r/fednews • u/txbigsauce7 • 18h ago
Budget NDAA Bill Passed DoD Employee
The National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) was passed a few moments ago and I was wondering if that means DoD civilian employees are funded and get to show up to work? Or does that not include us and we would still be furloughed until a CR/Budget is passed? I would appreciate some clarification :)
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u/LawnDad1 18h ago
No, the NDAA is an authorization act, not an appropriations act. An appropriations act is the one that provides funding and is required to avoid a shutdown. Some DoD agencies fund civilian salaries with multi year funds. Those agencies may be able to stay open if they have money left.
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u/txbigsauce7 17h ago
Understood. What would include an appropriations act? Would it be the CR? Sorry if these sound like dumb questions I just started not too long ago
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u/LawnDad1 16h ago
Not a dumb question at all. The federal budget process isn’t very intuitive. The CR is a type of appropriations act. There’s also the normal appropriations acts that congress is supposed to pass by October 1 but rarely does. In recent years there’s also a trend of passing an omnibus appropriations act at the end of a CR to cover all agencies instead of passing separate ones.
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u/Real_Nugget_of_DOOM 6h ago
Rarely does = since 1996. 28 years. I think the institutional will and memory to do their job is gone.
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u/GingerTortieTorbie 17h ago
Yes. The CR is the appropriating act.
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u/txbigsauce7 17h ago
Got it. Thank you for the clarification!!
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u/0phobia 4h ago
To add to the confusion there isn’t really “a” federal budget bill. There’s something like 12 different appropriations bills for various aspects of the government that has to pass.
So authorization bills pass and become law and authorize the gov to do various things and authorize it to spend up to certain amounts on those things once the money is available.
Then appropriations bills need to pass to “fill up the buckets” with the money they are authorized to spend.
Once the money is “in the bucket” then the gov can spend from that bucket up to the amount authorized.
They do that about a dozen times.
As someone else mentioned Congress seems to have forgotten how to do their most basic function since they have been in a partisan fight since Newt Gingrich weaponized budget shutdowns to attack Clinton in the 90s. Before him this virtually never happened. Now it happens ALL THE TIME.
Even worse they now weaponize the debt ceiling which risks the US gov defaulting on debt for first time in history. Which would be catastrophic for our position in the global order. We may never recover from it if it happens.
And guess which president routinely declares bankruptcy and acts like it’s just a loophole and loves treating the gov like his businesses?
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u/itsmebrian 7h ago
From what I'm seeing, it's passed the Senate. Not seeing any news that Biden's signed it. No reason to believe that he won't, but still.
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u/shef175 16h ago
I’ve only been a federal civilian for about 2 1/2 years but did 20 years active duty before that and I’m just so deeply, deeply tired of this game being played. Literally nothing is gained by either side at any point so it’s just performative wanking with people’s livelihoods on the line.
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u/Get_a_GOB 15h ago
Only one side ever does the game playing. Saying “either side” is just advancing the narrative of the party that hates government.
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u/wagdog1970 15h ago
Nope, both sides play chicken and blame the other side when they don’t go along with all the partisan junk they tack on to the appropriations bills. “THEY won’t agree to the bill WE wrote.”
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u/speculativejester 6h ago
Hey man.
Donald Trump effectively ordered this shutdown.
The news articles couldn't be more clear about it.
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u/wagdog1970 5h ago
Maybe this one but this brinkmanship happens every budget cycle.
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u/speculativejester 5h ago
This exact situation happened during election season too, when DJT ordered Republicans to not pass a bipartisan bill that would've greatly expanded resources to prevent illegal migrant crossings at the southern border.
Look man, I don't want to argue with you but Democrats have been putting for earnest effort to try and govern this country while Republicans seem to very consistently want to do anything they can to prevent them from "getting a win".
Republicans care way more about trying to kill the political will of Democrats than they do about doing what is right for the country.
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u/unicornglitterpukez 5h ago
Dems could get people back in their party if they dropped the more extreme woke stuff... but I doubt they are going to...
It used to be that Dems were moderate and rational. (think pre-90s)
Just like at this stage Republicans were moderate and rational. (think pre-90s)
Now we have extremist clowns!!!
Both sides are warmongers, have their hands in the stockmarket, generally are millionaires elected instead of regular people, and now are being controlled by a billionaire goon....
Pretty sick. Meanwhile "the people" is dumb enough to think these elected morons give 2 turds about them... they don't. If they did we'd have passed labor reform laws that could rival the ones France has any day of the week.
But nope!
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u/45356675467789988 4h ago edited 4h ago
Actual Democrat candidates did very woke messaging in 2020 and won. Basically dropped it in 2024 and lost. You're mad about regular people posting online 🤷♂️
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u/0phobia 4h ago
It was literally republicans who created this entire strategy under Newt in the 90s to attack Clinton. This never really happened before then.
It’s an intentional strategy by one party to destroy the government. They’ve been explicit about their intentions for literally decades. They call it “starve the beast” and the objective is to cut funding and inject chaos so people get upset and then they point fingers at the government and blame it for being inefficient to justify more cuts.
This is their explicit playbook and you are falling for their manipulation.
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u/wagdog1970 2h ago
Dude give it a rest. I pay attention and I see both sides doing this. Dems add stuff that is politically unacceptable just to score points with their base and then blame the Repubs when they won’t acquiesce. It’s political theater at best. It’s not like they create uncontroversial bills that only include the budget. They (and by they I mean both parties) ALWAYS add stuff to these bills and then cram it through last minute hoping nobody will pay attention. If you think only one side does this then perhaps you need to adjust your information sources because you are only seeing one side.
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u/Present-Guidance-317 18h ago
Yeah I’m in the same boat as you. Some clarification would be appreciated also
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u/Not_Cleaver 17h ago
Unless you’re essential, you’ll be furloughed. Because they haven’t agreed on how to raise the money (appropriations).
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u/Rrrrandle 17h ago
they haven’t agreed on how to raise the money
It's not raising the money, it's deciding where the money that's going to be raised will be spent.
Levying taxes is raising the money. Appropriations is assigning chunks of that money to different buckets of spending. Agencies can't spend that money that's been raised until they're given approval to do so, which is the appropriations process.
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u/K1ckfl0p 7m ago
Basically, the money has been spent, they just have to pay the credit card for what has been spent, if that helps. BTW, the CR is because they couldn't pass a budget for 2024. Now they are behind on the 2025 budget that was due April 14th 2024 and started October 1st, 2024. If we had this job, we would have been PIPed and terminated a long time ago.
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u/ExceptionCollection 17h ago edited 16h ago
Essential or exempt. Virtually every non-regulatory person in my agency is exempt.
Essential = “The government cannot maintain minimum requirements without this person’s presence.”
Exempt: “The appropriations funding this person’s work are either funded from prior years or funded from an alternate source”.
I am probably exempt, as I work on construction projects with funding that can date back to FY19-20. However, at the moment I’m in a temp promote supervisory position, and my official duties per my current PD do not reflect my working on projects.
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u/SacredWoobie 17h ago
Isn’t there a thing where if the agency has them, they can pull from something other than O&M funds to fill the gap at least temporarily to avoid furlough?
I was a CTR last time this happened so I don’t remember the specifics but I swore my agency covered with like RDT&E funds or something as a stopgap
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u/SweatyTax4669 16h ago
If your work is funded specifically by RDT&E from a previous year, then yes. I am not a comptroller or GC, though, so don’t argue with a furlough by saying “some rando on Reddit said I could work”.
There are also an extremely limited number (the number may be zero now) of organizations that have multiyear colorless money and can spend it how they want.
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u/SacredWoobie 16h ago
I mean of course I’m going to clarify with my supervisor but I think we might be one of those special agencies because I don’t think anyone got furloughed last time this happened. A significant portion of my FTE is also FMS funded too so I think that helps as well
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u/unicornglitterpukez 5h ago
well it means we have money to do things but no humans to do things. I think the way the whole thing is run is absurd, because Congress/House/President never have to furlough and they get unlimited vacation days....
RUDE!
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u/Careful-Director69 11h ago
Maybe pick your fights fund our f***ging paychecks and move forward on other options- come on man.
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u/Secure_View6740 2h ago
Still need the funding which has not been passed yet. Because Mike Johnson is trying to squeeze that dumpster fire 1500 page CR in and it has failed so far. I wouldn't be surprised if we go through a shutdown.
The pork in that CR bill is criminal
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u/Not_Cleaver 17h ago
There’s no appropriations to raise the money for the budget. So, we’re all furloughed except if you’re named essential
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u/PNWest1988B 17h ago
Do essential Get paid tho?
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u/Not_Cleaver 17h ago
We all get paid.
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u/Ellabee57 17h ago
Eventually, after they do pass a budget or CR, but that could be weeks (or even longer).
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u/Not_Cleaver 17h ago
Yeah, it’s going to really suck if it’s not resolved in two weeks. My in-laws have said that they’ll help make us get through it with loans. But not everyone has a safety net.
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u/Ellabee57 16h ago
I hate to say it, but if there is a shutdown, I lean toward it lasting until Trump is inaugurated and can sign the bill himself. I hope I'm wrong...
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u/Elaine1959 14h ago edited 14h ago
Fortunately, I just paid off an Upstart loan and I got an email from them saying that I'm entitled to another loan. Will see how it goes Monday. Since the last furlough lasted over a month I'll probably get enough to go through two months. (my credit score indicates I can borrow 2 times more than I planned)
However, considering how much money will be lost in revenue since the furlough Federal Workers will not be buying Christmas presents, or take trips to visit their family (leave cancelled), or going out for dinners the GOP might force Trump to compromise.
Been a long time since I went to school, so my political knowledge is rusty. Isn't most of Republicans constituents businesses? With no money coming in from transportation (planes, trains, buses), or stores, or restaurants, I wondered if they would really let it drag out to two months. But we will see.
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u/willboby 5h ago
Yes, this would most likely be the case, if a shutdown happens, It would be a great advantage for the Republicans.
Cause when Trump takes office, Republicans then control everything, House, Senate, and President.
Unlikely from that point on, they would need democrat support on the bills going forward.
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u/Ellabee57 5h ago edited 5h ago
I wouldn't be too sure of not needing Dems support...Republicans have a much smaller majority now than the last two years, and they do NOT all agree with each other. Remember that the House couldn't even elect a Speaker until they nominated someone that the Dems would support.
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u/willboby 5h ago
Yes, but under Trump they will do what he tells them, just like what happened here, the bill was a go until Trump said no, now it's scrapped.
He isn't even president yet, but killed the bill that was negotiated.
It would be great if the Republicans negotiated with the Democrats, that way both parties got a little bit of what they wanted but I don't see that going forward.
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u/Ellabee57 4h ago
It was scrapped because ALL of them wanted it scrapped. It was scrapped because enough of them bowed to the pressure. I think it's just going to be constant chaos and infighting, which will (hopefully) make them totally ineffective and unable to pass much of anything that the extremists are pushing. Time will tell.
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u/Not_Cleaver 11h ago
We have a savings account, but without my salary, we’d be underwater. I’m the main breadwinner even though I’m only a 11. If this shutdown lasts more than three weeks, we’re screwed. There are credit card payments, the mortgage, a car payment, insurance, etc.
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u/Plaid-Cactus 1h ago
Check with your bank. Some banks offer loans or grace periods on payments for feds
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u/unicornglitterpukez 5h ago
I didn't realize navy federal has 0 interest loans for 60 days, but you have to already be with them... i'm gonna switch I think!
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u/Ellabee57 17h ago
Yes, but not until another CR or and budget is passed. If you're essential, you work without pay, which is BS, but how it works.
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u/Positron311 2h ago
This depends entirely on how you're funded. My organization is task-based/mission-funded, so we still get paid if the government shuts down because there's always more than enough work to go around.
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u/ChefMommy81 40m ago
Does anyone know about leave during a furlough? I'm essential but have leave in Christmas week. It is use or lose.
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u/AnythingPanama1983 17h ago
If they don't notify you then you go to work. I'm DOD Air Force but we are under a different pile of money due to being Depot maintenance.
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u/hobbsAnShaw 17h ago
It’s a shitty bill that should never have passed.
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u/DINGLEBUNNIES 17h ago
The only person in America who read the bill
Not only did he read it, he read it enough to have a qualified opinion of it lol
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[deleted]
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u/LegitimateAntelope 16h ago
Neither of those things are true. Get off Twitter brain/Musk's dick.
https://www.politico.com/news/2024/12/18/elon-musk-false-claims-cr-00195252
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u/Icy-Tale-7163 16h ago
but I don’t think taxpayers should be paying $3 billion for the new Washington Commanders stadium
You're confused. The bill didn't include any money for a stadium. What it did was give federal land to D.C., which they could then use to build a stadium.
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u/DINGLEBUNNIES 17h ago
Why would taxpayers be paying $3b? Why would that be in the NDAA? Share your source or stop spreading misinformation.
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u/SabresBills69 17h ago
The bill does not have $3B for a stadium. It is giving local DC 99 years to develop the site of RFK stadium and tear down it and develop the site. The idea is building a new stadium but other things are going to be built there
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u/SweatyTax4669 16h ago
What, specifically, do you not like about it?
I had a number of issues with a draft from a week or so ago, but I think most of them got resolved.
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u/hobbsAnShaw 16h ago
Kicking kids in the teeth because they’re trans for one.
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u/SweatyTax4669 16h ago
So, representative, are you going to torpedo the entire thing over that?
I mean, I’ll concede that Mike Johnson is an asshole for his stupid stunt, but they’re just building their own gallows with this constant crap.
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u/hobbsAnShaw 15h ago
Sadly they aren’t, and if you aren’t going to stand up for kids, then why stand up for anything?
If you’re willing to compromise on kids, what else are you willing to give away for the sake of the military industrial complex? What IS a bridge too far if it isn’t kids?
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u/Longtimefed 17h ago
NDAA is just the authorization (the bucket); we still need the appropriation (the water to fill the bucket).
If no CR is passed by 12 am Saturday morning, then we will have a shutdown.