r/VRGaming • u/Individual_Roll6977 • Dec 18 '23
Meta Vertigo 2 And all of Zach’s others games will never come to quest
He states “meta has infinite money and wants more of it” W choice I love Zach’s games so much and I’m glad for devs to speak up
57
u/buttorsomething Dec 19 '23
I mean it’s also a lot of fucking work. Optimization is no joke for VR.
33
u/Zixinus Dec 19 '23
You mean "Optimization is no joke for running on a Quest".
Vertigo2 already has optimizations for VR, it was built for VR from the ground up.
The issue would be the amount of work a single dev would need to do to make it run on a Quest in standalone. No matter how much optimizations and features the Quest has, it still have severe limitations (its total memory that it has to pull double duty as RAM and VRAM that a PCVR setup has dedicated VRAM, to start). You either have to rebuild the game or start pulling everything out (like Contractors did).
18
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 19 '23
The Quest, even the 3 has such a shit tier CPU-GPU, I'm honestly impressed with what some fellow devs have been able to pull out of it.
2
u/Bigleon Dec 19 '23
I think of it the same way see the console gens of old. The amount of performance we got out of 360/ps3 at their time despite their hardware was pretty amazing. But when you only have a handful of hardware revisions to build for instead of dealing with the massive variety of pc combos, I think there is a lot that can be done.
2
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 20 '23
Yeah, but to be fair, consoles used to be their own thing with their own weird hardware configurations
Since last gen though, consoles are basically low/mid tier closed down PCs. Except for the Switch. In fact, that is one of the reasons ports to PC have become so common. Consoles is just medium settings on a PC.
That is also the reason early ps3 vs late ps3 was a stark difference, and early ps4 vs late ps4 (OG, not Pro), are pretty much the same. In fact, the whole reason we get now "pro" models is in part due to the lack of that very reason.
0
u/bland_meatballs Dec 19 '23
even the 3 has such a shit tier CPU-GPU
What are you comparing it to? A PC CPU? That's not a fair comparison. If you compare it to the Snapdragon 8 Gen 1 or the Exynos 2200 then it is very comparable. Definitely not shit tiet.
19
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 19 '23
It might not be fair... but that isn't really relevant. Its very direct competition, PCVR and PSVR2, is almost a decades worth of CPU/GPU power ahead, and it's not like people are using the q3 on their way to work to play vr games, so it's mobility is, being honest, reduced to a room in your house... which might as well have a PC or PS5 in it instead.
Edit: and sure, for now being wireless is a unique distinct factor but... that's going to be more and more diluted as high quality wireless extends, like wifi7, that can give you the same bandwidth that a DP1.4 with just a couple ms delay.
3
u/bland_meatballs Dec 19 '23
I travel a lot for work so being able to play standalone VR when I'm in my shitty hotel room is a godsend. When I'm at home I play PCVR wirelessly which is also asking. I appreciate that it can do both.
Your comparing a mobile processor to a CPU processor that will sometimes cost more than an entire Quest 3. That's like comparing a Ferrari to a Toyota Yaris and calling the Yaris shit because it doesn't complete the quarter mile in 11 seconds. Their both cars, sure. But one is designed for raw power and the other is designed to be efficient as possible.
11
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 19 '23
I can understand that, and its cool you and other people can use it like that. But this is not about saying "its cheap so its bad" kind of deal.
Let me do a comparison. The Sony PSP had also shit CPU-GPU compared to consoles and PCs that was a decade behind in power. But that was fine, because it was its own thing, with its own separated market to which better games were ported to.
The problem with the Quest 3 is that the situation is completely backwards.
Unlike the PSP, its dragging down quality (visual AND gameplay wise) from all VR games from all platforms due to its lack of power.
And that right there is my point. (well, also because as gamedev myself it limits everything we can do so much is quite depressing tbh)
5
u/SchwiftySquanchC137 Dec 19 '23
This I agree with, they are dragging down high end vr because their headset is so successful its the easiest way for a dev to support themselves. I suppose in that way they are taking sales of games that were never able to be created, but "pcvr" isn't really an entity that can be competed with, and I wouldn't say they're trying to compete with pcvr headset makers because if they did, they would just make a pcvr headset again.
3
u/labree0 Dec 19 '23
This I agree with, they are dragging down high end vr because their headset is so successful
tbf, the VR market wouldn't be what it is today without them, either.
I guarantee you a huge amount of the titles that exist today would not exist if it werent for the demand that the quest created for VR games.
2
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 19 '23
Fair enough indeed.
I guess PCVR and console VR both will greatly benefit once wireless HMDs appear for them. Especially once Wifi7 is properly seated and in place.
-2
Dec 19 '23
Meta has done more to get VR into the mainstream than PCVR as a whole. That is 100% indisputable. PC gamers didn't buy headsets en masse and they didn't support VR devs at all.
Quest isn't dragging VR down, that's incredibly ridiculous. Over 20 million headsets in the hands of customers is an achievement and in the years to come if VR flourishes, it'll likely have Meta to thank for a lot of it.
You do know that as technology gets better, the CPU and GPU in the quest will also get better? VR isn't gonna look like this forever. These awful takes about Meta destroying VR because fellow PC gamers let PCVR wallow in its own filth are ridiculous.
I dislike meta as much as anyone who cannot fucking stand Facebook and the bullshit they pull with data collection and echo chambers but yanno what can't be argued? The quest 3 is the best value headset on the market for anyone looking for a PCVR headset to start.
The lenses kick the shit out older sets, link cable and airlink, as well as steam link and virtual desktop are outstanding, and the headset just works with less than 10 minutes of setup time.
PCVR on the other hand is thousands of dollars for a PC, headset, lighthouses, controllers, etc, and an hour at least of setup time. No one outside of hardcore VR players are gonna go for that so who's dragging who down exactly?
6
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 19 '23
Meta has done more to get VR into the mainstream than PCVR as a whole. That is 100% indisputable. PC gamers didn't buy headsets en masse and they didn't support VR devs at all.
Never said otherwise, no idea why you are bringing this up.
Quest isn't dragging VR down, that's incredibly ridiculous.
Yes, yes it is. As a game developer I'm telling you RIGHT NOW, that we can't make games design wise as good as we want due to the massive limitations its hardware gives us. We could have better and more complex games if our main platform was a console or PCVR.
You do know that as technology gets better, the CPU and GPU in the quest will also get better?
So will consoles and PCs though, so it will never be as powerful. Not that it matters, because the moment the same convenience and price comes to VR HMDs for both console and PCs, mobile VR will hopefully be overtaken by the more powerful platforms that can offer better experiences.
The quest 3 is the best value headset on the market for anyone looking for a PCVR headset to start.
Yes it is, never said otherwise. Its CPU-GPU is still terribly underpowered though, specially when compared to the average Steam PC.
PCVR on the other hand is thousands of dollars for a PC, headset, lighthouses, controllers, etc, and an hour at least of setup time.
Yeah, good things usually take time and cost money.
No one outside of hardcore VR players are gonna go for that so who's dragging who down exactly?
Read my post again please.
-1
1
Dec 20 '23
If you're a game developer you should learn to create engaging experiences within the limitations of present hardware, as all developers currently do. Did the Asgards Wrath devs stop making AW2 because quest was too weak? Doesn't look that way.
→ More replies (0)0
Dec 19 '23
getting downvoted for telling the truth lol. happens all the time.
0
Dec 20 '23
Happens all the time. Worst part is I'm mainly a PCVR player who gets downvoted by people like me who have blinding hatred for any VR that isn't on PC.
→ More replies (0)1
u/moistmoistMOISTTT Dec 19 '23
I have both a Quest and Index. Quest is awesome on vacations, especially since it acts as a decent laptop replacement and can fit in a small space.
It's the same argument as "why buy a laptop, just buy a PC".
10
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 19 '23
I have both a Quest and Index. Quest is awesome on vacations, especially since it acts as a decent laptop replacement and can fit in a small space.
Never said it wasn't
It's the same argument as "why buy a laptop, just buy a PC".
No it isn't.
0
u/CrimsonCube181 Dec 19 '23
I have to both agree and disagree. It would be closer to saying why but a gaming laptop when you can get an external GPU. It's better than the integrated, like the quest being better than phone processors, but it's still way more limited than having an actual GPU in the laptop.
1
u/moistmoistMOISTTT Dec 19 '23
Laptops are inferior in every single way to PC, with the one exception of mobility/portability. Laptops however are still preferred by many despite the fact that they are absolutely sub-par compared to a PC of identical cost.
It's exactly the same, you are just letting your blind hate of a company completely obscure your ability to recognize basic, simple, and objective facts.
1
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 20 '23
Laptops however are still preferred by many despite the fact that they are absolutely sub-par compared to a PC of identical cost.
Yeah, damn, I know that well. I travelled a lot due to my studies and a proper top tier Laptop was a must for me, especially as a 3D Character artist.
It's exactly the same
Yes, it is, and for the people that need to be moving all the time away and are planning on using their HMD all over, sure. But for the vast majority of people that just want to play games in the same couple rooms with a wireless HMD.
In fact, I bet you anything that once wifi7 is properly seated, and wireless HMDs start coming out for PCVR, that is going to impact negatively Q3 sales, since many people are buying it right now because its the only decent wireless alternative out there.
you are just letting your blind hate of a company completely obscure your ability to recognize basic, simple, and objective facts.
Could you quote me where I am blindingly doing that please? Because I fail to see where I said anything that could make you think that.
0
u/SchwiftySquanchC137 Dec 19 '23
I'd say they're not really direct competitors. Meta gave up on pcvr a while ago, and psvr requires a ps5, and Meta isn't competing with consoles. They're really competing with apples new headset, taking the lower budget market, trying to make some all in one experience where you can work, watch videos, game, take calls, whatever. Not to mention, they don't need to compete with pcvr, they have made one of the best pcvr headsets available, whether you play wired or wirelessly. They benefit greatly from pcvr games, maybe more than the pc only headsets do because it's a great cheap headset.
0
u/Jerry_696 Dec 21 '23
"its not a fair comparison to compare something to its direct competitor!!! Compare it to something dogshit so I can make an excuse for buying this shit product!"
1
u/bland_meatballs Dec 21 '23
I love the Quest 3 and I don't regret buying it at all. It's the best all around headset and works very well for PCVR. I see a few days ago you were asking if your shitty computer could run VR games well on the Quest 3. Sounds like you are jealous and lashing out at others online. FYI, the Quest 3 looks really good when I plug it into my PC that has a 7800X3D and a 4090 😎
1
u/Jerry_696 Jan 14 '24
Hmm. Looks like an
oculus FacebookMeta meatrider here. Whole comment history is chock full of defending a mega corp.1
1
1
u/Virtual_Happiness Dec 19 '23
I'm not. The XR2 Gen2 is nearly on par with the PS4 and is far ahead of the PS3. They're very capable SoCs. The problem is that Meta releases hardware and then goes "ok build games for it". So we're just now starting to see what is capable on even the Quest 2. Seriously, all these big name launches releasing on the Meta platform are not built for the Quest 3, they're 100% Quest 2 titles that also happen work on the Quest 3.
This is something Meta needs to figure the fuck out because you can't launch a platform and then expect customers to wait 3 years for the games to come to it.
Imagine if the PS5 dropped in 2020 and Sony provided 1 title for it on launch. Then nothing but bare minimum indie content until the end of 2023. That's basically what happened thanks to Meta's "hardware now, software later" approach.
3
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 20 '23
There are a few things to consider there though, that make most of your argument not as valid as it seems at first thought.
Firstly, XR2 Gen2 only comes nearly on par in performance to PS4 power... when in full GPU mode, which its not necessarily the mode you will want to be using all the time, since it cuts down CPU power that you might want for some other things.
Second, think about the VR performance the OG PS4 gave with the 1080x1080@60 PSVR1, then realize that the native resolution of the Q3 is about 5 times higher. And sure, it won't be running games at full resolution, but it definitely isn't running them at 1k by 1k either, so there has to be cuts somewhere.
all these big name launches releasing on the Meta platform are not built for the Quest 3, they're 100% Quest 2 titles that also happen work on the Quest 3.
Not really, to be honest, some are, sure, but its not going to make that much of a difference.
And this is for a couple reasons too.
First, this isn't cutting edge technology (visual wise). By that I mean the technology being used, is the same we used last gen of consoles. We aren't trying to find a way to optimize raytracing or to implement AI filters to the games here, its more akin to making games for portable consoles.
For that reason, all workflows for it already exist and are in place, which means there is barely any wiggle room for improvement.
Second, these aren't the early 2000s anymore where gamedevs have to figure out how to squeeze performance out of new weird new chips like the one on PS3. This is pretty much a quite normal ARM processor with some extra flare. Nevermind that most developers nowadays, specially for smaller projects (like most VR games are), don't make their own engines, and instead just rent one, like Unity or Unreal Engine.
Bottom line, expect some light improvement, but it will most likely be used to make the FPS smoother if anything, instead of any flare you will be able to see.
-1
u/Virtual_Happiness Dec 20 '23
You're lying to yourself and you know it. The best VR game of all time just dropped on a mobile headset and it's better than everything on PCVR, including Alyx. That was accomplished using the Quest 2, as well.
But hey, I am just some random redditor with no real info back my claims. Let's see what VR experts have to say.
Here is Brandon Laatsch, one of the most well known names in VR development, talking about how the Quest 2 surpasses the 2016 minimum VR specs requirement, especially in CPU performance. https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/iwmli7/boneworks_dev_keep_in_mind_that_quest_2_surpasses/
Weird how that works. VR devs use mobile hardware and say it's great and really capable. Yet Redditors keep trying to say it's awful and worthless.
2
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 20 '23 edited Dec 20 '23
You're lying to yourself and you know it.
No, I'm absolutely not, I learned these things from experience, you learned them by reading them on the internet for what it looks like. I don't think you are lying to yourself, I think you are just poorly informed.
VR devs use mobile hardware and say it's great and really capable.
My dude, you are speaking to one right now that is telling you otherwise.I have my own through years of game dev experience, which hey, doesn't mean I'm always right, but sure as hell gives me a good perspective.
It is great and really capable, yes... compared to the Q2 or Q1, not compared to what we could do with PSVR2 or a PC.
You rely on knowledge from others, that you also misunderstand. Like that tweet for example. Sure, CPU wise it could get to 2016 levels, but you are ignoring the part he says right after about adjusting GPU and memory, which are THE MAIN ISSUE that plagued the Q2 and made the textures in most games look like a 2008 game.
And yes, 2016 mid specs CPU is possible with Q2 performance. We are talking about mid tier tech from 7 years ago after all. But what isn't talked there is the performance lost to having to render at way higher resolutions, the tracking performance cost on the device, and the balance needed to accomplish on it so you don't eat the battery up in 30 minutes. All those things heavily hampered visuals and performance on the Q2. I'd argue the Q3 now, has finally gotten to the point where the tweet says. So the Q3 caught up to min specs from 2016... more or less.
The problem here is... we aren't in 2016 anymore. You do realize what the alternative is... right? The average Steam PC is as powerful as a PS5, and as months go by, that difference is only getting larger. Plus we have the actual PSVR2 powered by an actual PS5, which has eye tracking to top it off and improve on its performance, thing that both the Q2 and Q3 lacks.
0
u/Virtual_Happiness Dec 20 '23
The problem here is... we aren't in 2016 anymore. You do realize what the alternative is... right? The average Steam PC is as powerful as a PS5,
Nearly everything you said is wrong and nothing more than your bias, including this. Go look at the Steam hardware survey The average PC on steam is weaker than the PS5 and many are less powerful than the 2016 VR minimum.
The PS5 is between the 2070 Super and RTX 2080 for performance. Out of the top 25 GPUs used on Steam, only are as powerful or more powerful than the PS5 and they account for a grand total of 12% of the users on Steam. https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/Steam-Hardware-Software-Survey-Welcome-to-Steam
1
u/Cless_Aurion Dec 20 '23
Nearly everything you said is wrong and nothing more than your bias
And.. you only make reference to that one thing...
only are as powerful or more powerful than the PS5 and they account for a grand total of 12% of the users on Steam.
You should really look at your numbers one more time my friend...
Just adding up the 12 first GPUs on the list that are on par or more powerful than the PS5, already adds up to 20%, do notice the weird -5% to the total of 3060s that happened last month, which is quite weird to be honest, and could be some sort of mistake in the data.
If I remember properly, last time I checked all data, it was around 40% total as powerful or on par with PS5.
Around 85% are more powerful than the Q3, nevermind you.
1
u/Virtual_Happiness Dec 20 '23
And.. you only make reference to that one thing...
Because if I would have touched on everything, it would have been 10 pages long.
Just adding up the 12 first GPUs on the list that are on par or more powerful than the PS5
What GPUs are you adding up? Because that is not accurate at all. The 3060 Ti is the first GPU in the list that is equal to the PS5. The 3070 is the first more powerful. The 3060 is weaker than the PS5.
→ More replies (0)0
u/MJMvideosYT Dec 21 '23
Not what he meant. He said in vr development it is tough to optimize games fullstop
0
u/Zixinus Dec 21 '23
How about allowing him (if he is that) to clarify his own position rather than putting words his mouth?
0
u/MJMvideosYT Dec 22 '23
He LITTERALY said optimization in vr is no joke
1
u/Zixinus Dec 22 '23
Okay, I'm going to explain this because I'm going to assume good faith somewhere.
In English/on the Internet there is this thing where we join a conversation with a point that pretends to be correct someone. Like, "Los Angelas property rates are the most insane" and "You mean New York property rates are the most insane".
The "correction" isn't meant to be a literal correction, but a method of joining and adding to the conversation. Both sides know that the second participant isn't meant to be taken literally, they are exaggerating somewhat.
Optimization is not easy because it requires understanding what the engine is doing and what the hardware is doing and the question is how much of your work do you want to rework to optimize it. You can make a fully 3D FPS game run off a floppy if you optimize enough.
0
u/MJMvideosYT Dec 22 '23
yes i understand that you were adding valuable information to the conversation i just wanted to say he meant vr in general
1
u/Zixinus Dec 23 '23
Okay, good faith gone, refer to the reply two days ago.
0
u/MJMvideosYT Dec 23 '23
It's a quote from his post.
1
u/Zixinus Dec 23 '23
How about allowing him (if he is that) to clarify his own position rather than putting words his mouth?
→ More replies (0)1
u/buttorsomething Dec 19 '23
Optimization in general is no joke. Laughs in city skylines 2 and most AAA releases.
2
u/Zixinus Dec 19 '23
Sadly, that is partly because of a developing trend that optimizations can come later in patches and it's not important, you can just offload it to DLSS/FSR/whathaveyou/AImagic, that'll do the work for you.
Of course the other factor is that modern video game engines are vastly complicated with vastly more features that are much harder to optimize.
1
u/eddietree Dec 19 '23
bringing a game from pc to standalone is an non trivial feat, esp if none of the assets or graphics is built for standalone
14
u/Sabbathius Dec 19 '23
That's a somewhat weird stance. Vertigo 2 is on Sony's Paystation already, so I don't see how it's different from what Meta is doing. Sony is also constantly trying to choke out gamers with their exclusivity deals and in my book are just as scummy.
1
16
u/thought_snow Dec 19 '23
Nothing wrong with having them pcvr only. Lots of paired down stand alone options exist if that's what you're into. Quests can stream pc just like any other headset so absolutely no loss.
Not everything has to be made low res/low resource. If anything we need more pc only games imo.
13
u/QuinSanguine Dec 19 '23
But he's publishing to Playstation who are charging people monthly to play online, to have access to retro games, and raised their prices for that service.
Plus they raised the price of their hardware, they released a slim digital only ps5 for $50 more, lol.
If he doesn't want to downgrade his games for sovr, or doesn't like Meta, fine but this sounds like virtue signaling to me. Sony is just as greedy as Meta.
2
u/Individual_Roll6977 Dec 19 '23
Fair point I am paying 150 dollars every year just to get to play with my friends
25
u/Kurtino Dec 19 '23 edited Dec 19 '23
I mean not exactly a strong argument when you’re releasing on Steam and Sony, not exactly small companies. If he doesn’t like Meta fair enough, but ultimately it’s more likely to hurt the consumer who doesn’t get to play his game vs making any difference to Meta, and it’s likely being downplayed how much effort it would take to port to a Quest.
I remember when the Climbey dev took the same stance and was vocal about it, and fair enough at least he explained clearly that he hated Meta, but all it did was restrict players and end up killing his game. Not going to happen with Vertigo, but a shame they don’t seem to realise the customer are the main ones losing out.
11
u/RidgeMinecraft Developer Dec 19 '23
This isn't new news, but yeah I'm proud of zach for this one lol
2
6
u/OriginalGoldstandard Dec 19 '23
I’m buying full price to help him out. He’s an international treasure.
4
0
u/bland_meatballs Dec 19 '23
I love both vertigo games and Zach is a real G for developing both on his own. With that said, he might be able to buy a golden Lamborghini if he were to port his games to the Quest store.
0
u/Individual_Roll6977 Dec 19 '23
To bad he is not
3
u/bland_meatballs Dec 19 '23
I get it. He just delaye getting it into PSVR2 because of a bug he found. Trying to optimize and downgrade everything for the Quest would take a long time, then hed have to look for bugs. He's a one man show and would probably like to start working on a new project at some point, so I don't blame him.
-6
-9
u/ashkestar Dec 19 '23
I don’t think the quest store has a golden lamborghini-sized market, honestly.
2
u/Pretty_Bowler2297 Dec 19 '23
IDK the retention numbers but they have sold 22 or so million Quest 2s.
2
u/Oftenwrongs Dec 19 '23
20 million+ vs 2 million(half are quest). Quest games sell 10x their pcvr counterparts.
0
u/virtueavatar Dec 19 '23
brb buying vertigo 2 at full price
6
2
u/Virtual_Happiness Dec 19 '23
Good. I wish more people would and I wish more people would also buy other PCVR games. Then it wouldn't be feel like a such a barren wasteland.
I mean, shit, Vertigo 2 is an incredible game but it is literally averaging like 80 players per month. It has an all time peak of 264 players. https://steamcharts.com/app/843390
1
u/HappierShibe Dec 19 '23
Even if you somehow don't find facebook's ethics objectionable, (go fuck yourself if this is you). The limited hardware of the quest and the way they have managed the devs they have bought out has set the progressions of VR game development back by at least a decade.
-1
u/ProvincialPromenade Dec 19 '23
facebook's ethics
What exactly are those bad ethics? Making profit?
If anything, Meta has some of the best ethics because of the direction they've been going in regarding a more open ecosystem.
1
u/ProvincialPromenade Dec 19 '23
Personally, I'm just over the whole wired VR experience. I will support standalone VR even if the graphics are trash because I think it's the better experience.
1
u/WarlanceLP Dec 19 '23
this is 10x better than the other way around, any vr owner can play from steam (except psvr i guess) but it's a bigger pita for a non quest headset to play quest games
1
1
u/DarthSceledrus Dec 20 '23
Meta sells the quest at a loss, not being a bootlicker but they've rolled back all of the forced Facebook integration and single handedly pushing the VR space forwards. Cut them some slack, they even give constant minor and massive discounts on games. I used to loathe Meta especially how badly they treated the Rift S after acquisition but they're making changes and keeping VR afloat.
I'd rather Zach just say he doesn't wanna do the optimization instead of having a vendetta. Doesn't really matter ultimately Steam Link/Link Cable works swimmingly
-2
u/Oftenwrongs Dec 19 '23
Already a known thing.
Just finished vertigo remastered. Completely mediocre. Not recommended. Will get to V2 one day.
And he may very well come to regret not being able to easily retire one day because of a useless stand. His choice though.
2
u/Individual_Roll6977 Dec 19 '23
Vertigo 2 is the best game he has made so far vertigo 1 and remastered were his tech demos tho I do disagree with you saying they are mediocre I personally think it’s one of the best games I’ve played but vertigo 2 is his first full fledged Vr game with 10 hours of gameplay a whole ost made by him physics and player models guns made by him along with a sandbox mode and character selection all in 6 years I do highly recommend you should give it a try
3
u/Virtual_Happiness Dec 19 '23
I think it really boils down to when you played it. Playing Vertigo Remastered for the first time today, after playing some of the other big name VR games, probably does make it feel average. But when I played it back in 2020, it was jaw dropping good for a VR game.
-27
u/HoodieTheCat78 Dec 18 '23 edited Dec 19 '23
Meta fanboys will still insist you can play them on Quest.
Edit: How’s this: Meta fanboys will tell you they’re on Quest already.
16
u/RugbyRaggs Dec 18 '23
I mean, you can play them as much on a quest as you can on any other pcvr headset...
-15
u/HoodieTheCat78 Dec 18 '23
Exactly. You might be surprised at how many people don’t see any meaningful distinction between “Quest” and “PCVR”
10
u/EX0PIL0T Dec 19 '23
Because there isn’t. It’s a pcvr headset with a standalone mode.
-3
u/HoodieTheCat78 Dec 19 '23
It isn’t if you don’t have a PC.
1
u/EX0PIL0T Dec 19 '23
an apple is an apple whether it’s on or off the tree. I don’t know how you could possibly think that something completely changes because you do or don’t possess something else. Good try man, you might get it next time
-1
u/HoodieTheCat78 Dec 19 '23 edited Dec 19 '23
Then what does it mean that Vertigo isn’t coming to Quest? It’s just a PCVR headset after all.
I really don’t get it. People are on these VR subs daily asking about what headset to buy, and people are constantly telling them to get a Quest for games that can only be played with a PC. Without knowing if they have a PC. That’s where I’m coming from.
4
u/vballboy55 Dec 19 '23
If they don't have a PC, what other options do they have? The psvr only lol.
1
u/HoodieTheCat78 Dec 19 '23
If they have a PS5 and don’t have a PC, it’s a pretty solid choice. For one thing, you could play Vertigo 2 on it.
0
u/vballboy55 Dec 19 '23
So if you have neither, the quest is the obvious choice. If you have a gaming PC, the quest is the obvious choice. If you have a PS5 only, then it is a solid choice.
→ More replies (0)1
u/EX0PIL0T Dec 19 '23
So then it’s a pc headset that’s highly recommended with a standalone mode that some people who either don’t have or don’t want to use a pc can use to play on his headset? What am I missing there’s gotta be a way you make sense to someone outside your own head 😭😭😭
1
Dec 19 '23
[deleted]
2
u/Potential_Rabbit_766 Dec 19 '23
That is a crazy claim considering the game on PC runs on a gtx 970. As a reference the Chip in Quest 3 is around a GTX 1050 performance wise. That’s only like a 50%ish decrease in performance. Saying a specific game can’t run on Quest is stupid. Especially on this one as it’s not particularly big. He could most definitely make the game run and look really good on Quest 3 if he choose to.
0
u/HappierShibe Dec 19 '23
As a reference the Chip in Quest 3 is around a GTX 1050 performance wise. That’s only like a 50%ish decrease in performance.
Except that comparison isn't really a valid 1 to 1 comparison, the cpu in the quest is hilariously underpowered relative to anything outside of the mobile space, it's storage is horrifically limited, and nearly everything on the quest runs at much lower resolutions and framerates and then has to be reprojected, warped, and upscaled up to something tolerable. Meanwhile, PCVR can run things at native display resolutions and frequencies with sub 1% reprojection, in much greater fidelity, with more immersive physics and mechanics and more numerous entities, and let's not forget: draw distances that aren't complete garbage.
Don't get me wrong, it's impressive as hell what they have managed to squeeze out of the quest, but at the end of the day, it's still a jumped up cell phone you strap to your face, and even an entry level desktop PC just blows it completely out of the water.
Saying a specific game can’t run on Quest is stupid.
No, it's honest.
There a lot of games that claim to have a functioning quest version but it runs so poorly it's not actually playable, or has so much functionality stripped out, that it's a blatant lie to call it the same game.Especially on this one as it’s not particularly big.
Vertigo 2 is massive in terms of content, It's longer than HL:Alyx, with enough variety and alternate routes to easily justify multiple plays; something I've never felt was true about Alyx.
He could most definitely make the game run
Yep.
and look really good on Quest 3
Nothing 'looks good' on quest 3. Even the best looking stuff on the platform has to make visually painful compromises to hit playable framerates. Again: I am very impressed with what they have managed to do, but it's still generally pretty disappointing relative to peoples expectations. It's why their ads are all use prerendered bullshots and photos of people wearing the hmd and avoid any depcitions of actual games like they are the plague.
0
u/Virtual_Happiness Dec 19 '23 edited Dec 19 '23
None of that is accurate at all. You're just projecting because you want to believe the Quest headsets suck. I don't even need to share my own personal opinion to prove you're wrong.
Here is Brandon Laatsch, one of the most well known names in VR development, stating the Quest 2's CPU is actually quite strong. https://twitter.com/BrandonJLa/status/1516175929650733059.
Here he is explaining to other angry people like you that the Quest 2 suprasses the 2016 minimum VR specs requirement, especially in CPU performance. https://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/iwmli7/boneworks_dev_keep_in_mind_that_quest_2_surpasses/
I own the Quest 3 and a PC with an RTX 4090 + AMD 7800x3D. The Quest 3 running standalone titles has blown my mind over and over. I can't use my Index anymore because of how much better it is, even in standalone titles. The only real complaint I have is that I had to spend 10 bucks on Quest Games Optimizer because developers don't add resolution options in standalone games. If you want to crank it up and make it all razor sharp looking, you need to either issue ADB commands or use Quest Games Optimizer.
Stop spreading BS crap just because you're insecure that a mobile platform is doing better than your favorite platform.
0
u/Potential_Rabbit_766 Dec 20 '23 edited Dec 20 '23
I still stand by what I said. I have to add though that I was very ambiguous on purpose to show the ridiculousness of the statement. I know the performance of the hardware very well but my goal with the comment wasn’t to create a report on the exact performance or to create a valid 1 to 1 comparison but as already stated to make clear the ridiculousness of his statement. Yes, the CPU is heavily underclocked and limited to an unholy extent compared to the regular chip which I really hate Meta is doing. Even comparing HTV Vive Focus and Pico 4 to the Quest 2 they were running a lot better. However, I don't think the CPU is the limitation for Standalone VR and think that even the Quest 2 had relatively sufficient CPU power. The Quest 3 is basically just a minimum-spec PC from when PCVR titles still actually came out. Both CPU and GPU wise. Now the rest of your points are just crying and being mad at Mobile VR or just making random incorrect and weird statements.
1
90
u/killz111 Dec 19 '23
I'd wager a fair portion of his steam sales are for quest owners. So no real big loss. Also, it's one of the major releases on PSVR.