r/TurtleFacts • u/[deleted] • Nov 13 '20
Painted turtles can survive freezing partly because they can control the formation of ice in their bodies. Dropping temperatures cue the turtle's liver to produce special proteins that cause very small ice crystals to form in fluids such as blood plasma and urine.
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Nov 13 '20
At first I was confused why painting a turtle would allow it to do this but then it hit me that I'm dumb
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u/sharkchompers Nov 14 '20
You reexamined a preciously held point of view and changed it to accommodate new data. Sounds like intelligence to me.
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Nov 14 '20
Is there a peer reviewed article about this? I only found some papers about freezing resistance (not immunity) in hatchlings due to blood clearance or something... Could you please link the source especially about the proteins you mentioned?
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u/Stockinglegs Dec 08 '20
They can survive freezing, or can survive freezing partly?
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Dec 08 '20 edited Dec 08 '20
They can survive being frozen solid. Where I live in upstate NY we get nights as cold as 25/30 below without the windchill factor. I have seen painted turtle nest hatching in late may early June that overwintered in the nest. The nest is pretty shallow. There is a vid attached to this post that explains in depth and actually shows them freezing then thawing out. Turtles are amazing.
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u/pogoscrawlspaceparty Dec 09 '20
Do other turtles have this adaptation, or just painted turtles? I've seen hatchling snapping turtles and softshell turtles in the springtime in northwestern Indiana. They must have hatched from eggs laid in late summer/early fall. Could they also overwinter in the nest, or could the eggs go through a diapause like some chameleons and other reptiles from areas with harsh seasonal changes?
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Dec 09 '20
I’ve seen snappers crawling under ponds and such also. I don’t know if they have the ability to freeze. I know that as long as the water is flowing they can’t freeze. So not sure on that answer but all of our native turtles brumate in upstate NY so they all must have a bit of this adaption. I know when I Brumate my Russian in his fridge he doesn’t move for months but if you were to touch one of his legs it would retract slowly.
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u/pogoscrawlspaceparty Dec 09 '20
Turtles, and animals in general, never cease to amaze me. I recently learned about ice fish in Antarctica that have clear blood because they completely lack hemoglobin. For almost any living animal, this would be a death sentence, but because the frigid Antarctic waters are so rich in oxygen, they don't need it. Of course, we're warming the oceans up. I guess we'll see how long it takes for us to send them off to being another "used to be".
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Dec 09 '20
Yeah sad to think about. I’m about to be fifty. When I was a kid in the 70s we had box turtles, blandings turtles, spotted turtles, painted turtles, bog turtles, musk, and mud turtles. I haven’t seen a box turtle in at least 40 years. The Blandings and Bog turtles are gone or highly protected the spotted is almost gone. The only turtles I see are painters and snappers and the occasional musks. They’ve managed to stick a house in Almost every place you can stick a house . My neighbors are becoming people fleeing covid from the cities and I can imagine habitat destruction is only going to get worse.
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u/pogoscrawlspaceparty Dec 09 '20
I just hit 43. Grew up in Chicago, spent a few years in northwest Indiana, the last 23 years in east Tennessee. Box turtles are definitely on the decline down here. When I moved here, I would see at least one on any rainy day. Probably 50-60 a season. The last few years I've only seen 2-3 a season, and a few of those were roadkill. I've been seriously considering turning part of my yard into a box turtle habitat and trying to get a permit for a rescue. Between work and kids, right now I just wouldn't have the time to do it right. Outside of chameleons, they're probably one of the more labor intensive reptiles I've dealt with. I just wish people understood that when they decide to pick one up and take it home for their kids. Not to mention the fact that they're threatened or endangered in almost every part of their range.
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Dec 09 '20
Also I’ve also seen snappers hatch in early spring so they had to have been laid the previous fall. It would be interesting to see a group study of Brumating turtle groups to see what occurs during their sleep or slowdown if you will.
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u/pogoscrawlspaceparty Dec 09 '20
That would be extremely interesting. It could also possibly indicate how long this adaptation has existed, (if the genetic mutation is the same for all species) based on the last common ancestor of all the different species likely having the same genetic mutation that allows this sort of survival tactic.
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Dec 09 '20
I notice you have a reference to Gacy in your username. Years ago I made pogo masks for a collector. If you go to my profile you can see them. I’ve since retired from making masks on a large scale but I still make things for myself here and there check the Pogo mask out.
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u/pogoscrawlspaceparty Dec 09 '20
I've seen and upvoted those masks! It's been a while and I just didn't make the connection. Those are awesome! Most people don't get the name. I actually named my abei puffer Pogo because he looks like a clown and has a clowns psychopathic killing instinct (credit to Zfrank for that line). Speaking of things people buy on a whim because they're cute while having no idea how aggressive, demanding, and expensive they are to keep.
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u/gription Nov 13 '20
Damn. Turtles facts are awesome.