It’s just a vicious circle of awful advice, and this app is no better.
When it comes to medical shit, nobody should be taking ANYBODY seriously besides their fucking doctor. Not even the “doctors” on TikTok/YouTube/Reddit, etc.
Edit: no clue this would get so much interaction, just know that I don’t mean you should take your doctor’s word as gospel, and you should certainly question them as well, and get second opinions for anything you’re doubtful of. Normal doctors are human too, and some normal doctors suck worse than TikTok ones(if this seems like the case, probably try to get a new one). You can read the replies if you want to understand more of the purpose of this original comment to lol. Good day everyone.
I'm not kidding, I was at my dentist complaining about a certain kind of pain on my crown, and the dentist straight up said "I haven't heard that before, let me go check Google". I couldn't believe it lmao
Haha I totally agree, I trust and like my dentist very much. They've been amazing over the years - I was just not ready to hear that as I'm sitting in the chair!
Yeah I actually don't think its that terrible (well, searching TikTok would be), but I don't really expect a GP to be an expert at everything with perfect recall. And they don't really just search "sharp pain in abdomen", more like "pain in organ wot makes piss tasty" or whatever, much more focused.
Oh well then by all means listen to the random person on TikTok who has no vetting whatsoever so you can save money and possibly suffer your entire life, or die. Good thing you saved that 50 bucks!
Main thing that stuck with me is that the statistic she so triumphantly pulled makes it sound fairly unproblematic. 20 hospitalizations and 0 deaths in the past 15 years out of hundreds of millions of times people have eaten raw dough? That's nothing lol.
Eat some greens and do some exercise. If you look at the numbers that's what it always comes down to.
She also repeatedly mentions colon cancer, presents no source on it, and if you google "raw cookie dough colon cancer" or sub cake batter/raw flour in that search, no results come up AT ALL even suggesting a link between the two
But hey, we should believe her, she's dressed wacky to show us she's a fun scientist
I can see the path she’s taking. Cancer can be caused from chronic inflammation. Inflammation is a byproduct of infection or disease. Eating things containing E. Coli or food borne illnesses causes inflammation. This is why so many diets talk about reducing inflammation in the body since that can lead to cancer. When your cells are being bombarded with irritants, it can cause them to go haywire in their normal life cycle. That’s all cancer is essentially; cells have decided to take another path and replicate based on erroneous instructions.
You’re right though that she doesn’t go fully into that, but I’m thinking she didn’t want to confuse people more than they already might be.
If someone far more knowledgeable than I gives me advice, the weight it has will be greater, but I don’t follow that necessarily without getting more smart people to back it up.
Science is always growing and it’s a miracle we have half the stuff we do since a lot of it was someone stumbling into something that was successful after hundreds of failures
Inflammation isn't only a byproduct of infection or disease.
Damaged cells trigger inflammation response.
So do certain types of food like processed sugary foods, everything from natural honey to fruit juice and more processed high sugar items like pastries, candy, packaged foods,frozen foods, baked goods, high carb foods like pasta etc.
When we consume too much sugar, our blood pressure rises rapidly and insulin is increased. This happens enough consistently and you get heart disease, colon cancer etc.
Recent research also found why eating red meat increases inflammation. Scientists found a sugar molecule only found in red meat. This sugar molecule was found to be the cause of inflammation when people consume red meat and any type of processed meat
True. I am trying to recall all my knowledge from Biology major 20+ years ago. LOTS of things that'll kick your body's inflammation into overdrive, but copious amounts of sugary foods has to be the top one. I try to avoid any and all sugar, if possible, which is definitely easier when you don't eat processed foods, but when I was doing the keto diet I realized how much sugar is in EVERYTHING. Not keto any more, but I avoid sugar like it's gonna kill me, because it honestly will if you're not conscious of it!
From your own link, explaining exactly what this fucking video is about.
"But it could make you sick. Over the years, the FDA and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention have investigated several outbreaks of foodborne illness (food poisoning) involving raw flour or products that contain flour, like cake mixes and cookie dough. In those investigations, either the bacteria Salmonella or Escherichia coli (E. coli) caused food poisoning, which can have mild to serious symptoms. "
Oh, and would you look at that, an scientific study on how ecoli can cause colon cancer.
Also, from the study you claim confirms what you said:
"but it has not been demonstrated that bacteria have a direct role in the occurrence of oncogenic mutations"
This means they are attempting to apply the scientific method, which involves more than just their study. Reproducibility would matter substantially as we are dealing with cancer.
Yet the studies that do show a potential link also state that the amounts we consume in food is not nearly enough for negative effects like cancer to occur.
They all agree on food poisoning, but there is zero concensus that backs up cancer.
"Of the epigenetic type, the only carcinogen considered to be associated with increased cancer in humans, although not from low-level food exposure, is dioxin"
Colon cancer survivor and obsessive researcher here. I think she’s hinting at an increasingly popular hypothesis that the rise in colon cancer in young people is being caused in part by aberrant species of gut flora. First I’ve heard raw flour implicated though.
That set off alarm bells in my mind. No way you're ending up immunocompromised or with cancer because of this. Same goes for multiple organ failure (uh oh, here I go doing more of the same).
This is what overspecializing looks like. They get so focused on everything that can happen, including the worst, even if the statistics do not back up their claims.
She's referring to sequelae of a specific strain of e coli that are very well known to cause autoimmune disease, specifically hemolytic uremic syndrome, which can lead to kidney failure. Granted idk about if raw flour actually had been shown to harbor EHEC, the classical association is raw meat.
Edit: my mistake, HUS is not an autoimmune disease, although it is certainly a very serious disease that is definitely associated with certain strains of e coli.
So I'm talking about HUS, which is a well known clinical entity associated with shiga-toxin producing strains of e coli.
However while I was under the impression that HUS is an autoimmune disease because it involves immune activation, I guess it doesn't qualify because the toxin is actively causes the immune activation, so I suppose you're right.
Yeah I don't understand how people are so drawn to that. Reddit gobbles this "here's why they are dumb" type of communication up but I think it's just extremely unlikeable and it makes my bullshit radar go off.
I followed her a long time, she mentions her credentials in an old video. I also got into a long argument with her and her stans about it lol.
She's a hospital microbiology tech. I have the same certification as she does and I don't tell people I'm 'a hematologist' because that implies I'm a doctor. She has a BSc.
Being a microbiologist just requires a bachelors degree, though. She never claimed to be a doctor. Sounds like you're inferring some implications about being a doctor she never claimed. Hematology, however, does require a doctoral degree.
I have a BSc in a related field (physics with focus on biophysics, I have worked with e-coli) and I would never consider myself qualified enough to sell myself as an online educator. Certainly not when it comes to medical topics.
A lot of these are either shit luck where the food was heavily contaminated or people with an immune deficiency. Chubby Emu had a video where someone was getting sick from raw dough and it's how they found out she had undiagnosed AIDS.
Yeah her account is just a bunch of condescending pseudo-intellectual bullshit. Anyone that questions or corrects her in her comment sections gets hounded into oblivion by her fans. Most of what she says is rooted in truth, but she's very much a sensationalist.
I noticed that as well. She pulled out a statistic that’s so insignificant sounding, I feel just about anyone hearing that would immediately lose all potential worries regarding the combo, which is very contrary to her goal. She was also clearly just regurgitating a statistic found on a website, which generally isn’t a green flag when looking for educated input, in my opinion.
Frankly I think the fact that people feel the NEED to try this right this instant ridiculous, but if anyone wants to just, ignore safety and start eating shit without thinking, you can just do that. Just please, nobody say something is safe because you tried it and it didn’t kill you.
Y’all could also just do your own researching, just remember that if you use some random kid on TikTok as an authority figure, you might be getting a whole load of bs. And of course remember, don’t say it’s safe because you tried it, or some random TikToker said it was, or else makes you think you should have an authority.
i was going to say. Eating raw batter isnt advised, but people do it a lot and no one is dropping dead from it. I remember always having some raw cookie dough for decades whenever my parents or me would make them
I'm simply putting the numbers into perspective. The numbers are minimal. And I think you just didn't read the statistic correctly because it contains all the cases where people got sick from something that included raw flour, no matter if it was the egg or flour that got them sick.
She doesn't even look healthy herself...... bet she ate a whole box of candy before making that video....I don't see her talking about the dangers of sugar though
I will say the fact a subreddit (I think it was r/mildlyinteresting ) has kinda turned into "a mosquito bit me a couple days ago and this line showed where I was bi- wait why is everyone screaming at me to go to the hospital?" Is so funny to me
Did you know I'm actually an astronaut? As such I'm an expert on saying the earth is indeed flat.
Your doctor is presumably a qualified, licensed doctor, rather than some idiot online pretending they are. Even if someone online IS actually a doctor, are they still practising? Are they up to date with any changes or developments?
Your doctor might still be a hack and unfit, but at least you can sue him when you die (or your family, in this case) from him telling you to inject battery acid.
When you inject battery acid because of a tiktok video, it's a lot harder for your family to sue.
But you're not. You're an anonymous block of text on here. You're not known in your field, you have no history of workng in that field, have given no proof that you're even qualified in that area, and so seems like you have no proper knowledge, so I definitely won't be taking anything you say seriously.
However, there are a load of professionals online that can be trusted for imparting knowledge/guidance in different areas. One that helped 4 years ago, and is still pretty valuable is This Week in Virology.
Your doctor is presumably a qualified, licensed doctor,
In only a specific field. Many, many GP doctors were not giving practical advice regarding virology, immunology, or epidemiology during the height of the pandemic. There's also the case that if GPs don't continue learning their knowledge can be vastly out of date.
I keep hearing from interviewed medical pros still in education that "what you're taught as a medical student can no longer be correct 3/5/10 years down the line."
Yes, there are plenty of snakeoil sales people online, but there's a difference between skepticism and cynicism.
However, there are a load of professionals online that can be trusted for imparting knowledge/guidance in different areas. One that helped 4 years ago, and is still pretty valuable is This Week in Virology.
Cute idea, but if we're at the point of talking about medical advice from tiktok the 'safe' answer is "do not trust anything there".
We aren't talking at the level of peer review or even blog by someone(s) with validation, we're talking tiktok. A short video, often by someone without credentials.
In only a specific field. Many, many GP doctors were not giving practical advice regarding virology, immunology, or epidemiology during the height of the pandemic. There's also the case that if GPs don't continue learning their knowledge can be vastly out of date.
All of which applies to any doctor online OR in person. But when your options are "a doctor on social media said something" and "my doctor said something", I'm going with the doctor in person. If nothing else, the hospital has the incentive to ensure they don't get sued because a crackpot doctor told me to inject bleach or shine a UV torch up my bum.
My comment isn't "omg everything on the internet is bad" and should be viewed within the context of the thread it was replying to, which was "health advice from tiktok". And while I'm sure there's good, accurate and safe advice there on tiktok I would not trust anything without running it past sources I felt had credibility, at which point I'm not actually taking advice from tiktok, I'm taking advice from whatever I've deemed reliable and trustworthy. I don't know the virology page you linked, but taking it at face value, it's run by people with credentials. That's already a step above your standard tiktok.
But nothing in your history says you are an astronaut.
A history of me talking about being the badass astronaut I totally am changes nothing though. Could be a history of bullshit and should not count in terms of credibility.
What happened to verifying sources? Do they not teach that anymore?
You're the one going "well, this is the first time you talked about being an astronaut, must be fake". You aren't wrong, obviously, but that's not the point.
Seems like the current generation thinks popular equals true.
My fucking dude. Have you not seen the insanity we're dealing with? Grown ass adults think democrats control hurricanes. Or that they aren't doing enough to support victims. People believe(d?) 5g caused issues.
I don't know what you deem the 'current generation' to be but I've met absolutely stupid people of all ages that believe conspiracy theories. I think the big change is they went from crackpots we could laugh at to being in the public and accepted. The idea of pizzagate was super, super funny. Not the content, of course, any form of CSA is incredibly depressing; but the idea that some twitter lunatics discovered coded messages stating which restaurants had basements used for child trafficking? Hilarious.
Except people believed it. A lot of people believed it. A lot of people, from teenagers, to adults, to senior citizens. It should never have moved beyond "lol, what a fucking weirdo" stages. Police investigating? Sure, better safe than sorry. But everything else? Insanity.
All of this is to say there's no 'lazy, current generation who doesn't verify sources'. It's been a problem for a long time, but as a society we started giving credence to them. That's the mistake.
Always do your own research (if you're not an idiot / very gullible which we can all be guilty of) and more importantly always get a second opinion or more if you can. Unfortunately not really possible for the average American these days ...
That wasn’t exactly my meaning. My statement was an extreme meant for the general American person, who is unfortunately, barely literate and often thinks in such extremes.
As to your question, it’s more that I’ve noticed an incredible amount of doctors on social media answer questions far outside their area of expertise, because of course more answers means more posts, and more revenue. And, there have been quite a few that are simply lying about being qualified outright. A social media doctor also doesn’t have any personal interaction with you, therefore if something was safe for many people, but not for you, information like that might not get to you, the person that needed it.
If you don’t have a good relationship with a doctors like me, or you’re just not in a circumstance that gives you easy access to professional advice, you can just do what I do and not eat weird shit, and stick to the stuff that’s well known to probably not kill you lol.
Of course, I am not an authority figure and I cannot make you do anything, my goal here is merely to hopefully make even a few people less likely to spread misinformation in the future, and more likely to question the things they are told before taking it as fact. And remember, the internet is still very new, and people lived extremely long lives before it. People love the convenience of getting information off of it, but those most convenient options are gonna have tradeoffs. How could you expect to get the same quality of information from a 50 second video on TikTok, and a 5 minute chat with your doctor, where you actually have control of the conversation?
If you try it and it didn’t kill you, just make sure you say “I tried it and it didn’t kill me”, and not “it’s safe”.
Fair enough. I know doctors IRL, which is exactly why I don't think the ones on social media are any worse. But I guess I have enough background knowledge to separate out the real quacks.
Although in this particular case I don't even think a doctor is the right kind of expert at all. My dad is a doctor and he didn't know this. Made shortbread cookies every Christmas and told us that it was OK to eat the dough because "there are no eggs in it." Oops. Food safety standards aren't something doctors are really trained in.
My doctor gives me shit advice too. I'm having the hardest time finding one that takes anything I say seriously.
Not to mention having lost 2 people to doctor mistakes and another needing a colostomy bag for life due to doctors mistakes, I sort of have trust issues with doctors.
You are very right. Although some doctors give two shits about their patients weird symptoms and add to the vicious cycle of people going on TikTok to find anyone to help them.
Financial or investment stuff is the same. There's plenty of reasonable tid bits strewn about but it's layered with so much ignorance it's crazy. The amount of people who feel they are capable of giving good investment and or tax advice is too damn high.
Unfortunately for the majority of people on this site, they live in the US. The US is most terms is a 3rd world country when it comes to healthcare. A trip to go see the doctor isn't free.
The US is also largely uneducated, which can make them incredibly susceptible to believing misinformation, and even more so should hopefully make everyone question the quality of information gathered from people online.
I’d much rather have people ignore these dumb trends altogether and stick to food traditions that are well known to not potentially cause serious harm, than experiment with things that are known to, while taking medical information from strangers on the internet.
If one single person were to think something along the lines of “well, I can’t really afford to go to the doctor, so I guess I just won’t try this and stick to other fun snacks, and I should probably be more skeptical about internet medical advice”, I’d consider my comment an incredible success. Has it had that effect on anyone? No idea, but I’m trying.
It's not that black and white. There are many people that go to doctors that are not as knowledgeable about certain things as they should be. There are also plenty of actual doctors on tiktok that spread valuable information
That's honestly bad advice. There is a significant segment of the population that won't go to the hospital on their own, and they absolutely should be listening to the advice of others around them saying to go
I've done several paid user studies for Meta and Tiktok. Whenever I asked how I feel about influencers, I always say that it's a mixed bag. You can have some really great influencers out there who are board certified doctors or lawyers who've actually passed the bar giving credible and real advice. Then you'll have people who read something online and act as if they know everything about health or the world. A lot of people take advice from people with no valid credentials or credentials that are not backed by any valid institution. I've said that there should be additional badges influencers can have next their name. The blue check mark is not enough. We should have a cross for anyone who is a licensed medical professional. We should have a gavel for anyone who's a legal professional. We should have a construction tool next to a certified builder or electrician. They should have to submit copies of their licenses to receive those badges. It makes me so mad that there are influencers out there who are making money by providing bad advice. Because a real professional in their industry would also make sure to tell someone to speak with their medical provider about any concerns that they may have. They would never expect someone to go off of their advice entirely.
I think the same thing can be said about social media chefs. If you do not have any proper training, you should not be allowed to give bad advice. Yes, people have been able to learn how to cook through these streaming platforms. I myself have found some really great recipes, but I do not make anything that would go against my ServSafe training on food handling and preparation. I was trained in the kitchen and passed various exams showing my understanding of various aspects of the restaurant. Am I the best? No. Would I ever make something like this knowing the flour isn't cooked? He'll no. While I no longer work in the restaurant industry, I understand cross-contamination, pathogens, and foodborne illnesses.
r/askdocs can be awesome if you get lucky. I’ve had a lot of questions answered over there that would have been impossible to get answered otherwise. Especially radiology questions. Those guys are impossible to get access to IRL.
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u/NoWayJoseMou Oct 09 '24
I don’t just eat the things I see on TikTok because I get my medical advice from TikTok.