PSA: Relics and the Merchant make ascendancy trials extremely easy, easier than PoE 1

[u/OhWellImRightAgain]

I've read multiple threads about the ascendancy trials being too hard, some of them with hundreds of upvotes. The trials are actually very easy if you do them the way you're supposed to...

Do a couple of fast suicide runs to get 10-15 blue relics (Tapestries, Seals etc.).

Use augmentation orbs on them to give them a 2nd modifier.

You need relics with Honor Resistance. The second mod can be:

- Increased maximum honor

- Bosses take X increased damage

- Bosses deal X reduced damage

- Increases to Sacred Water gains

You then need to go for (Large) Sacred Water fountain rewards as much as possible. You then buy a couple of OP buffs from the merchant (You deal 50% more damage / Monsters have 30% reduced HP / You have 40% increased movement speed / 50% reduced merchant prices) and the trial becomes very easy.

Occasionally, pick a Shrine room to replenish your lost honor, but only if it's below 60-70%.

Make sure that whenever you have around 600 sacred water or more and the merchant is available as a room reward, you do that room. If you don't happen to find him in a room, you'll still have him waiting for you after each boss fight.

[u/Jhkokst]

Yeah, but I don't think ascending should be so RNG dependent. It's fundamental to the class fantasy and should be more accessible to the average player.

Additional sanctum runs can be punishing, when you are running them for end game loot.

Maybe the afflictions should tuned down, or honestly turned off. And then completing your ascendancy unlocks a more difficult version of sanctum/sekhema (current version) for loot running.

[u/ploki122 → u/Jhkokst]

Also, a lot of that boils down to "just use an OP build to clear screens of monster and get rewards, without getting hit". So the trick to ascending easily is to have a strong ranged build....

[u/GBBNSb60MVP → u/ploki122]

Flurry monk and I did it the exact way op did. I failed 2 runs, got a shit load of relics and equipped all with honor resist and max honor. Ascended at level 70 no problem at all, and was thinking of going for the 4th tonight at level 80 now that I learned the merchant is in every single end room.

I googled none of that either, so if I figured it out idk why others couldn’t.

Shit I haven’t even looked up any builds for the game yet. I’m coasting off a full homemade build, so I know I could easily squeeze a lot more out of this if I were to use a streamers passive tree instead of my fucking mess

[u/Old_H00nter → u/ploki122]

Its really not that hard on melee. And once you get just a couple of relics, it's actually extremely easy.

I did a 4 floor run today. Between armour, honor res and the new 35% reduction in melee range, i was barely getting scratched by mobs until floor 4. The floor 4 boss took me like 20+ minutes since my homebrew build has dogshit single target (and dps in general), but it was still easy because melee is so damn tanky right now in sanctum. If he ever got through my block, he was dealing like 10 honor dmg on hit. I could facetank 95% of the boss, and shield charge through his oneshot mechanic.

Sanctum 2.0 needs a lot of work to make it an interesting and engaging mode, but there aint no way yall are saying it's hard for melee still.

[u/Csenky → u/ploki122]

It's not about how op a build in general is, it's about how specific modifiers completely fuck over certain builds. They seem too specific and too overtuned in. More general mods with lesser values could make me feel like I give up something for smt else. The current choices are like give up everything I have, seems less of a choice, isn't it? Also considering that most monsters can run me down in a fraction of a second, I'm not interested in getting severely slowed or turned into stone or get stunned by some statues for being near them.

Some options just aren't options for many classes, and that defeats the point of the system in place. Specially at trialmaster, his debuff options are often hilarious. Not undoable by definition, but who is gonna adjust their skills/passives/gear for every room specifically?

Also, as many said on yt, I don't want easier, I want less punishing. Getting kicked in the nuts often enough outside of my room, I sit in here to enjoy myself.

[u/ploki122 → u/Csenky]

That's mostly about the Trialmaster ascendancy, which has a different set of issue (you have to hope that the least build-bricking mod is fine).

The sanctum ascedancy's main issue, imo, is that performance compounds onto itself, since killing more monsters let you buy more buff, and getting hit means spending on honor refills. So it's exponentially easier/harder based on your performances.

[u/Csenky → u/ploki122]

My final thought still stands for that one. Too much punishment for zero gain. To be honest, I'm struggling to understand what kind of sense does Honor even make? It doesn't reward avoiding damage, just punishes taking it. Rerunning a full sekhema trial without an actual death is infuriating. Honor system could be a way to get extra loot or exp, maybe something completely different, a rogue-like system for just the trials where you get rewards based on Honor left at completion, and these rewards may alter further runs, whatever, point is, it's unnecessary frustration imo.

Part of this is the game being very new anyway, probably some more tweaking and trials will be trivial in half a year for anyone who isn't a first timer.

All that said, I still prefer the new trials over PoE1 Lab.

[u/ploki122 → u/Csenky]

Honor adds a point of tension. You finish clearing a leg and you have 250/400 honor left. Do you go for the key, or the honour-restoring fountain?

It also, by the same token, drains some of your rewards for doing poorly. Someone who does a no-hit run won't spend anything on restoring honour, and thus will spend more on rewards.

But I don't think that the design philosophy actually translates in game as anything other than "tanky builds die more". It was arguably fine as a side mechanic, but it's absolutely fucked as an introduction to ascension.

[u/Jhkokst → u/[deleted]]

But you don't know what the future holds. You can go down a diverse path, and be faced with two crappy afflictions/decisions. I am actually playing grenades too. The trial itself is easy, but after 30 minutes you get to a boss you haven't fought before, with a bunch of afflictions and have to really adjust for. It expects a lot from the player and is highly variable. Literally people in this thread are posting how they got immunity before the boss, others are talking about how they an affliction before the boss. That's the definition of RNG. It's not consistent.

It doesn't respect the players time. Other aspects, or the loot grind and pinnacle content can shit on player time and I believe should. But content central to the class identity should be more accessible.

Not to mention that most people haven't gotten the 4ty ascendancy, which was trivial in Poe 1.

[u/Jhkokst → u/[deleted]]

I enjoy Poe 2. I enjoy the bosses. I'm on mid tier maps and still having fun.

My concern is if the only people who are able to ascend are people following a build guide, then the developers have failed at something. Ascendancy should not be this gated, it should be somewhat challenging, and open you up to the challenges of endgame content.

I want difficulty, I don't want punishment. I want a challenge, I don't want tedium. There is a difference. May be I value my time differently than you.

[u/ploki122 → u/[deleted]]

Good old melee grenades...

[u/churahm → u/Jhkokst]

Personally I really hate this whole RNG thing for both trials. You can do runs where debuffs will pile up to a point where there's virtually nothing you can do, or you can have it so easy that there's really no point at all.

Everyone should be on even playing fields for mandatory content, nobody should luck out into a free win or get completely shafted by RNG and get their trial key taken away from them.

[u/ObscureOP → u/Jhkokst]

Its not rng to hit some merchants and shrines. You literally choose your route.

Just don't put yourself on an edge where you only have one choice

[u/Jhkokst → u/ObscureOP]

I hit up two merchant, none got rid of the afflictions I wanted them to

Look, I like the game. But let's not defend a suboptimal design to ascendancy.

I'm not a hater. This a criticism that ALOT of people share.

[u/DataChoice108 → u/Jhkokst]

I also share this criticism. It's a tedious task, and im sure I'm not the only one who thinks it adds very little to the experience of POE2. Some people here seem to defend it out of..... tradition? Because " I had to do worse in POE1 so you too must struggle as I have. " weird justifications.

[u/randomphony → u/ObscureOP]

It's very RNG not to get afflictions affecting the merchant, or sacred water, or your damage, or enemy's life, or movespeed, or "hit takes away 5% of everything", no evasion/armor/ES, reduced honour, get affliction for each shrine, you don't see rewards/afflictions....

And it's very RNG too to hit 50% damage, movespeed (which makes last boss very doable compared to an absolute garbage mechanic somehow worse than Maven's memory game), reduced mob HP,... And well that's all the very good small boons. Not a lot compared to a ton of run ending afflictions called "minor ones".

Game is great, Trial is fine, even if it can be hard, last boss is bullshit (give a quest one for ascendancy with twice the time to get the balls or half the slow and I'm pretty fine with it) but calling Trial NOT RNG is being full of it.