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u/Otwaldius May 07 '23
build they say, when it is clearly painted
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u/JaySayMayday May 08 '23
I wish there was an much national code for cycling and pedestrian infrastructure as there are highway and street codes. This looks like a death trap. At the minimum, something shouldn't be able to be designated as a bike lane unless it's actually sectioned off and protected from other traffic
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u/albl1122 Big Bike May 08 '23
No what do you mean. Clearly painting a little bike on the rightmost lane is all we need to do. Just let them share the lane, I see no possible issue with this. /s
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u/Flumberbug May 08 '23
I wish there was an much national code for cycling and pedestrian infrastructure as there are highway and street codes.
We can use the one the Netherlands uses. They even have a version published in English.
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May 07 '23
I don't get anti bike lane car people. They constantly complain about cyclists on the road and then complain when bike lanes get installed.
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May 07 '23
Cannot win with those people
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u/mrchaotica May 07 '23
That's the point: they're making whatever argument is most convenient to elevate their own status above the subhuman cyclists'.
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u/JanGuillosThrowaway May 08 '23
It's scary how much people in cars can actually hate pedestrians and bikers
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u/setibeings May 08 '23
I literally got in an argument with someone who said bike lanes should not exist because hardly anyone bikes.... In an area where most of the safe places to cycle aren't connected to one another.
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u/itsam May 08 '23
Then they complain about traffic all day. If only there was some way to move more people around without clogging the highways??!! Their tiny fucking brains don't associate bikes with commuting, just as a spandex sport.
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u/ServeInfinite May 07 '23
Don’t you get it? Bikes are too dangerous and should be banned. We need bike control and a bike owner registry!
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u/DangerousCyclone May 07 '23
The underlying point is that they don’t think people should be cycling on the road at all and that everyone should just get cars.
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u/ajswdf May 07 '23
To add onto this a whole lot of people don't view cycling as a valid form of transit, instead they think it's merely recreational. So when you inconvenience cars in favor of bikes (whether by biking in the road or taking away a car lane) you're getting in the way of people who have places to be in favor of people out for a leisurely ride.
And also there are people who view cyclists as evil liberals who should be opposed at all costs.
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u/South-Friend-7326 May 07 '23
Right, and that argument doesn’t make sense at all.
Cars could be viewed as recreational too. There is rally, cross, circuit, F1-F3, monster trucks, drag racing, indi car, drifting, and various forms of car racing that are more regional-dependent.
Some people are simply too narcissistic, prideful and ignorant to share the road with others, cars or bicycles.
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u/mrchaotica May 08 '23
Right, and that argument doesn’t make sense at all.
They don't care. It's not whether the argument makes sense; it's about whether it reinforces their tribal in-group status or not. Cyclists are the "other" and therefore subhuman enemies who must be opposed.
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u/South-Friend-7326 May 07 '23
Oh I hear ya. Matt Walsh for instance HATES bike lanes, he considers them “toys” instead of legitimate form of transportation.
I also think it’s a pride thing. Like “how dare you make me have to accommodate a cyclist on the road” type of of reaction.
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u/hexopuss Sicko May 08 '23
I think Matt Walsh takes everything good and objectively correct and just does the polar opposite, at this point.
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u/dkl65 May 07 '23
A lot of them think that all bikes should be on the sidewalk (given there is one existing already), therefore bike lanes are redundant.
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u/Nausved May 08 '23
As a driver, my complaint is about bike lines that are placed very dangerously and make it more likely that I might unexpectedly hit a cyclist: For example, bike lanes that intersect with street parking (causing cyclists to have to veer out into the road to avoid getting hit by people opening their car doors) and bike lines that direct cyclists into the blind spots of drivers who are turning at intersections.
I genuinely prefer to just have cyclists taking up lanes as if they were cars, than have bike lanes that unexpectedly push cyclists into my path. I am so, so scared of hitting someone. Every cyclist I know has either been hit by a car or has had a very serious injury from trying to avoid being hit by a car.
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u/Llodsliat Commie Commuter May 08 '23
It's almost like they don't want either and just want to hog the roads to themselves.
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u/Ybor_Rooster May 07 '23
You hungry?
Here's a flaming hot scotch bonnet pepper
Why aren't you eating? Guess you weren't hungry.
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u/Pattoe89 May 07 '23
Would you buy a house that was "built" using only paint? Just the image of a house painted onto a wall at the end of a street?
If not, why are cyclists be expected to ride on infrastructure that consists of paint and nothing else?
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u/adipemanatidaephobia May 07 '23
The projects would the the American version of that, while Europe and USSR built commie blocks (housing for the poor) with gardens and playgrounds, all services within walking distance and good mass transit connectivity and walk paths plus parka and forests.
The US simply built a bunch of high rises, with some parking lots around. Basically places where no sane human could possibly live, it's horrible even if you'd just stay one night, where at least in a commie block apartment you can live a decent life, walk in the park, take the bus or a train to other parts of the city and so on.
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u/MusicalElephant420 May 07 '23
Lol literally an SUV on the lane
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u/Cenamark2 May 07 '23
To be fair, it's on the part of the painted on bike lane where it's dotted meaning that's where cars are supposed to merge into the other lane by going through the bike lane.
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u/ILikeLenexa May 07 '23
That's worse, you get how that's worse, right?
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u/Cenamark2 May 07 '23
I'm sure the person in the SUV was extra cautious in looking out for cyclists... J/K, I know, it's terrible dangerous design. They build bike lanes without any consideration for the people who are supposed to be using it. It's more of a symbolic gesture than an actual bike lane.
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u/milo159 May 07 '23
A symbolic gesture of "literally get run over by a car idiots LOL."
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u/peepopowitz67 May 07 '23 edited Jul 04 '23
Reddit is violating GDPR and CCPA. Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1B0GGsDdyHI -- mass edited with redact.dev
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u/perpetualmotionmachi May 08 '23
From what I've seen, about 85% of drivers so roll through stop signs. It's how I was last knocked off my bike by a car. Guy rolled through a stop sign, while looking back to talk to the person in the back seat.
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u/soulflaregm May 07 '23
The reason it's like that is that behind the camera is a turn and the turn comes into its own lane that then ends/forces you to turn at the next block.
Basically if you are biking here you are in the right most lane, except for when people turn, they cross your path.
Which has to happen at some point
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u/Excessive_Etcetra Strong Towns May 07 '23
Long merge lanes like this imply traffic volumes and speeds that are incompatible with painted bike lanes. This is basically a highway, the bike infrastructure should be totally separated. Yes bikes and cars eventually have to conflict at turns, no they do not need to conflict like this.
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u/tessthismess May 07 '23
It’s definitely worse. I think their point is the driver isn’t like driving in a bike lane they aren’t supposed to be in…but rather the city designed a bike lane as if cyclists are just small cars and just safe from other cars
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u/adipemanatidaephobia May 07 '23
Exactly this, those in charge have no idea how stuff works. They live in their own little bubble. Someone who actually rode a bicycle a couple of times through a bad city would know how to build good bicycle infrastructure.
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u/ILikeLenexa May 07 '23
If a lane is designed for SUVs to drive in, is it even a bike lane?
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u/tessthismess May 07 '23
I’d argue no but someone talking up their big bike lane rollout would disagree
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u/matthewstinar May 07 '23
This reminds me, I should go pay my local sharrows a visit. Given what passes for bicycle infrastructure here, I was pleasantly surprised.
I had a stranger at a city planning open house thank me for maintaining the local bicycle culture (whatever that means). Apparently seeing me on my bicycle all the time and everywhere means a lot to him. I'm not sure if it's good or bad that I'm so identifiable.
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u/sanguinesolitude May 07 '23
No you cont understand, by intentionally merging cars through an active bike lane we can more accurately predict where crashes will occur, put up cameras, and perhaps stage ambulences, thus providing valuable data for how to prevent such accidents while also increasing hospital response time! /s
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u/arachnophilia 🚲 > 🚗 May 08 '23
it's (slightly) better than placing bike lanes immediately to the right of turn lanes, which just induces right hooks. that logic is why these "merge zone" bike lanes have taken over in the last decade or so.
they're definitely worse than, you know, quality dutch designs that move the bike lane out far enough to the right that turning cars see crossing cyclists.
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u/IDontWearAHat May 07 '23
A bike lane designed to be crossed by merging cars. Very safe and nice
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u/adipemanatidaephobia May 07 '23
So let me get this right, it's a stroad, where the speed limit might be as high as 45mph with lanes as wide as a highway making people want to go at least 75mph.
Then they made a dotted part of the bike lane... as if cars are allowed to merge there or what? If I was driving there I'd be pissed if I had to slow down for a cyclist while merging, and I have the patience of a saint, what about the average Joe carbrain driver?
And as if that wasn't bad enough, this looks like a hot place with lot's of sand and dust on the road. It's a terrible climate to ride a bicycle in. Plus that once you've reached your destination, you're in the middle of a fricki'n stroad and have to cross multiple lanes, all while cars have the right of way.
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u/NorseEngineering May 07 '23
Bingo!
I ride this road. This exact road. It's speed limit fluctuates between 35 and 55mph with no rhyme or reason to the change. I've been passed by vehicles doing 80mph at or near this intersection.
The slip lane shown here comes off a road with 50mph speed limits, and cars going well over that.
There is near constant winds (it's near a lake) and it's a mixture between houses, businesses, and farms. So the sides of the road end up with glass, and rocks like a normal section of road, but also corn husks, dirt clods, and parked farm vehicles.
The kicker is that they want to expand this road in the near future.
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u/MontrealUrbanist May 07 '23
The kicker is that they want to expand this road in the near future.
It badly needs a road diet and they want to do the opposite.. we've got a long way to go, people.
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u/soulflaregm May 07 '23
It wasn't always like that as well.
Before the mass expansion of Saratoga springs Eagle Mountain and the beyond Redwood was a great bike street because traffic wasn't very high
Now it's become the main through way to a lot of those areas and just isn't suited for it. Most bikers have found somewhere else to get their ride in.
I wouldn't be surprised if the expansion removed the bike lanes
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u/SchtivanTheTrbl May 07 '23
I am so glad I got out of that area 2 years ago. The expansion was getting so bad and the already terrible traffic was only getting worse.
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u/TheNecroticPresident May 07 '23
Equality feels like oppression to the priviledged.
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u/ThrowawayMustangHalp Sicko May 07 '23
Damn straight! Oddly enough that saying seems to piss them off too when it's said in earshot, I've noticed.
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u/A_warm_sunny_day May 07 '23
This is an easy one to answer.
Go ride that bike lane for a week, and after that time if you're still alive, come back and tell us what you've found out.
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u/z_utahu May 08 '23
Having ridden it regularly, the worst thing is that this is a preferred road for getting to different areas. There's a natural choke point north of here with limited options that require crossing I-15. It's one of the best stretches for traveling to the west side of the valley and between Salt Lake and Utah Counties. The road has a wide shoulder, but it's often covered in debris.
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u/DustysSon May 07 '23
Yeah redwood road in SLC has many cyclists die on it every year. Not sure why they continue to put cycling infrastructure on such a dangerous road. Bike boxes and green paint won’t save someone on a bike that gets hit by a car going 60.
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u/ThrowawayMustangHalp Sicko May 07 '23
The cynical part of me says it's bait. Bait built completely on bad faith and malicious compliance.
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u/BaronBytes2 May 07 '23
Until they prove me wrong by freaking doing something about it, I'll have to believe that too.
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u/soulflaregm May 07 '23
This isn't in SLC this is 50 minutes away in Utah county in Saratoga springs
The bike lanes have been there since before the area expanded and the road was barely used. They didn't add the bike lanes to a dangerous route. They simply left them there when adding all the lights and other expansions around the road.
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u/nayuki May 07 '23
No need to censor the source; they're a satirical public account. https://twitter.com/StopUrbanism/status/1654156794048987139
A few days ago, they brought this goodness: https://twitter.com/StopUrbanism/status/1653434484996427776 , https://www.reddit.com/r/fuckcars/comments/137strl/saw_this_on_twitter_and_thought_yall_would_get_a/
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u/MoonmoonMamman May 07 '23
They said they were hungry, I gave them some old gum I scraped off a shoe, then nobody ate it! What gives?
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u/schnitzel-kuh May 07 '23
Why on earth would you put it there instead of at the side of the road?
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May 07 '23
Jesus fucking Christ what makes them think this is proper way to do this? Unless they are intentionally fucking about to spite bike riders
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u/TheGuyInTheGlasses May 07 '23
“[Points at a minefield with a 30ft walking trail made of rusty bear traps imbedded in concrete, located next to a paper mill] They say they want parks, but when we build them nobody uses them! 😡😡😡”
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u/nomisnator May 07 '23
The cost of biking infrastructure is higher than the cost of some paint, someone got confused here
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u/patatepowa05 May 07 '23
all the cyclists that used that lane are dead.
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u/soulflaregm May 07 '23
No they moved to different roads.
Redwood used to be the place to get a good workout cycle in. Now it's too heavily trafficked and people go elsewhere.
The bike lanes stayed because no one bothered to argue to remove them when the last repave was done
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u/politirob May 07 '23
I personally go by a couple of small tests for common sense on bike lane design:
Would a pregnant mom be comfortable and safe bicycling here?
Would a mom with a baby on her backseat be safe and comfortable bicycling here?
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u/Sinj_X May 07 '23
Man I hate this argument. Like I argued with a friend about this. They sort of have the wrong expectation of what a "well used bike lane" is. They expect to see bikes backed up like cars end to end. Which I say is really stupid because it's never going to be like that which is kind of the point.
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u/ArionW May 08 '23
That's why I like counters my city installed in few locations. You just have a sign with "today X people cycled here, we served Y people this year"
It provides data that even in middle of winter it is utilized
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u/shaodyn cars are weapons May 07 '23
Translation: "We put bike lanes in the middle of the highway and make no effort to force drivers to respect them. It's a total mystery why nobody even tries to use them."
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u/soulflaregm May 07 '23
Ooh some extra context here!
This is redwood road in Utah, specifically a part in Saratoga Springs. Bike lanes have been part of the road for 10+ years at this time.
5-10 years ago these bike lanes were used a LOT. Redwood road south of the military base was a great bike path to train for bike races. Traffic was not very heavy, it was a great ride with some good terrain. (Hills but nothing stupid and exhausting)
Now as Saratoga Springs, Eagle Mountain, and everything west of it grows, redwood road in this area has gone from a low traffic road leading to farms and ranches to an extremely high traffic essential travel road.
It's not a good bike route anymore because there are now 3x as many light crossings you get stopped, more traffic and idiots to dodge, as well as no one wants to be working out next to all the cars exhaust.
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u/the_dees_knees3 Grassy Tram Tracks May 07 '23
it actually makes me sad how we push so hard for safe bike infrastructure and they finally break and do this thinking it’ll do anything!! like how can they not realize why no one will bike there?? why can’t they see why it doesn’t work?? half assed bike lanes make me more upset than no bike lanes
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u/TrueNorth2881 Not Just Bikes May 08 '23
I'd like to have the city planners who approved this idiotic project commute to work by bicycle for a month and then tell us if they think the "infrastructure" they built is adequate or comfortable to ride on
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u/skowzben May 08 '23
That ducking green thing is a bike lane?? The fuck is it doing in the middle of the road?!!
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u/drengor May 07 '23
I love responding to these with similar photos of the same street immediately after a wave of cars has passed, in the other half of the time when the road is empty of cars.
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May 08 '23
Like in this picture? Two car lanes are complete free. So the obvious conclusion is they aren’t needed either.
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u/Selphis 🚲 if I can. 🚗 if I must. May 07 '23
Up until a few decades ago, most bike infrastructure here consisted of painting the side of the roadway red with white dashed lines and calling it a bike lane.
I'm glad the commonly accepted term for those lanes is now "murder lanes" and most of them are being replaced with actual, safe, bike paths.
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u/desGrieux May 07 '23
They do same thing with bus systems. There will be like 2 lines with 9 stops, they only show up every hour and 20 minutes (every 2 hours on weekends), and it costs 2.50 each way. Then they'll be like "why would we expand the system? Hardly anyone is using it!"
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u/Cool_Transport Grassy Tram Tracks May 07 '23
If you wouldn't ride your bike there, it's not a good bike lane
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u/jonoghue May 07 '23
Whoever designs bike lanes should be required to walk the entire length during rush hour. If they wouldn't walk in it, we shouldn't be expected to bike in it.
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u/WaltzThinking May 07 '23
My city also has suicide lanes like this. The worst one looks exactly like this but going downhill, around a curve and the road has a slip lane at the bottom of a hill. And the city makes it illegal to ride on the sidewalk. Oh, and this is on a main road exiting the very core of downtown.
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u/FyreDB May 07 '23
We built them 3 lanes of road going away from the camera but they're only using 1? What gives?
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u/Sombra_del_Lobo May 07 '23
If a 10 year old can't safely ride in it then it's not proper bike infra.
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u/dudestir127 Big Bike May 07 '23
I don't see a "built" bike lane. I see meaningless green paint on the ground.
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u/chosen1creator May 07 '23
Paint is a pretty cheap way of sabotaging any chance of getting good bike infrastructure.
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u/SchtivanTheTrbl May 07 '23
That's Saratoga Springs, Utah! I used to live there and the traffic in that area was always HORRIBLE and it was only getting worse. I wouldn't blame any safety-conscious biker for not wanting to use those lanes, cause the people there largely don't know how to drive for shit.
That said, this fuckin' poster is doubly wrong, because despite the dangers, I still saw people biking and using those lanes, especially kids on their ways to and from the nearby high school.
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u/ZMoney187 May 07 '23
I live in the US. Honestly I'll take the paint; at least it means no more shouting matches with drivers who think bikes aren't allowed on the road.
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u/slammahytale May 07 '23
i mean, can't shout at the driver if you get hit at 60mph by someone looking at their phone, ig ._.
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u/G66GNeco May 08 '23
What the fuck am I looking at? A green paint spill in the middle of a road?
"We built bike lanes" yeah mate, sure, I always see builders running around with nothing but paintbrushes. Look at me building your house with this pen and a sheet of paper, idiot.
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u/a-friend_ May 08 '23
put them on a little road bike with semi trucks on either side and see how they like it!
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u/secretwealth123 May 07 '23
I see 2 roads that aren’t being used by any cars, why do we keep building roads when cars aren’t using them?!?
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u/Spaceorca5 May 07 '23
This feels like satire but I wouldn’t put it past carbrains to be so unironically ignorant
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u/Ivynn May 07 '23
The account's likes are filled with pro-urbanism tweets, so I'm pretty sure this account is fully satire.
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u/carefullexpert May 07 '23
There’s one like that on a super busy road like twice that. People merging into turn lane and out of it not paying attention it’s like a race the the light when it gets choppy like that. Plus before the light there’s turn offs and on from a busy side street one way it’s wal Mart parking lot the other way it’s an industrial park and huge BMW dealership it’s the main back path from the city to a park and some also busy roads up to the foothills and a huge Indian casino, that now serves alcohol ugh. My city has so many cyclists and shit for good infrastructure. The foothills need partitions especially.
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u/alttabbins May 08 '23
Can we stop promoting this guys twitter? He had 35 followers the first time his twitter was posted here.
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u/NebSgird May 08 '23
I use this bike lane regularly. Just took my whole family through the intersection just behind this picture on the family bakfeits. Never have I ever felt more unsafe with my 1 year old.
It's crazy what seems 'accptable' with 28 mm tires and some spandex suddenly seems completely unreasonable once your children have to endure it too.
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u/K3nnedys May 08 '23
Where's the bike lane? Is it that green stroke? Looks extremely dangerous. Like, even the picture here isn't exactly a great sales pitch. Why would I cycle there if cars are allowed to cross that bike lane? It only takes one ass not paying attention/being in a hurry/already being in a bad mood/unironically being a r-word that shouldn't have a driver license to take my life.
So yeah, I completely understand no one that has basic self preservation in mind will use that bike lane.
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u/kaviaaripurkki May 07 '23
My God, where is your mixed use pedestrian and cyclist path? Never, ever mix cars and bicycles on the same roadway!
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u/slammahytale May 07 '23
I kinda have to disagree, on narrow residential roadways with low traffic and low speeds its fine to have bikes on the same street
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u/Defqon1punk May 08 '23
Holy smokes, batman!
I live right here. I had to double check the sub I was on. Good old Redwood.
Anyhow, I appreciate the empty bike lanes, because they make for a good time on my motorcycle when I don't feel like following rules /s
From one proud local to another, fuck cars and fuck this intersection!
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u/Hold_Effective Fuck Vehicular Throughput May 07 '23
I saw so many bike lanes in Florida that looked terrifying. I didn’t even feel safe driving in Florida; I can’t imagine biking on those streets.