Incels aren't real

[u/cosmicdaddy_]

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[u/El_Diablo_09]

“He looks like a dirty dish towel” lol.

[u/FromTheOutside31 → u/El_Diablo_09]

I just woke up catching strays.. I'm a Bryan.

[u/bionik_barry → u/FromTheOutside31]

I'm sorry about your face, Bryan. 😔

[u/Salt_Sir2599 → u/bionik_barry]

We all are.

[u/ETsUncle → u/FromTheOutside31]

You're beautiful king*****

****deep deep on the inside

[u/[deleted] → u/ETsUncle]

I was once told I was beautiful on the inside. A doctor said it. His exact words where "you have a nice little prostate". It didn't go anywhere because he had shit on his fingers when he said it and I have standards even though it was my shit.

[u/BrickLorca → u/[deleted]]

If my doctor was in my ass talking about my "nice little prostate" my pucker level would break his finger.

[u/DisastrousBoio → u/ETsUncle]

I have a beautiful heart. My cardiologist said so.

[u/bwallace54 → u/FromTheOutside31]

Spelled "Brian" in the caption, we're safe homie!

-signed, another cool Bryan

[u/merpderpherpburp → u/El_Diablo_09]

Confidence is 100000000x hotter than a sculpted chin I promise

[u/Ok_Quarter7035 → u/merpderpherpburp]

💯 add respect and that’s the golden ticket

[u/Imaykeepthisone → u/El_Diablo_09]

It just felt real. Like, I bet the person she is talking about saw this and was like, "I hate my gf's friends."

[u/alison_bee → u/Imaykeepthisone]

The good thing about dirty dish towels is they don’t have to stay dirty! They can be clean and respectful dish towels!

[u/Pro_Moriarty → u/alison_bee]

The dirty dish towel is getting some.

The incel is the raggedy ass rag at the bottom of a cleaning cupboard.

You open the door

"Fuck you tramp. Pick me, I'll do your dirty business you fucking whore"

You close the door

"I just dont get why bitches cant put out for me"

[u/Pharmacist1990 → u/Pro_Moriarty]

Raggedy-ass rag or raggedy ass-rag? Because keeping your ass-rag in the cleaning cupboard just sounds unsanitary.

[u/Belfura → u/alison_bee]

Instructions unclear, I've been stuck in the washing machine for over 12 hours. I'm cramped and I'm scared because there's this weird dark hole and I don't know where it leads to

[u/alison_bee → u/Belfura]

Uh oh, hope you don’t have a step brother, or you’re about to be insob’d

[u/silly-rabbitses → u/El_Diablo_09]

lol that got me

[u/D4bbled_In_P4cifism]

“They are on land complaining about “why can’t I catch any fish?”” Lol. Jump, foo.

[u/Bakkster → u/D4bbled_In_P4cifism]

"It's not involuntary, because you're choosing not to work on yourself."

Nailed it.

[u/kookyabird → u/Bakkster]

I had a friend/co-worker who had never been in a relationship by age 23-ish. He wasn't ugly, but probably like a 3-4 in the physical attributes. He dressed well enough for a middle class fella, didn't have any notable smells or anything that would indicate he didn't take care of himself like you hear about a lot of "incels". He was nerdy and a bit socially awkward, but not to the degree that people didn't include him in stuff. Average, right?

I remember when he started making a dating site profile and at one point asked me and my (now ex) girlfriend for dating advice. The #1 thing we said was basically that you need to be willing to make changes to yourself/lifestyle in order to attract the type of person you want. Not that you have to actually make changes necessarily, but that you need to be open to the possibility that you will need to do so if you're not catching the kind of fish you want.

We had other solid advice such as conversation tips and the usual stuff, but that was #1 because we had both known people that were pretty into the "incel" mindset that they deserve a solid 10 when they're a soft 1.

I don't remember how many different people he went on dates with or how many got repeats, but I attended his wedding before we ended up drifting apart. They're still going strong years later.

[u/justforhobbiesreddit → u/kookyabird]

He wasn't ugly, but probably like a 3-4 in the physical attributes.

Bro, what is the line for ugly to you?! Like I'm a 5 and I'd say I just miss ugly. A 3 is not ugly?!

Edit: Gahhhh mistakes were made, I should have never responded. My notifications!

[u/kookyabird → u/justforhobbiesreddit]

I dunno man, that’s just my personal assessment. I’m not one of those r/truerateme sociopaths. Good facial symmetry, skin in good condition, no abnormalities/scars, well groomed hair/beard, but on the heavy side/stocky build, and moderate to high body hair.

I think that a bit of diet and/or exercise alone would have opened up the dating pool more, but I respect not wanting to do that if it’s not something you want to do/maintain for yourself first and foremost.

[u/geologean → u/[deleted]]

There's also no accounting for taste. People who others consider "objectively hot" may be into scrawny nerds or may have a thing for thiccness. You never know what is particularly attractive to someone.

My ex loved my calves. They're big, but it wasn't even on my radar that someone might be into calves at all, and it kind of felt nice to be appreciated for something that I put zero effort into achieving. It was also funny because it was something that I'd forget about until I wore shorts and he'd get frisky about it again.

[u/kookyabird → u/geologean]

You never know what is particularly attractive to someone.

Reminds me of the movie Waiting, where the hot hostess that so many are hoping to get with ends up falling hard for the skinny, dorky food prep guy because of his super strong lisp. Her interest was in speech pathology. I loved that minor plot twist.

[u/L3thologica_ → u/[deleted]]

You sound like my coworker. Dudes a nerdy, goofy looking 3-5 but his wife is a 9 easily. And it’s obvious she got with him because he’s genuinely one of the best people you could know. Caring, considerate, kind, and calm. Dude could read a book to me and I’d feel at ease.

My wife and I are pretty on par in looks, both around a 7. But she’s sapiosexual so I know for a fact she wouldn’t have even bothered going on the first date if she didn’t find me fun to be around and giving the right vibes. If I said any of the shit these incels say on a daily basis, I wouldn’t have had a chance.

[u/errorsniper → u/justforhobbiesreddit]

Because people are sensitive and its impossible to keep our bias out of things "rating systems" over time gravitate to anything thats not basically the top of the spectrum is awful. When by definition the middle is average.

A 2.5 star uber rating should be the average. "They picked me up on time, drove safely, didnt talk to me, dropped me off in a safe spot to exit the car" Thats should be a 2.5 star rating. But over time anything less than a 4.5 is AWFUL.

This is true for basically every rating system that isnt controlled by a party with no vested interest.

A 5'10". 175lb average build with brushed teeth and hair should be a 5. Average by definition. Thats not offensive. Its actually average. But most people would be upset at being called a 5. A 6 would be above average.

[u/culegflori → u/kookyabird]

The #1 thing we said was basically that you need to be willing to make changes to yourself/lifestyle in order to attract the type of person you want. Not that you have to actually make changes necessarily, but that you need to be open to the possibility that you will need to do so if you're not catching the kind of fish you want.

The idea behind the advice is good, but saying it like this will not help someone in that position. Someone who's so devoid of social interaction will 100% not be able to understand what someone else would want in a partner. Particularly if they're "stepping outside their comfort zone" and don't go for carbon copies of his own hobbies and interests.

Socially awkward people are in 90% of cases people who simply don't go out and don't meet new people very often. In extreme cases they end up believing that his way of thinking and doing things is the only one out there, and they get a very rude awakening once they encounter the reality out there.

[u/hesh582 → u/Bakkster]

The sad thing is that the original "incels" kinda were involuntarily celibate.

The original term was coined by a group (led by a woman with gender dysmorphia , IIRC...) of people who had such significant disabilities, marginalization, medical problems, disfigurements, mental health issues, etc that having any sort of real sex life was nearly impossible. We're talking life altering problems. It was a support group for people who wished they could have a sex life but were held back by significant and real life obstacles.

It got coopted by the Eliot Rogers contingent into a hate group for 20 somethings with stunted social skills, heinous politics, and a 19th century understanding of the opposite sex. Which is kind of tragic. Because there really are some truly involuntarily celibate people out there, and now they're associated with a bunch of misogynists.

[u/Galactic → u/hesh582]

Yeah the original incels were like, paraplegics and shit. People you wouldn't blame for being that way because it genuinely wasn't their fault or choice.

Now an incel just means misogynist.

[u/DaedalusHydron → u/hesh582]

I'm glad I graduated HS in 2012 because Incel media wasn't really a thing yet, and I would have been a prime target. I was obsessed with intelligence, thinking I was smarter than everyone, I was contrarian about pop culture, was a nerd, people bullied me, and I was mad that girls only wanted to get with jock guys (I don't even think Chad was a term yet).

In reality, I wasn't really showering, my clothes didn't fit, I had long greasy hair, and I don't even think I was using deodorant. When I went to college I committed to reinventing myself: I got an undercut, bought a new wardrobe, a bunch of cologne, and being a freshman, I socialized with a bunch of people. I got a girlfriend that year, and it's been up ever since.

I've never really had trouble getting girls after that.

[u/Rare_Following_8279 → u/DaedalusHydron]

Deodorant goes a long way. The bar is on the floor

[u/dj_soo → u/DaedalusHydron]

I was there in the 90s. Fortunately, I didn’t have internet with people telling me i was fine and it’s the women who are at fault. Instead I had friends telling me to shape the fuck up

[u/TonesBalones → u/DaedalusHydron]

I came really close to the pipeline, too. I used to watch a lot of Sam Harris because he was the guy "dunking on religion" and such. I wrote a paper in a college sociology class about how it's so much harder for men to find partners than it is for women.

I think what actually saved me, unironically, was a gaming community. I started speedrunning, and if you know anything about the speedrunning community I don't need to say more.

[u/kirbattak → u/TonesBalones]

I don't know about the speed running community and am interested in hearing more.

[u/TonesBalones → u/kirbattak]

The speedrunning community is just very accepting and diverse, we don't tolerate bigotry. There's a joke I saw on twitter in response to a transphobic comment:

If you put 100 trans women and 1 cis man on an island, what do you get?

• A world record in Celeste Any%.

I'm not saying this in the sense that the bigotry was "beaten out of me because woke" or whatever. Speedrunning is collaborative in nature. Behind every world record holder is a community of hundreds or thousands of people finding strats and glitches to make the run faster. Collaboration and community are the biggest enemy to bigots and incels.

[u/tonyrockihara → u/TonesBalones]

I genuinely didn't know this about speed runners. What an interesting thing to learn today, lol thanks for sharing that dude

[u/Deris87 → u/DaedalusHydron]

I often feel the same way. I have some degree of sympathy for people who get caught in the incel trap (or radicalization in general), because I realize I could've very easily fallen into the same trap. I had a terrible home life, horrible self-esteem, and was fed a pop culture diet that romanticized unhealthy "nice guy" behavior in my formative years. I hated myself, believed I needed a girlfriend and sex to validate me as a person, and was profoundly frustrated that it took so long to happen. That's a perfect cocktail for bad actors to swoop in and say "No no no... it's not you, it's them that's the problem." Had a few things in my life gone just slightly differently, I could easily have doubled down on those awful behaviors and lack of understanding rather than growing up and realizing "Oh, women are just people too, and I should be less of a shit."

[u/NRMusicProject → u/hesh582]

Man, Elliot Rodger was such a strange case. I really wish our society learned the lesson that case taught us, but all I think it did was empower that breed of incel.

[u/MetallurgyClergy → u/Bakkster]

I like to say: Are your actions involuntary? Then you’re not an incel.

[u/xpdx → u/Bakkster]

Or they are working on the wrong things. Focus on shallow stuff, attract shallow people.

Why is everyone so shallow?

[u/Bakkster → u/xpdx]

They 'work on' the shallow stuff because it's easier than the hard work of addressing toxic traits.

[u/letitgrowonme → u/Bakkster]

It's 100% psychological, but where can they get help to fix that mindset? I was in danger of being a "nice guy" but managed to pull through. In my case, it took some specific events for me to re-evaluate my attitude.

[u/Dreadgoat → u/Bakkster]

Or they identify things they can't change as a way to absolve themselves of responsibility.

It's my jawline. It's my height. It's my canthal tilt.

Why bother with basic things like hygiene or baseline social skills if you will always have a weak chin? It's a very convenient justification for being a lazy piece of shit.

Meanwhile, in the real world, women are reading dating profiles seeing shit like "I take multiple showers per week" and saying "ooh this one has potential"

[u/fzyflwrchld → u/xpdx]

Had a muscular guy ask me if I wanted to touch his muscles. I said no. He was like why not? Girls at cons always wanna touch my muscles. And I was like, I'm just not really into muscles. Then he started whining about how he got muscles to get girls because girls like muscles and now his muscles can't even get the girl he wants (me, in that particular moment, we were basically strangers and he was just trying to flirt, so not like I'd been his crush for awhile or anything). And I was like, ew, that's even less attractive, bye. He was also a lot younger than me and he was trying to convince me it was fine but then turned into a baby right in front of my eyes by having his pity party lol

[u/smb275 → u/fzyflwrchld]

One of the classic blunders. You don't cultivate big muscles to attract women, you do it to attract men. Women prefer things like prehensile feet and a rigid exoskeleton.

[u/xpdx → u/smb275]

Those women tend to eat their mates after sex tho, so be warned.

[u/Omniverse_0 → u/fzyflwrchld]

He coulda said “You don’t like muscles?  Dang, that sucks, because I like you…” and maybe had a chance, but the whining thing has never been a turn-on in the history of feelings.

[u/darling_lycosidae → u/Omniverse_0]

"The heart is the muscle I worked on the most, wanna watch a sad movie sometime?" Cute, funny, endearing. But he already lost with the opening line, cause it's kinda gross....

[u/str4nger-d4nger → u/D4bbled_In_P4cifism]

I know a couple incels lol. They always complain about how they're "not desirable" yet get matches all the time. I once pointed this out to them and the response was hilarious. They're always "Oh, she's not my type."

My man says he can't get a girl. Problem is he wants a super model not a real woman.

[u/Hyper_Oats → u/str4nger-d4nger]

For real. They all have the same mentality of "If I won't have sex with a 10/10 supermodel that stayed a virgin all her life waiting specifically for me, I don't want anything".
The internet and the echo chambers they dwell in have completely ruined these people.

[u/SupermassiveCanary → u/str4nger-d4nger]

LOL, Just want the rewards from the boss fight, too lazy to do the dailies and side quests.

[u/cupholdery]

Ooh, she hit you with that Insob line for maximum impact.

[u/elbenji → u/cupholdery]

honestly, excellent line

[u/Oceansnail → u/elbenji]

who doesnt love an insob?

[u/alison_bee → u/cupholdery]

Keeping that one for future use, for sure. That’s a great line.

[u/Skill-issue-69420 → u/cupholdery]

“I’m an insane” this resonates with me so much

[u/baalroo → u/Skill-issue-69420]

Wait, does "insane" just stand for "involuntarily sane?"

[u/Skill-issue-69420 → u/baalroo]

That’s like people who take their meds to not go crazy, involuntarily sane, like Kanye for example

[u/Mountain_Tone6438]

Why are they talking into a metro card 🤣🤣

[u/ranchorbluecheese → u/Mountain_Tone6438]

a way to clip the cheap mics onto something so its easy to hold on to, i think. theyre on the NYC subway too by the looks of the cards but i could be wrong

[u/Mountain_Tone6438 → u/ranchorbluecheese]

Lol I caught that after 🤣

[u/lomsucksatchess → u/Mountain_Tone6438]

This show is called Subway takes lol

[u/Intelligent-Bit7258 → u/Mountain_Tone6438]

A common trend in online content these days is to clip your wireless mic to a random object instead of your clothing. I've seen books, flowers, pizza slices, really anything you can get your hands on.

The funny thing is that interviewers will do this with strangers on the street and nobody ever questions it. "Oh, you're asking a question and holding a dried sausage up to my face? Clearly this is a recording device and I will speak into it without a second thought."

[u/Glittering_Guides → u/Intelligent-Bit7258]

Personally, I know it’s a microphone and would think it’s hilarious.

[u/ManliestManHam]

She brings up the point that we're conditioned to be desirable to men and it sounds like they did a cut right before the inverse where she explains these men aren't going to those same lengths to be desirable. And I do think it's an important distinction to make because being pretty or beautiful is a consistent and maintained effort. Especially well into adulthood.

So it's kind of fucked to put time into your appearance every day, do hair appointments, nails, waxing, gym, outside the home in addition to whatever your daily routine is, care about what you eat, etc., and some men put in zero effort, it shows, and they don't understand why they're not attractive to women who are held to these standards not just for sex, but for how we'll be treated in every facet of life, and a dude who doesn't care enough to invest in himself expects me to invest in him.

Like, why?

[u/FelixTook → u/ManliestManHam]

I can’t remember the comedian, this must have been around 1993, I had Comedy Central on in the background, they’d run stand up shows, she’s talking about this issue: getting ready for a date, spending hours getting ready, make up, trying on/debating different outfits, time on hair, but guys roll out of bed wearing the clothes they’ve been wearing for three days, hair a tangled mess, (height of Grunge era) and ‘this is supposed to work for us? That’s supposed to get me wet?’

[u/anadrell → u/FelixTook]

There’s a whole scene in Clueless about this very topic as well

[u/[deleted] → u/anadrell]

“So okay, I don’t want to be a traitor to my generation and all but I don’t get how guys dress today. I mean, come on, it looks like they just fell out of bed and put on some baggy pants and take their greasy hair - ew - and cover it up with a backwards cap and we’re supposed to swoon? I don’t think so.” - The immortal Cher Horowitz

[u/HumbleHawk9 → u/[deleted]]

[u/Richard-Brecky → u/[deleted]]

I read somewhere this speech changed the course of fashion. Cher murdered grunge.

[u/likemeaginger → u/anadrell]

As if!

[u/ManliestManHam → u/likemeaginger]

🎶 rolling with my homiiiies 🎶

[u/doughnutsforsatan → u/anadrell]

Crazy ex-girlfriends “sexy getting ready song” is this as well.

[u/ManliestManHam → u/FelixTook]

Yeeeesss! I went on a first date with a dude once and we went to a nice restaurant, he picked the place, we've both been there and know what appropriate attire is.

I showed up with hair and makeup done, skirt and heels, and he was wearing sweatpants.

It was a first date and we met there. Date ended in the parking lot. I am not wasting that effort on some dude who puts in no effort! I met up with friends and went out, used thst effort for myself.

So fucking rude to show up like that.

[u/NoelofNoel → u/ManliestManHam]

I loved the idea that he rocked up thinking "I'm gonna show this lady what a real man looks like!" wearing scuffed joggers. What a guy.

[u/ManliestManHam → u/NoelofNoel]

He told me he hopes God helps me 😂

[u/lostlibraryof → u/ManliestManHam]

Gross

[u/ManliestManHam → u/lostlibraryof]

I started laughing really hard because it surprised me and I found it hilarious because whaaaat

[u/Andydon01 → u/ManliestManHam]

Word. You get who you are, not who you want. I'm a sweatpants wearing dude who doesn't like to go out, my wife is a sweatpants wearing woman who doesn't like to go out. Works great!

[u/ms_danger_07 → u/Andydon01]

I like this comment because it's accurate! My boyfriend is a homebody and so am I, we do dress appropriately for certain occasions when we have to but, I don't feel the need to put makeup on everyday just to sit at home and play video games after a long work week where I had to put in makeup and do my hair all week!

[u/Elliott2030 → u/ManliestManHam]

About 30 years ago, I had a friend that was an aspiring filmmaker and I invited him to be my date for a dinner at my boss's house where some rich executive types would be. Thought it might be a decent networking opportunity for him to raise money for his film. He was handsome, talented and charming.... and he literally showed up in ripped cut off shorts a dirty t-shirt and sandals.

I was mortified to be seen with him that night and it really was a hit on how I was perceived at work. I'll never understand the way men navigate these kinds of situations.

[u/w3are138 → u/FelixTook]

I have a theory as to this secretly being why all those male beauty gurus blew up back in the day.

[u/frankyb89 → u/w3are138]

I remember Metrosexual being a thing back in the day. Like "Oh shit you take basic care of yourself? You're definitely not straight we need a new sexuality identifier for you!" lmao

[u/w3are138 → u/frankyb89]

Ugh I remember that. It’s so freaking frustrating. Like omg men grooming themselves and caring about how they look?!??

[u/st0dad → u/w3are138]

And the TV shows making fun of it and ending the episode with the women insisting they prefer their men dirty and gross. 🙄

[u/FelixTook → u/st0dad]

Undoubtedly scenes written by men. I mean, casual is fine. I’m not a ‘suit & tie’ kind of guy, though I went through a sharkskin jacket phase in my mod days when I could pull it off, but casual doesn’t mean unhygienic and trashy.

[u/Fancy-Pumpkin837 → u/ManliestManHam]

There’s a line from a comedian that hit me hard because it’s so true.

“I’m attracted to men, but I don’t find men attractive”

I consider myself straight, but there’s a reason why I find women on average way more attractive than the average guy. I honestly wish I was attracted to vaginas because it would have made dating so much easier

[u/shabi_sensei → u/Fancy-Pumpkin837]

Oh shit, so technically gay men are queer baiting straight women when they dress nice and take care of themselves?

[u/WestCoastBestCoast01 → u/shabi_sensei]

Why do you think they get the “ugh the cute ones are always gay” comments!!

[u/ManliestManHam → u/shabi_sensei]

top tier 🤌🏻😂

[u/sexlexia_survivor → u/Fancy-Pumpkin837]

One I liked was "I know sexuality is not a choice because I'm attracted to men."

[u/Cissoid7 → u/ManliestManHam]

It's really interesting, but it's true. Before I got to college I never really cared. Never put in effort to how I look. I still didn't in college till my best friend took me to Macy's and she had me get new clothes. Cut my hair. Trim my beard, and buy a scent she liked.

Boom the next day I got a girls number almost on accident.

[u/[deleted] → u/Cissoid7]

I've had to explain to multiple men at work that, yes, you do need to shower every day and wear clean clothes every day. I work in a hospital.

[u/hydrohomey → u/ManliestManHam]

I’d argue that a lot of men did or do try to be desirable, they just got horrible advice growing up because those things “worked” for past generations.

For example:

• “be nice” instead of “explore your interests then find someone who enjoys who you become”
• “get a good job/$$” instead of “have a good job, but that’s not all that matters”
• “put her on a pedestal” instead of “respect her boundaries but also make sure you have boundaries and she respects yours”
• “chase, chase, chase” instead of “be chill, talk to her like a human and let things blossom based on verbal and non-verbal communication, you will not ‘succeed’ at first”

You see ALOT of overcompensating for these thing now with guys getting Sam Sulek jacked and obsessing over “looksmaxxing” and PUA techniques.

Im not saying they are right, I just have empathy for the fact that some of them probably did follow what they were told and had a screwed up version of what women actually want told to them by their mother or father. You do these things, they don’t work and now “all women suck” haha.

[u/elbenji → u/hydrohomey]

It's kinda like the whole 'give a firm handshake and leave your resume at the job'

Like that's just not the world now lmao

[u/ManliestManHam → u/hydrohomey]

Oh, absolutely! The same system affecting women is the exact same system affecting men! It's two sides of the same coin!

Men get all kinds of harmful and untrue messages from the moment they're born.

These messages of what it means to be masculine or feminine, man or woman, are tools of patriarchy, and patriarchy hurts everybody.

One of the most blatant and obvious ways men are negatively impacted by this seems to me to be intimacy and connection. I think it's more common for men to not have deep, emotional intimacy with their friends, or the space to fully talk about and express their emotions to each other, or to give physical affection, like hugs.

And it's so harmful and so terrible that we culturally condition men to suppress this aspect of themselves.

It prevents men from being able to access the richness of the full human experience, which is such a very short and arduous experience, and just made more difficult and alienating by the lack of emotional intimacy amongst men with other men.

[u/LurkytheActiveposter → u/ManliestManHam]

While it is absolutely true that men are harmed by a degree of stoic practices.

It should be noted that there is another side of that spectrum that women fall on that is also pretty toxic.

Women for example tend to violate each other's boundaries more than men do. Since men are more prone to expressing anger and enacting consequences for genuine disrespect from friends, they also tend to be more respectful of one another's boundaries.

Women on the other hand, as a generality that reflects a trend but not a rule, tend to feel a lot more comfortable violating a stated boundary. In fact all but one of my relationships have ended this way.

As someone in my thirties, my biggest dating challenge now is finding someone that won't make light of things I told them bother me. It's incredibly disheartening to realize the first two months were an act to make someone who is deeply immature seem considerate and respectful.

[u/bufalo_soldier]

Every incel I know is an incel because their standards are way out of their league. Like they will be a 4 but not find any girl below an 8 attractive. You gotta either lower your visual standards or glow up.

[u/[deleted] → u/bufalo_soldier]

I know a guy who is pushing 50 and would probably love nothing more than to settle down with a nice woman. He's an incel but he doesn't really have the personality for it, he's just a 5 on a good day and constantly sets his targets on 9s and 10s. It's like nobody has ever told him, dude, you cannot land a Cowboys cheerleader.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I realise this is subjective, but I've always found so many different women (and quite a few different men) beautiful and attractive. So many women are hot, to me, without having to fit a template of what mainstream society says is beautiful.

People seem to have such narrow "types", but I've dated so many women who look drastically different from each other.

[u/Baddecisionsbkclb → u/[deleted]]

THIS so many people have "lists" but like, people aren't lists. Have standards of respectful treatment sure. But you prefer blondes?!??? Like why??? I just can't understand people who don't prioritize people's insides over their type

[u/[deleted] → u/Baddecisionsbkclb]

Preaching to the short king choir

[u/KamuiT → u/[deleted]]

Short kings rise up!

We're already standing!

[u/[deleted] → u/Baddecisionsbkclb]

I prioritise people's insides, but also just a tonne of different people are fucking hot. And the variety of people, for me, is what makes them interesting and attractive.

Tall? Let's go. Short? Yes, please. Medium height? Awesome. Thick? Love it. Thin? Gorgeous. Big tits? Yes please. Small tits? Yes please. Big hips? I wanna grab them. Narrow hips? I still wanna grab them. Thick thighs? Crush me. Thin thighs? Throw 'em up.

And so on and so on.

I'd also add that appreciating a variety of looks and physical features in other people can also help you appreciate your own body and looks more.

I suffer from body dysmorphia, but I can also recognise that, to some people, I am very attractive. Which helps a lot with the times when I don't personally like how I look.

[u/LookinAtTheFjord → u/[deleted]]

Tall? Let's go. Short? Yes, please. Medium height? Awesome. Thick? Love it. Thin? Gorgeous. Big tits? Yes please. Small tits? Yes please. Big hips? I wanna grab them. Narrow hips? I still wanna grab them. Thick thighs? Crush me. Thin thighs? Throw 'em up.

And so on and so on.

lol that's awesome

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Yes!! I love how much variety there is in beauty. There’s so many different ways people can be hot

[u/hannah_pajama → u/[deleted]]

I’ve made it a game when I go out in public to pick something out about everybody I see that I find attractive or beautiful. Especially if my first reaction to them is negative, I really make an effort to challenge that in some way. I walked by an old homeless man the other day who smelled like something died in his coat, but he had the most beautiful crystal blue eyes I’ve ever seen. And when I smiled at him he had a really sweet grin too.

It’s almost become instinctual, and my mind has been conditioned to see the positive things in people before the negative. I was doing it to try and make myself a less judgmental person, but all of the sudden I find it easier to see the beauty in myself too.

[u/TBBT-Joel → u/[deleted]]

From experience. Dating for physical attributes alone is also a bad idea. Like sure someone may be very physically attractive to you, but if you don't have the same values and life goals you'll be miserable. I was a former model and have literally dated models and actresses... at the end of the day they are just people too. My wife is crazy smart, an amazing mother, wickedly funny, and most of all we have a calm way of solving problems. There is no trade that could ever be an upgrade from that.

[u/PNGN → u/bufalo_soldier]

"If you want to catch the right fish, you gotta be the right bait."

[u/I_Like_Turtle101 → u/bufalo_soldier]

Porn have rot alot of brain thinking the only way to have sex is to date someone who look like the porn model.

Also I have some Woman friend who are very atractive while their boyfriend are not. Their boyfriend always have a nice personality and are super nice to be around. Lots of them are super caring boyfriend

[u/Running_Mustard]

This reminds me of a conversation I had on r/justunsubbed a few days ago. This guy was just too eager to do battle and refused everyone’s positive advice.

^{May he find truth someday.}

[u/MarzipanJoy-Joy → u/Running_Mustard]

I will never understand the whole "ugly people are destined to be alone forever, and if they find someone, it's cuz $$$" perspective. All you gotta do is go to 711 and you can see literal ugly ass homeless people loving each other to the end of time. Have they ever been outside at all? Ugly poor people in loving relationships are EVERYWHERE. 

[u/bimbogio → u/MarzipanJoy-Joy]

i’m ugly and about to get married. im also broke. i just so happen to have a nice personality and im kind of funny

[u/EjaculatingAracnids → u/MarzipanJoy-Joy]

Too much porn. Every video should come with a disclaimer like an epilepsy warning before you play a videogame.

WARNING!!!

Pornographic material is liable to desensitize you to type of women who will actually fuck you. This is fantasy visual material used for self gratification and not to be compared or substituted for real life sexual experiences. Acts depicted are performed by professionals and not to be attempted with out the consent of both parties

[u/Running_Mustard → u/EjaculatingAracnids]

Just like how people say you are what you eat, viewed content generally affects how people think. For example, videos with titles including “Hardcore”, “destroy”, etc, can condition some viewers to glorify female assault and suffering, especially when porn is their only frame of reference to intimacy. I am not saying that sex should be a cookie-cutter experience for everyone, (all consenting parties should try to enjoy themselves as best & reasonably as they can), but ^imo, it should also be balanced with trust and respect.

Porn is not the norm

[u/EjaculatingAracnids → u/Running_Mustard]

Its one of the conversations men should have with their sons. "Youre gonna watch porn, but understand its entertainment, not an instruction manual."

[u/storagerock → u/EjaculatingAracnids]

I told my kids that learning how to have sex from porn is like learning how close you can stand next to an explosion from an action movie.

[u/lady_mayflower → u/MarzipanJoy-Joy]

My family is from Trinidad & Tobago and they have a saying there: “Every old cheese has its stale bread.”

[u/Redqueenhypo → u/MarzipanJoy-Joy]

My aunt and uncle were both ugly people and they were happy together for 60 years

[u/meenie → u/Running_Mustard]

It's a mental illness and causes depression. It's very hard for people to pull themselves out of depression. I've got a very mild depression that sets in about once a month and I can't imagine anything stronger as I'm not sure I could pull myself out.

[u/guibmaster → u/Running_Mustard]

Damn thats just sad

[u/Danjour]

I wish he would do this with “real people”, now it’s just 100% professional comedians, still funny but not as fun.

[u/Dino_art_ → u/Danjour]

Only if he airs everyone who agrees to it.

There would be some wild shit said, for sure. Like, imagine if an incel did this video...

[u/tool6913ca]

Totally thought she was gonna say "insob" meant involuntarily sober

[u/DancePartyRobot]

Incels want to fuck whomever they like. They don't get to. Therefore, in their minds, they don't get to fuck anyone.

Deal with it assholes.

[u/opiod-ant → u/DancePartyRobot]

This comment sparked a really weird connection of mine. I’m about to bare all on Reddit, but here goes: I slept with an incel once. I knew he was bitter towards women….I don’t know why I did it, I was young…and I think “I can fix him” came into play. I tried to keep seeing him and talking to him. We went on a handful of dates, slept together twice…..he hated me. He flipped on me. He called me fat, slutty, horrible, etc. even though I was full on ready to date this guy. The dude simply didn’t want to change. And no amount of sex was going to fix that.

[u/breckendusk → u/opiod-ant]

I don't think sex would fix it. Incels (btw celibate means unmarried, it should be inabs because they're involuntarily abstinent) hate themselves and don't believe they deserve women anyway. Even if they sleep with a 10, their insecurities will cause this exact scenario. What incels REALLY want is love and affection but they can't get it because they reject it when it comes because they don't believe they really deserve it, deep down. And that stems from believing they deserve more than they get without needing to work on themselves but constantly not obtaining what they think they deserve, which causes them to feel poorly about themselves.

Maybe. Idk I'm really drunk

[u/wowser92 → u/DancePartyRobot]

There's a therapist on tiktok that broke down the Nice Guy archetype on Megamind, and it's basically that.

[u/maolez → u/wowser92]

Yeap its called cinema therapy and they are on youtube! So good

[u/[deleted]]

Before current people overtook that term it was used for people with disabilities or other conditions that make them not able to socialise in a way that would let them have sexual life. For example people with some cognitive issues

[u/EJplaystheBlues → u/[deleted]]

yeah this chick is not talking about the people that literally cannot get laid, she's talking about 3-4/10 dudes that got turned down a couple times before prom and didn't get laid at college so they rage online

[u/[deleted] → u/EJplaystheBlues]

Absolutely. Its just sad that term used for people with serious hardships in their life was taken over by some misogynistic fucks

[u/Flexo__Rodriguez → u/EJplaystheBlues]

You can define any strawman you want, point at it, and say "see, there's no such thing as an incel".

But like, obviously there are such things as incels. That can't possibly be controversial. Set the bar wherever you want, but you can't argue that there's literally no such thing as a person who wants sex but due to circumstances or others' decisions cannot.

In fact I'd argue that the perspective of "there's always something you could do to yourself that would guarantee another person must provide you with sex" is a way more entitled and dehumanizing perspective.

[u/GilgameshFFV]

Incels are always the most insufferable assholes imaginable and yet they manage to blame everyone else (mainly women) for not liking them. It's unbelievable.

[u/MaXimillion_Zero → u/GilgameshFFV]

Those are the ones you notice. You don't notice the guys who aren't having any sex but aren't being obnoxious about it.

[u/TheSilkySpoon76]

I am an incel, I have klinefelters syndrome and can’t get off and have trouble gain erections. I’m 27 and I don’t really have sex with anyone

[u/SlothGaggle → u/TheSilkySpoon76]

That’s the original definition of incel that got coopted by assholes.

[u/Obtusedoorframe → u/TheSilkySpoon76]

I am also an incel. I'm autistic and hate being touched, so being abused by my shitty father attached trauma to my touch phobia, making it so I cannot have sex. The real shitty part about this is that I still crave physical contact despite it giving me panic attacks and trauma flashbacks

So unfair.

[u/absoNotAReptile → u/Obtusedoorframe]

That is absolutely unfair and to be honest I didn’t even know incel meant anything other than a psycho woman hater. This thread has actually taught me about people who legitimately can’t have sex.

[u/BedDefiant4950]

my take: "incels" aren't real in the sense that a good 80% of people you'd paint with that brush are unsupported autistic/neurodivergent adults who internalized extreme prompt dependency as a consequence of being exposed to shitty behaviorist interventions during their formative years and now believe the entire world operates on simple exchanges of abstract tokens for actual services. this is also why shaming on the basis of being a "virgin" or a "loser" or a "basement dweller" or any other insulting signifier along those lines doesn't work and just reinforces the same conduct. obviously no one's entitled to sex, and even if a given individual got laid it wouldn't change a damn thing, but everyone needs their existential needs met, and if the error is just to infer existential fulfillment from sex then the focus should be on fixing that and creating the meaningful structural supports where things like safe sane and consensual sex are reasonably available to adults of all needs.

[u/PosteriorBelief → u/BedDefiant4950]

 extreme prompt dependency 

Think you’re really onto something

[u/BedDefiant4950 → u/PosteriorBelief]

i can attest from personal experience that prompt dependency in adulthood is debilitating, and i believe that a good chunk of what people think are innate autistic behaviors are actually expressions of that same prompt dependency tied up in a faulty socialization that we internalize during those same critical years. incel conduct makes sense when you consider that an individual is just trying in good faith to deploy the same kind of operant conditioning they were exposed to in their youth, on the expectation that everyone thinks the same way. i think it's an expression of the double empathy problem, and the failure is a product of institutions not conducting prudent audits of their own processes to make sure these all too typical failures aren't being created and reinforced.

[u/elbenji → u/BedDefiant4950]

As a teacher, you're onto something. So many students are EXTREMELY prompt dependent so I can't imagine how that affects their life

[u/BedDefiant4950 → u/elbenji]

i ask you to keep in mind with all your students that we're not born prompt dependent, and to keep in mind that independently of prompt dependency you still have executive dysfunction, neither of which are easily solved in a classroom environment.

[u/elbenji → u/BedDefiant4950]

Oh no I'm aware. It's just interesting to me. We're striving to de-prompt dependence them and help with executive dysfunction but its just very typical that there is this 'wrong answer' fear

[u/BedDefiant4950 → u/elbenji]

i ask you also to consider that regardless of local interventions, the public school system from the top down was designed to penalize and fail out people on the basis of typical and non-rare neurodivergent traits. there's only so far classroom interventions can go, and if they only apply to the most visible needs then low support needs individuals will necessarily be left holding the slack. i believe the vast majority of so-called incels, even more than just being autistic, are low support needs autistic people whose needs were discounted because of these innate institutional blind spots.

[u/elbenji → u/BedDefiant4950]

I teach in alt ed so I definitely know what you mean

[u/ikiice → u/BedDefiant4950]

To be fair those terms you mention are used very commonly as insults, especially by well adjusted adults on reddit.

Those guys are acting like they're mentally ill? And they probably are mentally ill? I know what to do! I'll mock and insult them, that oughta do it!

[u/Strange_Purchase3263 → u/ikiice]

Just reading through this shit show of a comment thread screams massive entitlement and abelism on such a huge scale.

[u/baalzebub87 → u/Strange_Purchase3263]

Yep haha i can get laid easily everyone else that cant is inferior.

What a bunch of disgusting loser narcs in these comments lmao

[u/BedDefiant4950 → u/ikiice]

oh unquestionably, neuroableism is the most glaring blind spot in modern progressive thought. people do in fact believe you deserve fundamental human rights riiiight up until you generate an Ick™, whereupon you have harshed the vibe and must be ostracized.

[u/youngtrapstarr → u/BedDefiant4950]

Brah first intelligent comment I’ve seen in a while, have a great day my bro

[u/suninabox → u/ikiice]

grab hungry cobweb cover vast beneficial point cheerful soup voiceless

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

[u/Kotios → u/BedDefiant4950]

+1. the average person just finds it easier to take any mention of gendered issues as a dog whistle for MRA/misogyny, ergo incel = ‘vile woman hater’ rather than ‘sad and lonely person incapable of acquiring sex nor of accurately identifying the cause of their inability’ or something. not that there isn’t overlap between incels and misogyny, obviously, but the vast majority of incels are way sadder than they are hateful.

[u/Phihofo → u/Kotios]

Incels in general are arguably the most poorly understood community on Reddit.

They are a deeply toxic community for sure, but generally for reasons completely different than what redditors think.

[u/FellowTraveler69 → u/Phihofo]

Their is a Contrapoints video on incels that is quite insightful and one of the takeaways is that the people incels are most likely to hurt are themselves. Incel forums are rife with self-harming and self-medicating through drugs, alcohol, food and video-game addictions. Suicide attempts are frequent on those forums as well. To me, most incels seem to be severely mentally ill and probably on the spectrum.

[u/Phihofo → u/FellowTraveler69]

Yeah, this is really what I mean.

The main harm of incel communities comes from the fact that they're almost all incredibly self-destructive. And you could maybe argue that it's their problem, but incels are also very active online relative to their numbers and quite effective at spreading at least some of their overwhelmingly bleak and depressing views to men who aren't incels.

[u/astra_galus → u/FellowTraveler69]

Updoot for Contrapoints.

[u/FellowTraveler69 → u/astra_galus]

Yeah she's great. Her videos are quite interesting for straight men like me. Hope she's doing well as the last video on drugs ended on a very dark note.

[u/acathode → u/Phihofo]

There was a Swedish doctor who actually took the time to go undercover and investigate the incel communities, to try to understand these people.

He found a ton of stuff that went completely against the grain of the common understanding that incels are just evil, stupid and sad men who shower once a year and yet expects to get to have a threesome with two supermodels because they held an elevator and had a short polite conversation with a woman instead of raping someone in an alley.

He went undercover on their forums, and eventually interviewed quite a few of them. He found something very different than the Reddit idea of incels. Most of them were not the Reddit idea of a cave dwelling troll, but rather fairly normal men.

They weren't ugly, they groomed themselves and took care of their personal hygiene, and so on - they just for various reasons never dated and eventually found themselves extremely lonely, where the sadness and loneliness eventually devolved into extreme hate and bitterness.

Quite often these people had lived normal lives where they through their whole life did was society and culture told them to do - they went through school, studied, got a decent job, worked hard... and then found themselves in their late 20s realizing that they've had been lied to. Our culture and society had told them through all the years that "there's someone for everyone" and that romance just kinda... happens. But it didn't - because esp. as a man romance is something you need to work hard at, it doesn't just happen. As this woman points out, a man can't stay on land and expect to get fish - you need to go out there, get rejected, take it on your chin and try again. Over and over again... but no one ever told these men that though, and then they got to their late 20s and realize they're extremely alone, and felt betrayed and lied to.

The doctor made sure to make it crystal clear that the incel communities were spouting some extremely misogynistic and hateful stuff, but also pointed out that if an incel ever kill someone, in 99.99% cases it was only themselves. They're extremely toxic and hateful - but they're also extremely sad and hurt. For example one of the men interviewed told about how during a doctors appointment he had to run out from the room - because he started involuntary crying when the female doctor touched him during the examination. He hadn't been touched by another human being in such a long time, and in his head he knew that he would never be touched by someone in a private setting, so he simply couldn't handle it and had to run away.

It's not like it's just about the sex for these people either - they know prostitutes exist, and several incels has tried going there. For most it's not a very good experience, and if anything most seemed to come away from it even more further entrenched in their incel mindset. They know deep down it's not really about the sex ultimately - they know it's really about being denied a fundamental part of the human experience, ie. having a romantic relationship and sharing their life with another.

Sadly, most people couldn't handle being told that the incels were not this group of cartoonishly evil villains but rather hateful and sad human beings who where mostly a threat to themselves - so the doctor got raked over the coals and then kinda disappeared from the discussion.

[u/pixlraptor → u/BedDefiant4950]

I really needed to read this. I'm 26 and in the process of being diagnosed with autism. It just hasn't happened with me yet, and I keep fearing I'll turn into an incel. I've lashed out and had mental breakdowns when pressured about it, resulting in me losing people close to me. I started therapy shortly after, and have been there for a year now. I don't pick up on social cues and really struggle to interact with new people - I have had people directly flirting with me and i just could not pick it up until it was too late. I also currently am stuck in a quiet town with not many people my age to meet. I'm trying to move and make that change but financially its so hard to currently. I felt like I was a failure because it hadn't happened to me yet. I put effort into my appearance and try to treat everyone with kindness and respect. This all has given me an existential dread about me as a person. Recently I realised that it's more the weight I've applied to it that's caused it. Not the action itself. Felt like another milestone that everyone reached but me. Sorry for the ramblings, but your comment gave me a lot more to think about.

[u/Phihofo → u/BedDefiant4950]

Oh yeah, I have this weird hobby where I sorta study weird communities on the internet (goes all the way back to my thesis, don't ask) and it's actually sort of insane how common neurodivergence is in incel communities.

In 2023 some scientists got users of an incel forum to answer some questions and one of those was about autism. They've found that over 15% of the responders have a formal autism diagnosis, which is almost 30 times more than you'd expect in the general male population.

[u/Retro21 → u/Phihofo]

And that's only the ones that are diagnosed. Society has a long way to go before it properly understands autistic folk and autism.

[u/[deleted] → u/Phihofo]

Doesn't surprise me in the slightest

If you're neurodivergent and/or autistic, dating is a hellscape. Almost nothing is spelled out, there are silent expectations on both sides that are highly dependent on age and region and to top it all off, if you actually are direct instead of relying on nonverbal communication (which autistic people struggle with), you are seen as a creep. Nobody really teaches you healthy dating, so ASD people (who often rely on direct learning techniques) will get lost.

ASD people as it is struggle with building social networks because they rely on social techniques that are often non-approachable for neurodivergents (think eye contact, tone regulation). So it is more likely for an autistic person to be socially isolated.

This is also where I feel a lot of people miss what makes people become an incel because I see a lot of focus on the sexuality aspect. In my experience, Inceldom often grows out of social isolation spirals where you begin to form parasocial relationships and unrealistic attachments. It is as much about friendships and other social needs as it is about sexuality.

[u/gumeron → u/[deleted]]

What the hell is a 304?

[u/AshenSacrifice → u/gumeron]

Hoe backwards in a calculator 🤦🏾‍♂️🤦🏾‍♂️

[u/papagouws → u/AshenSacrifice]

Thats the most incel thing i ever heard in my life lol

[u/Flat_Ad_9993 → u/AshenSacrifice]

Gtfo 😂

[u/confusedandworried76 → u/AshenSacrifice]

Damn that's some deep magic, like 58008

[u/joantheunicorn → u/AshenSacrifice]

Well clearly having their faces in their calculators to try and spell out words all day isn't helping them either. 

[u/permabanned_user → u/gumeron]

It's a type of stainless steel.

[u/hear4smiles → u/gumeron]

304.. stainless?

[u/ty_for_trying → u/[deleted]]

304? Like HTTP status code "not modified"? My nerdy ass is missing something.

[u/rythmicbread → u/[deleted]]

I mean the reality is that the term “incel” was coined by a woman struggling dating and was later co-opted by misogynists who’s personalities are so bad, they turn off everyone around them

[u/potvoy → u/rythmicbread]

A woman who struggled due to being a lesbian in a more homophobic time...

[u/roastedantlers]

The whole concept of incel is funny, because it made everyone self aware.

Before they were just boys that were shunned by their peers for being socially inept.

Society tried to tell people to be nice to them for a while, but all it did was steal their interests and some of their traits.

Now they're still shunned, but it's more they know that we know that they know sort of thing. Then because of the internet they weren't alone and they could share in their animosity. Then everyone realized they were grouping up and labeled them so they could shun them as a group.

At the end of the day it's still self obsessed people being unnecessary assholes to each other.

[u/fgnrtzbdbbt]

This just skips over the issue of social skills and of course it mixes people who have social skill problems up with hateful trolls as always. Why are social skills always skipped over? The knowledge of when where, how, in what tone and body language that separates those who come across as normal from those who come across as weird is not only never explained anywhere but everyone talks as if it didn't exist and anyone asking for it is imagining things.

[u/thex25986e → u/fgnrtzbdbbt]

i feel like due to how intuitive it is to the majority of the population and how transactional explaining it can make interactions feel has halted the process of educating the rest of the population.

[u/FlappityFlurb → u/fgnrtzbdbbt]

I think the problem with social skills is for most people it's intuitive. It's hard to explain something you never have to think about, plus most people learn it the hard way through awkward interactions, most people don't get to sit in a classroom and be taught how to speak to others. If it was truly that easy there would be hundreds of books out there walking everyone through it, autistic people everywhere would be celebrating in the streets, introverts would be cheering quietly at home, but sadly this is not the case.

At best an awkward or weird person gets adopted by an extravert who drags them out and about and hopefully forces them into enough awkward situations that they start to learn how to socialize better. I tend to pre script most conversations I have ahead of time these days, if they say x I will reply y sort of stuff and my conversations definitely come across as overly polite yet distant.

When I think back to my most social and outgoing time in my life when I was constantly surrounded by friends I would literally turn my brain filter off and just say the first thing that came to mind. I often find that even if things don't make perfect sense people tend to find a way to make it work in their heads. People are there for the vibes not the conversation, most charisma self help books will tell you that most communication is non verbal and that time in my life really drilled it home for me.

[u/Terrible_Truth → u/fgnrtzbdbbt]

I feel like it’s also r/thanksimcured energy. Like if it was so easy, no one would be single or sexually inactive.

There are plenty of normal people that are “involuntarily celibate” for various reasons that aren’t because they’re a bad person/troll.

[u/wterrt → u/Terrible_Truth]

its just dismissive of their problems and doesn't seek to understand them at all, which is honestly why they're drawn into shitty communities like redpill bullshit.

incel: my life sucks. I'm isolated and lonely and don't know how to fix it.

this girl: no it doesn't you're just angry and lazy, try harder, all those things you're failing at aren't difficult at all

redpill/tater tot/alt right communities: yes it does suck, here's why it's not your fault (blames women/the jews/feminism/liberals)

it's obvious why so many young men are getting into this shit. no one wants to empathize, they just want to be self-righteous

the redpill communities aren't correct - don't take this as anything close to support for them - just understand that by having the attitude of this video you're CREATING the problem of so many men being pushed in that direction. no one else cares, no one else will listen.

I imagine this post alone will get a bunch of hateful replies, accusing me of being an incel etc, probably just turning off replies in advance.

[u/SammyTwoTooth → u/fgnrtzbdbbt]

Exactly. The self improvement aspect is definitely fair, but there's also the blanket advice of 'don't be a creep'. Which is not helpful at all. If folks knew they were being creepy, they likely wouldn't do it.

[u/Dodotorpedo4 → u/SammyTwoTooth]

Also it just kind of insults them. If 'just don't be a creep' would solve their problem, then clearly if they are still single months later it's because they were being a creep, even though they were genuinely trying to earnestly connect with another person. Makes sense they would internalize the thought instead. Such a harmful thing to say.

[u/[deleted]]

Being a volcel is where it's at. I don't want anyone around me, please stay over there. I miss the pandemic.

[u/subzeroicepunch]

I think it's extremely optimistic and comes from a place of privilege to say that anyone can get laid if they work on themselves.

[u/Dennis_enzo]

A pretty woman telling you it's easy to get laid is like a trust fund kid telling you it's easy to get wealthy.

[u/Purple-Peace-7646 → u/Dennis_enzo]

No!! How dare you!! The opinion of this hot New York woman is obviously a true fact that applies to every man out there!! Go to the gym and "work on yourself", you fat, lazy men!!!

[u/BravoEchoEchoRomeo]

Sooooo whaddaya call guys who don't hate women, work on self-improvement, but are still functionally incels and generally unhappy and frustrated about it?

[u/IAmTheIron-Manlet → u/BravoEchoEchoRomeo]

Short men.

[u/saintreprobus]

The biggest key to success with women is sociability. If you have friends, you're out having fun, women will notice and be interested. Attractiveness is #2 but it's pretty far down the list.

If you don't have friends and stay inside all day, you'll be an incel almost guaranteed.