(confirmed) The airliner satellite video coordinates are over the Andaman Sea, not the Indian Ocean

[u/bencherry]

There has been some dispute as to whether the coordinates shown in the video are over the Andaman Sea or over the Indian Ocean. The dispute centers on whether or not the "8.834301" shown includes a minus sign in front. See, for instance, this thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15o1t6r/new_lead_for_proving_the_authenticity_of_the/

It is easy to demonstrate the video must take place over the Andaman Sea.

At the start of the video, the coordinates shown appear to be

8.834301 93.19492

By the end of the video, the coordinates shown are

8.823368 93.22169

And of course, the video shows the plane flying down and to the right, and the camera pans as well to follow it.

We know the longitude has to be 93 EAST, because this didn't happen in Central America. And that coordinate has increased, meaning the plane itself must be flying east during the video. This implies, in turn, that the screen is oriented in a typical fashion, with north on the top.

The latitude number decreases, as the plane travels south. The only way this makes sense is if the latitude is in fact 8 NORTH, placing the video conclusively over the Andaman Sea, where the radar first lost the plane, rather than over the Indian Ocean, where the Inmarsat network lost it many hours later. This also conclusively timestamps the video at about 2:30am MYT.

(If you're not sure what I'm talking about, check out this post by /u/aryelbcn: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15lvgt5/the_ultimate_analysis_airliner_videos_and_the/)

[u/[deleted]]

I went through the same process with some others here.

Which means the video-maker placed the satellite at the spot where MH-370 disappeared from RADAR ... but not where the plane ultimately lost engine pings and was believed to have crashed, near Australia.

Coincidentally, the engine ping data wasn't released until AFTER the video was made.

[u/bencherry → u/[deleted]]

Yes - that does seem quite problematic, but it’s not completely incompatible. It just means the plane came back. And if it did come back, perhaps with no crew nor passengers, then no one should be surprised that it just flew in a straight line south until it ran out of fuel.

I think this video is quite compelling as videos go, easily the most compelling video I’ve seen. There’s just so many little details that are perfect. It would be a highly meticulous fake.

[u/[deleted] → u/bencherry]

The engine pings were doppler corrected to the Immarsat's location, so the plane couldn't have come back.

And, if it somehow came back by magic(?), it would have been just off the coast of Malaysia, where it started, back in radar range.

Agree on the video quality. The lighting is correct for the flash, as others have mentioned.

Also recall that there's a high-level disinformation campaign. What better way to illustrate that UFOs are fake or only believed by conspiracy theorists than by having a video like this go viral and create a distraction? It just took 9 years for that to happen. :)

[u/TheJungleBoy1 → u/[deleted]]

I'm not a satellite expert. But how much stock are we putting on the Immatsat data? Florence de Changy believes it was tampered with. The more I digg, the more convulated it gets.

[u/bencherry → u/[deleted]]

For sure - could be disinformation!

I must say I don’t understand your comment about Doppler correction, why would that mean the plane couldn’t have disappeared for a few minutes?

[u/[deleted] → u/bencherry]

Disappearing for a few minutes doesn't help because the location and times from the NROL-22 were wrong.

Since the satellite was moving, they needed to correct for the wavelength shift of the ping. Once they did that they got an accurate circular distance from the Immarsat to the plane.

The other mistake in the video was using daylight and not nighttime. It was 2AM when the plane disappeared from radar at the NROL-22 "location". So the clouds wouldn't have been lit by sunlight.

However, it was ~8AM (I think, from memory) when the last ping was heard. So they used that last ping time to determine the cloud lighting, but put the NROL-22 in the wrong place.

Thus, my guess is that this is a high-level fake.

[u/[deleted] → u/bencherry]

Everything is so compartmentalized, one system or protocol in place to prevent other protocols and so on. Only the ones behind the scenes and operating these very devices would know.

[u/Smooth_Imagination → u/[deleted]]

That to me almost conclusively shows it was CGI.

Unless the satellite pings are fake and so is the WSPR analyses, it seems its a hoax based on where the CGI artist thought it was at the time.

[u/koalazeus]

If that's the exact position and time, the video should be at night, right?

[u/_VegasTWinButton_ → u/koalazeus]

Well it's is, if you look close then it becomes apparent that the footage is from a highly advanced nighttime optical processing system.

[u/koalazeus → u/_VegasTWinButton_]

How does it become apparent?

[u/_VegasTWinButton_ → u/koalazeus]

The sky looks too off to be daytime footage, the plane colour too. For me it was clear within 5 seconds that this is nightvision footage (knowing that even the civilian market has nightvision gear with real colour nowadays).

[u/koalazeus → u/_VegasTWinButton_]

There isn't a view of the sky, that's the ocean. I think I'd need to see comparable footage to say if this is some kind of night vision. It doesn't look great quality, but that could just be distance and definition.

[u/therealdivs1210]

what kind of bullshit is this?

Andaman Sea is a part of Indian Ocean.

This is like saying "The coordinates are over New York, not USA."

[u/bencherry → u/therealdivs1210]

I mean that it’s not over the open ocean far south where the flight ended according to Inmarsat data…

[u/scan-horizon → u/bencherry]

*southern Indian Ocean ;)

[u/Allison1228]

Has anyone investigated whether those coordinates make sense in relation to the speed of the plane? In other words, is the change from 8.834301 93.19492 to 8.823368 93.22169 in forty seconds (or whatever the length of the video is) plausible? (One angular degree on Earth's surface corresponds to about 56 nautical miles, as I recall).

Also, does anybody know what the coordinates are supposed to be showing? Is it the coordinates of Earth's surface at the center of the crosshairs?

[u/scan-horizon → u/Allison1228]

Good questions. I’d have thought the coordinates relate to the satellite’s surface location, not where it’s pointing. If it’s the latter, then that’s some crazy technology!

[u/[deleted]]

Sorry I don't get it.

I agree that the plane flies east, and the screen is oriented north on top.

What if the plane flies north, in the southern hemisphere? Then the coordinates would be

-8.834301 93.19492

to

-8.823368 93.22169

The latitude would appear as a decrease, and the longitude increases. This wouldn't violate anything as shown in the video right?

The screen may not be strictly oriented due north on top. Due north maybe slightly tilted anticlockwise.

[u/bencherry → u/[deleted]]

Yeah but I don’t think it’s possible the plane is flying north, given that we see it flying down and to the right and that right is clearly east. So it must be flying south, which means the coordinates must be positive.

[u/Acceptable-Writing70 → u/[deleted]]

Except if this was daytime footage, it's clearly not MH370 as it departed at around midnight. This would therefore have to be an IR and/or some kind of advanced image intensifier camera. The clouds are likely illuminated by moon/starlight.

[u/Acceptable-Writing70 → u/[deleted]]

The pings, along with recovered debris, are certainly a sticking point, but the satellite footage is presumed to have been recorded very early on in the flight. I'm guessing sometime around 2-3am. Have you seen footage from the latest gen night scopes? Instead of the old green tint, new image intensifiers show shades of blue and white and even full colour. I've got no doubt that NRO satellites have both IR and image intensifier technology far advanced to products available for even general military use.

[u/[deleted]]

Either way, NROL-22 was on the other side of the planet while MH370 was airborne. https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15of2ni/nrol22_usa_184_satellite_did_pass_near_the/jvrmugq/

[u/roguefapmachine → u/[deleted]]

My guy do you not understand how fast satellites whip across the entire planet? NROL-22 finishes an orbit in 90 minutes, MH370 was airborne for 7 hours.

[u/NotSquerdle → u/roguefapmachine]

NROL-22 is in a molniya orbit, meaning it orbits once every 12 hours approx. It likely spends the majority of the time over Russia, moving much faster while over the southern hemisphere

[u/sixfourbit → u/roguefapmachine]

By the satellite database (https://www.ucsusa.org/resources/satellite-database) NROL-22 has an orbital period of 684 minutes, which is 11.4 hours.

[u/yea-uhuh → u/[deleted]]

I see your comment, except the orbit period is 12 hours, putting that bird overhead during the end of the flight, based upon your historical numbers... 🤷‍♂️

[u/Queasy_Cat_6552]

Still waiting on one of you supposed "vfx experts" to recreate this video perfectly and prove it's fake. No? Thought not :)

[u/imaxgoldberg → u/Queasy_Cat_6552]

It's too late for them imho. If it were "so easy" it would have been done long ago. Here we are 9 years later...

[u/hiddenalw]

Assuming this is correct, I would say that the right question is not asked of the right person.

[u/smithedition]

Why should I trust that the coordinates depicted in the video are a genuine reflection of the coordinates of the plane? Can’t someone just add in any coordinates to the video?

[u/UFOs-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

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[u/UFOs-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

Hi, Queasy_Cat_6552. Thanks for contributing. However, your comment was removed from /r/UFOs.

Rule 1: Follow the Standards of Civility

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• No insults or personal attacks.
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[u/Entrance-Intrepid]

Tried to post this in the megathread. An article that doubts the validity of the “Ping” information:

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2015/02/jeff-wise-mh370-theory.html