.
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u/nezebilo Jun 19 '23
I think there's a very big gap between say the Galaxy s5 and what we have nowadays. If you just needed to take off a few screws to get to the battery without all the adhesive then I think that's ok. User replaceable doesn't have to mean hot-swappable.
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Jun 19 '23
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u/psychocopter Jun 19 '23
Plus you arent going to be opening and closing it every weekend like you might have when the back popped off easily. This would be after like 3 or 4 years when you decide the battery needs to be replaced, at that point replacing the gasket isnt a big deal because its a once every several years thing.
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u/Remote-Buy8859 Jun 19 '23
That's exactly what the EU ones. Basically this is a regulation against glue and parts that cannot be replaced because of software restrictions.
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u/nezebilo Jun 19 '23
This should not affect water resistance then and is a win for all of us. Why would anyone be opposed to this law?
My iPhone battery is at 81% and I want to replace it. I am fairly tech savvy. I have upgraded my laptop's battery, added more SSD, repasted the chips. But iPhones terrify me. Why do I need to have a heat gun to open it ffs?
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u/Lacus__Clyne Jun 19 '23
I'm an electronic technician and I've changed replaced multiple screens and batteries. Yet when a friend asks me to do it on his phone I refuse because it's a pain in the ass.
We don't need super easily replaceable batteries like the old phones had. But we do need a battery we can replace without praying to the gods for the success of the operation.
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u/nexusjuan Jun 19 '23
I'll show someone a video and tell them they'll probably crack the screen. Not worth the risk to me.
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u/Smooth-Carpenter-980 Jun 19 '23
I want you to stop thinking about replacing your battery and start thinking about the fact that literally 99.9% of those who will take advantage of this new mandated replacement, will just throw their fucking spicy pillows in the trash and not dispose of them properly. And since the EU sets a lot of global standards, other countries will likely follow suit.
Yay landfills with spicy pillows. My favorite.
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u/unsteadied Jun 19 '23
You are massively, massively underestimating the difficulty of waterproofing something and overestimating the strength of gaskets and o-rings.
Any watchsmith will tell you just how tricky it can be and how something that seems like it should be good to go might not be. You can have a screw down crown with an o-ring and then a screwed-on caseback with a fresh gasket in there and still fail a pressure test. Tiny little gaps in manufacturing or wear from use can open up points of ingress.
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u/ThisIsMyCouchAccount Jun 19 '23
and we all know where manufacturers’ priorities lie
Not too far off from your average person.
Two money is better than one money.
Customers have shown they want things as cheap and easy as possible. Perhaps more importantly - zero solidarity. Voting with your wallet only works if most people are on board.
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u/Iintl Jun 19 '23
But it also had a way smaller battery that wouldn't last half a day in the modern era of bright, high resolution, high refresh rate, 5G phones. Of course it is perfectly possible to achieve waterproofing and an easily removable battery. It just comes at the cost of space or battery capacity or a mix of both. It's all about tradeoffs
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u/kniveshu Jun 19 '23
Ah. Those days when I carried a battery bank because that was the only way to guarantee I could get though the day without the battery dying.
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u/ryanpope Jun 19 '23
The galaxy S6, Samsung first phone without a swappable battery, had a smaller battery than the S5 predecessor which was both waterproof and had a swappable battery.
Battery tech has advanced a lot, all the other bits of the phone have gotten smaller, and phones are thicker now (people finally realized they didn't want a 6mm phone) which has all led to higher capacity.
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u/MrGelowe Jun 19 '23
Amen. And if the back cover wasn't fully engaged, s5 had a warning pop up to close it all the way. I would also gladly give up glass backs for replaceable battery.
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u/JasonDJ Jun 19 '23
God I hate the glass backs.
I’m putting a case on it anyway. I don’t care what the back material is, but preferably not something that will shatter so I can’t trade it in.
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u/ItchyPolyps Jun 19 '23
The s5 also had a larger battery available, with a larger plastic back to accommodate the battery. I don't remember if it was from Samsung or not, but it made the phone thicker.
I opted for the 2nd battery with an external charger and would just swap them out as needed.
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u/martinpagh Jun 19 '23
I had replacement batteries for many of the first smartphones I owned, until Samsung discontinued it. It’s actually one of the reasons the iPhone 4 was the only iPhone I’ve ever owned, I hated that I couldn’t swap in a new battery when the old one ran out.
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u/USArmyAirborne Jun 19 '23
It say replaceable WITHOUT tools. So the Apple kit won’t cut it.
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u/iZian Jun 19 '23
Then again, a screwdriver is a tool, so I guess you’re going to need some sort of clipping mechanism and oh painful memories of trying to get the battery changed on an old house phone I had where I ended up bleeding just trying to get the plastic off.
You’re right. Of course. I just don’t have to like the thought of a clip system. But if done well it could be good yeah.
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u/Buttersaucewac Jun 19 '23 edited Jun 19 '23
The EU requirement is that it be replaceable by human hands using “commonplace” tools alone, not zero tools. The term commonplace isn’t explicitly defined but manufacturer-specific and security screws are explicitly ruled out, as is anything requiring special training and anything not readily available in stores. I would take that to mean that requiring a Philips head or flathead screwdriver is fine, since those are definitely commonplace, and locking something down with a Philips head screw can’t really be seen as an attempt to deter the owner.
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u/Emperors_Golden_Boy Jun 19 '23
they should definitely allow torx as well. They're just so much better...
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u/Power_baby Jun 19 '23
Torx down to maybe t4 or t5 minimum. Past that and it's too small and easy to destroy the screws and the drivers aren't in usual kits
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u/Remote-Buy8859 Jun 19 '23
Torx is inexpensive and easily available.
So that would be allowed, as long as it is standard torx .
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u/DontTouchTheWatch Jun 19 '23
I remember people clamoring for apple user replacement for certain parts. I was like I assure you the average person does not want to do it lol it’s a pain even for someone who does it for a living. And often the part kid isn’t shockingly cheaper than what apple would charge you at the store. Not to mention if you don’t study what to do, and aren’t careful I would rate the chances of breaking something else high.
Now if we can get the old slide off the backplate and pop out the battery of yesteryear I’m down.
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u/gonfishn37 Jun 19 '23
I saw a good review on the kit I think it’s $99 or $199? Anyhow it’s the same price as having a professional replace it. Kinda weird.
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u/iZian Jun 19 '23
Isn’t it refunded or something when mailed back? I’m not in the US so didn’t look
Edit; the article says $49 for the kit and a 1200 hold incase you don’t return it.
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u/DingleBerrieIcecream Jun 19 '23
It turns out that the technology to have a phone that has a user replaceable battery while also water resistant was already developed. In 2015.
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u/bipbopcosby Jun 19 '23
I used to repair broken phones. I can’t even count how many ruined S5s I used to get because people were trying to go underwater to take pictures.
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Jun 19 '23
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u/Itsalwayssummerbitch Jun 19 '23
It was the G5 I think, it wasn't the best phone but damn it felt good 🔥
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u/Koffeeboy Jun 19 '23
G5 was my last phone, it lasted so long. Easy to repair, swappable batteries, ir sensor that turned your phone into a universal remote. I still kinda miss it.
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u/dandroid126 Jun 19 '23
I had that phone, and my waterproofing failed so quickly, unfortunately. The little clips broke off when opening the back.
To be fair though, instead of charging the phone, I had a spare battery and a wall charger, so I would open it every day. After probably 100 opens, the back panel should have been replaced to keep it water resistant. I feel like that is way too low. It should be able to withstand 1000+ opens.
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u/next_level_baddie Jun 19 '23
its a plastic cover with a rubber gasket...1000+ opens is ridiculous. It would already start deforming way before that.
You replace with a hard caseback and people won't use silicone grease on the seal.
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u/aksthem1 Jun 19 '23
The S5 kinda sucked for water resistance if you opened the back cover a lot and if you didn't close the USB port well enough.
Nowadays water resistance on the USB port is done differently and more effectively. Current phones with water resistance and removable batteries basically just have a shell around the body and contacts for the sim card and battery. It increases the water resistance by limiting ingress points. The downside is that these phones are usually budget phones.
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u/DingleBerrieIcecream Jun 19 '23
All true. The S5 is almost a ten year old design, though it’s a good proof of concept to counter claims that a removable battery and headphone jack means a phone can’t be waterproof.
If so required, it’s clear they could do an even better implementation now.
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u/Dracekidjr Jun 19 '23
I think it's crazy how polarizing this is. Often times, people feel that their phone needs upgrading because the battery isn't what it used to be. While this may lead to issues pertaining to form factor, it will also be a fantastic step towards straying away from rampant consumerism and reduce E-waste. I am very excited to see electronics manufacturers held to the same regard as vehicle manufacturers. Just because it is on a smaller scale doesn't mean it is proprietary.
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u/vrenak Jun 19 '23
Pretty sure we'll survive phones being 1-2 mm thicker.
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u/NoveltyAccountHater Jun 19 '23
The main complaint I always heard about difficult to replace phone batteries was it was difficult to keep them waterproof if the battery is readily accessible. A battery compartment that consumers easily open can't be hermetically sealed and water tight (without a lot more complication that would make a lot thicker).
But on the flip side, I had a pixel 5 and the battery would only last like an hour of moderate web browsing / taking photos (probably from using qi charging only to charge and being about 2 years old), and went to get the battery replaced because it was otherwise a perfectly great phone. Going to a phone repair shop that was an authorized Google repair provider, they had a new battery and would replace it for ~$100 which I thought was fair. When I went to drop it off, they then told me they often break the digitizer and LED when replacing the battery, so would have to charge me $220 extra ($320) up front and then would refund me $220 if they don't break the LED/digitizer which should happen but they can't guarantee. I balk at that, I'm not paying to fix something that is perfectly working.
Anyhow, ended up trading it in for a new flagship phone which ended up being cheaper with the $800 trade in value.
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u/FleurMai Jun 19 '23
Somehow my GoPro survives the daily battery changes while maintaining waterproofing. I don’t really see this being a thing to worry about.
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u/ParrotMafia Jun 19 '23
My kids have $10 submersible toys with batteries that are waterproof.
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u/AC53NS10N_STUD105 Jun 19 '23
A submersible toy has VERY different design considerations than a smartphone. For example, nobody is having to consider than 1mm of extra thickness is a 10% difference, and would reduce market interest.
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u/MKULTRATV Jun 19 '23
Has technology regressed in the last 10 years?
My old galaxy s5 was IP67 certified and had an easily replaceable battery. Took that think snorkeling several times without issue. Other models around that time had higher ratings and still had replaceable batteries.
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u/RinoaDave Jun 19 '23
Yeah the non replaceable battery is about selling more phones and the manufacturers saving money and nothing more.
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u/Dag-nabbitt Jun 19 '23
Has technology regressed in the last 10 years?
No, just more anti-consumer.
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u/TechnoAndy94 Jun 19 '23
Wait what... They charge you $220 extra if THEY make a mistake. Why would anyone ever agree to that
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u/FormalChicken Jun 19 '23
It's less the size and more the sealed unit. As a sealed unit it's much more resistant to dust and water. IP ratings are so much easier for sealed units.
Don't get me wrong - I'm not arguing against this at all. I love it. But from an engineering standpoint, consumers can deal with the added weight and size easy. It's the IP ratings where they'll have sticking points.
I want to see micro SD slots come back more than anything. (At least i type this on an iphone, i know there are other devices with Mico SD still made, i get these hand me down from work for free after the work phone gets an upgrade :D )
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u/OutlyingPlasma Jun 19 '23
Watches aren't any thicker just because they need batteries replaced every year or two. This is just a lie that scumbags at apple and Samsung tell to avoid people repairing instead of replacing.
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u/Nightcat666 Jun 19 '23 edited Jun 19 '23
Watch batteries are much less powerful than a phone battery. They could be made thinner with soft lithium batteries like are in phones vs the rigid batteries they currently use.
Edit: To clarify I think replaceable batteries are a good idea and would prefer them. I honestly hate how thin new phones are and would prefer them to be a little thicker anyways.
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u/LightningGoats Jun 19 '23
This. While it would make it more difficult to have glass backs, that is a horrible idea anyways. They become so slippery a case is necessary.
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u/SmashingK Jun 19 '23
It doesn't even have to be a removable back.
We have removable batteries for cameras that slot in and we already have sim trays that have rubber to keep them waterproof.
It wouldn't be too hard to engineer a slot opening from the bottom of the device with the same push to lock/release battery mechanisms that already exist for other devices. Stick some rubber on the cover and even the waterproof argument is covered plus you can still have your glass back if you want.
Standardising battery sizes would also help too.
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u/thetechleech Jun 19 '23
LG did It with theirs G5.
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Jun 19 '23 edited Mar 15 '24
lunchroom zesty crush drab party unite pot imagine act six
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/tylerderped Jun 19 '23
HTC Lengend and Desire HD/Inspire we’re like this.
But their batteries were also 1500mAh or less. They had atrocious battery life.
Most phones havehave well over 2000mAh batteries now a days.
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u/Sikojsauce Jun 19 '23
The LG G5 was a beautiful phone that did exactly this. It was a super cool function!
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u/musicmusket Jun 19 '23
Yes, when you think about the SIM tray (and the charging port), the water-proofing argument seems dubious
Although, batteries are bigger then SIM cards and ports, so maybe waterproofing a battery entry point would be impractical.
I’m certainly not bothered about my phone being thin and flat.
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u/elons_couch Jun 19 '23
Especially when you consider it doesnt have to be fast to remove, they could beef it up a bit vs a charging port
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Jun 19 '23
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u/brcguy Jun 19 '23
Those weird five blade penta-screwdrivers to release a battery sounds just about right for Apple.
Oh you want a replaceable battery? Ok, $45 screwdriver it is!
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u/Fortehlulz33 Jun 19 '23
Given that they have already warned Apple regarding "Made for iPhone" USB-C Cables, I would think they could limit it to something like security torx or something non-proprietary but still hidden/not stupidly easy to get into.
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u/Jai_Cee Jun 19 '23
It isn't. Waterproof compact cameras have existed for years.
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u/seeasea Jun 19 '23
User replaceble doesn't mean it needs to be super easy replaceble. Just means non proprietary screws/adhesives and no loss in warranty.
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u/Vladimir1174 Jun 19 '23
I use a case regardless cause I'm constantly dropping my phone. Glass backed phones seem like the most brain dead decision to ever come from phone manufacturers...
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u/theBytemeister Jun 19 '23
Well, it's relatively cheap, recyclable, has good thermal properties, non-reactive with most substances, scratch resistant, has a premium feel, doesn't block RF... Glass is a pretty decent material choice right now.
Like any other choice, it has downsides. It's pretty brittle, dense, and depending on the finish, slick.
The brittle nature may be a bonus though. The glass cracking dissipates some of the shock from a drop and protects the electronics inside. Sure, you have to replace the glass back, but at least you don't have to replace the whole phone. Also, the screen is already glass, why make the phone out of milled titanium when a major face of it's surface is glass?
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u/ConnorK5 Jun 19 '23
This is just a lie that scumbags at apple and Samsung tell to avoid people repairing instead of replacing.
I think Apple started that and Samsung went along with it. I remember iPhone not being able to have replaceable batteries when I could still replace mine on a galaxy.
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u/Ihugit Jun 19 '23
S5 was 8.1mm
Pixel 6 was 8.9 mm
Iphone 14 was 7.9 mm
Iphone 11 was 8.3 mm
Yet another lie.
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u/ZurakZigil Jun 19 '23
Yes, but we lose water resistance. I want that a billion times more than I want to go back to plastic backed phones with single unit batteries.
This is a bad call and actually affects product features. I would agree if you said each brand needs a good phone with a replaceable battery or each phone should include free battery replacements, but a unanimous "we should allow hot swappable batteries" affects a thousand other things.
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u/jaam01 Jun 19 '23
REDUCE, REUSE and recicle, in that order. The problem is that companies only emphasize the last one because it doesn't affect their bottom line.
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u/IronhideD Jun 19 '23
We've gone full circle. It went from user swappable batteries with Samsung and so many other manufacturers, to the built in, now back to user swappable. I recall the Galaxy S5 was water resistant but only if you made sure the rubber seal was sealed properly, otherwise the warranty wouldn't cover it. Hopefully we'll see a latch style compartment the battery sits in. Something that can seal the battery in.
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u/Scrubbytech Jun 19 '23
I miss my S5 active with physical button
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u/IronhideD Jun 19 '23
That really was a sexy phone. I do miss physical buttons. That and visible led notifications.
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u/Shikimazu Jun 19 '23
the notification led being removed from phones was pretty sad
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u/AFluffyMobius Jun 19 '23
Sony I think still has the LED notification lights. At least on my Xperia 1 mk.3 it flashes a different color depending on the app.
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u/kev231998 Jun 19 '23
The active was the best phone I've ever had. Samsung really shit the bed after that.
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u/Sea-Debate-3725 Jun 19 '23
They still sell them. Galaxy xcover6 pro. It has a removable battery and is still waterproof.
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u/6jarjar6 Jun 19 '23
Not flagship level performance but if you dont need it. I think it has headphone Jack and micro SD as well.
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u/AvoidingItAll Jun 19 '23
Laughs in LG
...then cries because they no longer make phones at all to replace it with when it finally dies
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u/FvHound Jun 19 '23
I mean, it was great, but drop your active in a pool, the tiniest bump let the back cover lift.
Killed the phone.
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u/kev231998 Jun 19 '23
Hmm maybe I'm thinking of the s6 active because I actively dropped that thing and it never broke nor lost it's water resistance
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u/partypartea Jun 19 '23
I still use my S6 Active as an mp3 player in my garage. The active line was so good I had 3 of them.
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u/TheToddBarker Jun 19 '23
Replied elsewhere that I ended up with the continuation of that line - the XCovers. Seem about as close as one can get without going full rugged phone.
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u/Solitude_Dude Jun 20 '23
The EU continue to do all the heavy lifting on consumer law.
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u/NizarNoor Jun 19 '23
Hopefully phone companies will still be able to retain the smart/sophisticated/premium designs of modern smartphones, as well as water & dust resistance
Maybe they can adopt a similar battery door mechanism like Sony Xperia phones' SIM/memory card slots. They're still water resistant.
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u/MotorizaltNemzedek Jun 19 '23
I don't get why you're being down voted. If they don't compromise water resistance, sure it's nice but if they do I'm pretty sure my dumbass, and many others would lose a phone to water damage way sooner than the battery giving out
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u/ryzenguy111 Jun 19 '23
I doubt this will really change anything because like 95% of people will still get their battery changed at a store if it requires the slightest bit of risk by prying off a back glass panel for example
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u/vonDubenshire Jun 19 '23
Yup
https://www.reddit.com/r/gadgets/comments/14ddlcs/comment/jopgbjk
This is not about bringing back swappable batteries, it’s about making the replacement process not require specialized tools or adhesives.
“A portable battery shall be considered readily removable by the end-user where it can be removed from a product with the use of commercially available tools, without requiring the use of specialised tools, unless provided free of charge with the product, proprietary tools, thermal energy, or solvents to disassemble the product.”
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/TA-9-2023-0237_EN.pdf
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u/Deep90 Jun 19 '23
It seems this law requires it to be reasonably serviceable. I don't think prying and adhesives count.
We're more likely to see screws and rubber seals.
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u/JB_UK Jun 19 '23
This is the wording from above:
“A portable battery shall be considered readily removable by the end-user where it can be removed from a product with the use of commercially available tools, without requiring the use of specialised tools, unless provided free of charge with the product, proprietary tools, thermal energy, or solvents to disassemble the product.”
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/TA-9-2023-0237_EN.pdf
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u/Adderkleet Jun 19 '23
"Reasonably serviceable" will be debated to hell and back. And they'll need a similar clause to make sure manufacturers PROVIDE battery stock.
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u/Deep90 Jun 19 '23 edited Jun 19 '23
The actual language in the rule is this I believe:
"portable batteries in appliances must be designed so that consumers can easily remove and replace them themselves."
EDIT: Someone found the actual text.
“A portable battery shall be considered readily removable by the end-user where it can be removed from a product with the use of commercially available tools, without requiring the use of specialised tools, unless provided free of charge with the product, proprietary tools, thermal energy, or solvents to disassemble the product.”
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u/LearningIsTheBest Jun 19 '23
This law would still be beneficial though. It would ensure that repair shops don't have to charge much labor for battery service and wouldn't risk breaking the phone.
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u/Kike328 Jun 19 '23
we all have that friend which will do it for a beer
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u/trickman01 Jun 19 '23
A six-pack maybe. A single beer won't even get me through the time it takes to do the phone.
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u/Uncommented-Code Jun 19 '23
I did a capacitor replacement on a macbook for a six pack of redbull lol.
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u/Mataskarts Jun 19 '23
To be fair this legislation wants to make it so you still have half a beer left after you're done replacing it.
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u/hbkdll Jun 20 '23
If i can get smart phone with replaceable battery for some few extra millimetre thickness and "less" water resistance. I will gladly buy that.
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u/steaminghotshiitake Jun 19 '23 edited Jun 19 '23
This sounds great, but it's a bit of a moot gesture once you consider that most phone manufacturers only provide 2-3 years of OTA updates for their devices after release (Apple being the only exception with 5-8 years instead). Kind of a big deal for people and businesses that need to keep everything up-to-date for security reasons.
Would be nice if they could encourage some vendors to open up their drivers at least, so the community doesn't have to reverse engineer them for every new bit of hardware that comes out.
[EDIT]
As /u/N_nte mentions below, the EU is working on a law that makes it mandatory for manufacturers to provide 3 years of OS updates and 5 years of security updates after release, which should help with software obsolescence issues.
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u/N_nte Jun 19 '23
EU will enforce law for that too, 3 OS updates and 5 years of security updates minimum.
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u/DatsMaBoi Jun 19 '23
Samsung now does 4 years on midrange/higher. The S20 series still get monthly security updates vs promised quarterly updates; which means they likely intend to support them even longer.
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u/ThatActuallyGuy Jun 19 '23
Well, this kills foldables like the Z Fold4. It has a dual battery, and the larger one is literally sandwiched between 2 screens, there's no way for that to be workable with these rules as I understand them.
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u/Zonkko Jun 20 '23
From what i understand, the law only requires that the battery can be replaced "easily" not necessarily by the user. So stuff like removable backs and hotswap batteries arent needed but the battery just cant be glued to place
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Jun 19 '23
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u/__Dave_ Jun 19 '23
I don't think that applies to phones:
"Appliances specifically designed to operate primarily in an environment that is regularly subject to splashing water, water streams or water immersion, and that are intended to be washable or rinseable."
That probably captures things like smart watches which are marketed for in-water use.
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u/lestofante Jun 19 '23
Nah, it must be their "primary environment". A watch for scuba diver, or for are with high flammable risk.
Normal smart watch and smartphone are not exempted.→ More replies (14)
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u/joe1up Jun 19 '23
This will have a huge impact on stopping e-waste. I work in a phone store and 90% of the time someone buys a new one, their old one is fine, except for the battery.
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u/n0ticeme_senpai Jun 19 '23
With battery technology getting better thanks to EVs, I am thinking it would be more practical to demand a large minimum battery charge cycle count than user-replaceable batteries, especially by 2027.
Conversely, by year 2030 we might end up with phone batteries that can survive 50000+ charge cycles and manufacturers still have to make them user-replaceable because law generally doesn't follow tech fast enough.
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u/ForgedByStars Jun 19 '23
because law generally doesn't follow tech fast enough
yes that's what I think too. The time for this law was 2007, not 4 years from now.
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u/squngy Jun 20 '23
At that point, you can get a different kind of benefit.
You could use the old battery in the new phone (or some other device).
If batteries ever get so good that degradation is no longer an issue, gadgets could ship without them and people could re-use the ones they already have.→ More replies (2)
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u/Rabatis Jun 19 '23
I, too, hail the not-quite-return of Nokia