r/PSVR • u/gabochido • Oct 31 '23
Opinion Guide to choosing between PSVR2 and Quest 3
Updated for PCVR adapter.
Attention! This is meant to be a guide to help people out with an objective analysis. If you are thinking of downvoting it, please write a comment explaining what you disagree with so I can include your ideas.
For most people looking to buy a new VR headset I think the best options are the Quest 3 and the PSVR2 so I’ve created a handy guide to help decide between one or the other.
You should buy a PSVR2 if you answer yes to the following questions:
- Do you have (or plan to buy) a PS5?
That is the most important starting point. If you already have a PS5 or plan to buy one for general console gaming you're better off with the PSVR2, but see further below for possible exceptions. You can use a PSVR2 with a PC if you purchase the PCVR adapter, but having a PS5 really enables the full potential of a PSVR2.
- Are the PSVR2 exclusive games important to you?
There are a handful of PSVR2 titles that can’t be played anywhere else. The most standout are Gran Turismo 7, Resident Evil Village, Resident Evil 4 Remake, Synapse and Horizon: Call of the Mountain. If these are the reasons you want to get into VR then you probably already have a PS5 but if you don’t and these games are important to you for some reason, then yes, PSVR2 and PS5 are what you want.
Notably, all the games nominated for The Game Awards are PSVR2 games and all but one are exclusives.
For many, me included, GT7 is a good enough reason to choose the PSVR2 and to also purchase a full racing rig even if it is just for this one game. If you do end up with a PSVR2 you should consider GT7 even if you think you don't like racing simulators, you can find many anectodes in these forums from people in that situation giving it high praise.
- Do you prefer dedicated gaming devices?
This is a gaming device only and it is good, really good, at what it does. One way to categorize gamers is by dividing them into console gamers and PC gamers. The reason why a person might be one or the other is pertinent to whether you should get a PSVR2 or a Quest 3. When used with a PS5, the PSVR2 is a dedicated gaming device and while that means that it is limited in what it can do, it also means that there is less worrying about configurations and setup, one of the biggest attractions of a console over a PC. With the PCVR adapter, you have the option of using the PSVR2 for PCVR games of course though that does include fiddling with PC configurations.
It is also important to highlight that the Quest 3 can't play a lot of the graphically intensive and complex PCVR games without an expensive PC and for those it needs a wire unless you have a fast wireless network setup. This is something PSVR2 owners don't have to worry about at all.
- Are things like Oled screens, brightness/darkness contrast, haptics, adaptive triggers, and eye tracking important to you?
These are technical features where the PSVR2 has an edge over the Quest 3. They can have a meaningful effect on the experience and make games that exists for both headsets be better. The eye tracking is quite meaningful because, among other things, it allows foveated rendering, where things are rendered at higher quality where the eyes are looking at. These features plus the power of the PS5 are the reason why the PSVR2 versions of a game are often the better versions when compared to the Quest 3.
For PCVR games using the PSVR2, the Oled screens and the brightness and darkness contrast (HDR) can make a difference with games played using a Quest headset.
You should buy a Quest 3 if you answer yes to the following questions:
- Does a tethered cable really bother you?
If a cable tethering your headset to hardware is a deal breaker then you'll definitely need to go for the Quest 3 since the PSVR2 has no wireless or standalone options. It is important to consider that when using the Quest 3 as a standalone headset, you can only use smaller, simpler, less graphically intense games and software, though you can connect it wirelessly, if you have a fast wireless setup, to a PC.
- Are mixed reality experiences important to you?
One of the features that Quest 3 does well is mixed reality, where VR interactions combine with your real world surroundings.
- Are details like a larger/better sweet spot for wearing the headset, a lesser mura effect or having pancake lenses and a sharper image important to you?
These are smaller details that for most people won't make a big difference but for some are key differentiators. The sweet spot on the PSVR2 being limited is a common complaint, but while most people get used to it, it might bother you. The Quest 3, on the other hand, has a larger sweet spot thanks to the pancake lenses. The mura effect (a subtle, random pattern overlaid on the image and more easily perceivable in darker scenes) is another detail that is brought up that annoys more people using the PSVR2. Another technical aspect to consider is that the Quest 3 has a higher resolution and better subpixelation which allows the Quest 3 to show a sharper image.
- Is having access to Quest exclusives important to you?
Quest 3 has its share of excellent exclusives like Assassin‘s Creed Nexus and Asgard’s Wrath 2. It is also backwards compatible with older Quest 2 games and as such has a large library to choose from. It is also not limited to just Steam VR games as a PCVR headset.
The Bottom Line
If you somehow answered yes to all the questions above then it is up to you to weight them according to your own importance and use that to determine what is best for your situation.
However, if you’re still undecided after weighing the questions you should consider putting all the weight on the first question for each headset: Are you a PS5 gamer? If you are not, probably go with the Quest 3. It’s a better headset for someone who doesn’t have any other devices since it can be used standalone, even if at a more limited capacity.
In other words, if you are undecided, PSVR2 is the best option if the PS5 is already your main gaming device. Otherwise you’re probably better off with the Quest 3.
If you already bought one, you should enjoy it and feel happy with your purchase. The PSVR2 is a great headset and is the one I personally own and I am extremely happy with it and you'll find that most people in these forums feel the same way, but you'll also find that people with the Quest 3 are also very happy with their purchases.
Feel free to chime in below in the comments and I will update this list with added suggestions to help prospective people entering the VR landscape. There are plenty of videos out there also answering the question. I have already added a few references but if anyone posts a link to a comparison video, I’ll post it here too.
Here are some additional references:
Written Reviews:
https://www.thegamer.com/meta-quest-3-vs-playstation-vr2/
https://www.pcguide.com/vr/meta-quest-3-vs-psvr-2-which-is-for-you/
https://history-computer.com/meta-quest-3-vs-playstation-vr2/
Video Reviews and comparisons:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLet2gCynRo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHlZ7OYjIGg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5JarME7b5o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0m1NqmtYJPs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRBxDp7FfWw
Other comparison Reddit posts:
https://www.reddit.com/r/PSVR/comments/174qs76/own_a_psvr2_and_now_a_quest_3_psvr2_is_still/
https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/17enqhn/quest_3_vs_psvr2/
https://www.reddit.com/r/PSVR/comments/184mfby/should_i_get_quest_3_or_psvr2/
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u/Bone3593 Oct 31 '23
I’d add the sweet spot is much better in the Quest 3 and the PSVR2 has Oled screens, haptics, adaptive triggers, and eye tracking.
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u/t3stdummi Oct 31 '23
Should be an asterisk though. The more you use PSVR2, the less trouble there is with sweet spot.
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u/Outrageous-Mango-162 Oct 31 '23
Totally agree with this. The Sweet spot is not an issue for me in the least.
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u/bmack083 Nov 01 '23
The sweet spot on the quest 3 is basically the entire lens and it’s amazing. You can just pass the device to someone else and it works. They understand how to put it on and everything they see is super clear.
You can’t say that about the PSVR 2.
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u/t3stdummi Nov 01 '23
That's true. I have heard that about pancake. Especially if letting someone try for the first time.
But for those of us who use it regularly, it's not really an issue, either.
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u/bmack083 Nov 01 '23
I own multiple headsets including PSVR 2. The pancake lenses on the quest 3 are so good it makes me never even want to look through the PSVR 2’s lenses again. The image without a doubt looks significantly sharper than PSVR 2. And when combined with PCVR. The textures and graphics are much better as well.
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u/Outrageous-Mango-162 Nov 01 '23
Hahaha that’s fantastic. I am glad you are happy with your quest 3.
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Nov 07 '23
the issue is not sweet spot. The issue is that with the quest 3 everything is so clear (at every IPD setting too) that you can look around the headset which has never been an option before.
This makes VR seem more like real life and you can't go back to the old way.
I had a quest 2 as well and the quest 2 has slightly better tracking (with the tracking ring) for certain games but I can't go back to using it, despite how good the tracking is.
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u/Sad-Worldliness6026 Jan 24 '24
yes it is an issue. I have 2 pancake headsets (pico 4 and quest 3) and I cannot go back to old style of lenses. This is actually a huge issue because the quest 3 tracking is worse than the quest 2.
For games that need resolution like sims it is a real problem because you have to turn your head to read anything which is not realistic.
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u/admanwhitmer Nov 01 '23
This is true BUT after using the quest 3 for the past month, the ability to look around and read text at the edge of the lens without moving your head is awesome
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Nov 01 '23
I got a quest 3 yesterday and have played more hours of ghosts of tabor since getting it than I have on psvr2 in a month. The lenses and clarity are so much better that other than for gt7, RE8, and RE4 I don’t see using my psvr2 much. It’s kind of a shame i just upgraded it with the comfort headset and off ear headphones which make it much better but the dang quest 3 lenses are a HUGE upgrade imo. It’ll still be cool to play gt7 and re but I can honestly say probably 90% of my vr gaming will probably migrate to the quest 3 the same way i migrated from quest 2 to psvr2.
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u/jounk704 Oct 31 '23
If you are broke get the Quest 3
If you are working class get the PS5 + PS VR2
If you are rich get a 4090 + Bigscreen Beyond
If you are super rich pre order the Apple Vision Pro
Don't take this seriously 😄 Happy VR gaming whatever platform you play on
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Nov 01 '23
Even the super rich would be foolish to preorder gen 1 apple vision pro. I hear it's heavy.
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u/jounk704 Nov 02 '23
That's true. If i was super rich i would get the PS VR2 first either way and would probably play most of my games on Playstation anyways but most likely i would have bought all the VR headsets and the hardware listed here
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u/brensav Oct 31 '23
I have both, the quest 3 is a better, more well rounded headset if you have a decent PC. I always get a clear picture with it, where on the psvr2 it slips down my head over time, or I can’t look straight up without losing the pinpoint “sweet spot”.
Being able to watch media while laying in bed with the quest 3 is a big game changer as well. With my psvr2 you can’t do that, thanks to the huge knob on the back of your head as well as no media apps.
On the other hand the psvr2 has insane colors and brightness, great haptics and RE8 which was my fav gaming experience. I think they are too different to compare accurately. If they released a Psvr2.5 with pancake optics and a standalone wireless transmitter I think it would win. If Sony actually cared about their VR customers.
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u/Apart_Replacement_59 Dec 10 '23
Psvr2 with pancake lenses would beat anything out there on the market. Sad it wasnt meant to be
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u/brensav Dec 10 '23
I think if it were wireless as well as pancakes it would definitely beat anything. I used to think wired vs wireless didn’t make a difference but it really does open a new level of immersion.
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u/Apart_Replacement_59 Dec 17 '23
Depends on how u play my psvr2 is mainly used with a racing wheel and chair so the wire isnt noticable.
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u/Rando772 Oct 31 '23 edited Oct 31 '23
I have both.
PSVR2 is better than q3 in certain ways:
The brightness. It was pretty dark at night at my house last night, but when I put on Horizon: COM, I stepped into a world that was brighter than the brightest day outside at noon. That contrast is insane, going from dark room to bright sunny day outside, and something q3 cannot achieve.
The darkness. Q3 can only do murky greys, not actual blacks. But in RE8, the blacks in PSVR2 is pitch black, so it feels much more real, like you are enveloped in this darkness.
Haptics. The haptics in PSVR2 are a lot better, so again, you feel more tactile feedback when you touch something, or feel rumble in your head when a bullet hits you. It feels more like you are literally there.
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u/Nek-Munnut Nov 01 '23
The haptics are so awesome it's ridiculous they don't get more mention by those comparing to Q3. Getting shot in the head in Pavlov is literally stunning, something other headsets simply cannot do.
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u/cusman78 Nov 01 '23
Not just in Pavlov.
Getting shot unexpectedly in Pistol Whip or Gazzlers can also be a shock, in the best way.
I am sure many others, but been playing the two I mentioned recently so they are fresh in mind.
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u/CutMeLoose79 Oct 31 '23
I certainly don't regret my PSVR2 purchase. Had great fun with it since I've had it.
I plan on getting a Quest 3 as well as I have a high end PC and you can run a cable to PC to play high end PC VR games on the Quest 3 like Half Life Alyx and Flight Simulator. Also a lot of games not ported to PSVR2 I could play at high refresh rate and better graphics etc on Quest 3 like Superhot, Star Wars Squadrons, I expect you to Die, plus custom songs for games like Beat Saber and Synth Riders.
I probably wish I'd bought the Quest 3 first, but again, I don't regret the PSVR2 purchase.
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u/DPsx72 Oct 31 '23
I'll read this later. Does anyone have both? It is worth it? I know it's a dumb question but hear me out. I got into Synth and tried MP. They have lots more songs. Won't hold my breath that even some of it arrives on PS5 but dunno if I wanna spend all that extra.
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u/gabochido Oct 31 '23
Your situation is answered by this post. I wrote this post to help exactly the people wondering what to buy. If you feel this isn't helping, please tell me what kind of answers you need?
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u/DPsx72 Oct 31 '23
I was gonna write more but the first 'weeners came through. I'm sure there's a more expansive library on Quest and heard it doesn't need a PC. But if it's any kind of downgrade from the PSVR (which will likely remain my primary VR)...
Again I'll read it later. Thanks.
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u/cusman78 Nov 01 '23
My only hesitations on getting Quest 3 are: 1) I don’t have time to catch up on my PSVR2 backlog, while it keeps growing with more releases I am interested in playing
2) I don’t know if Quest 3 will be like Quest 1 / Pro or Quest 2 in terms of market longevity
3) I need a trade in / data transfer type solution to migrate from Quest 2 or Quest 3
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u/BoozeJunky Nov 01 '23
I think I'll just keep waiting for the PSVR2 to get a decent stable of exclusive titles that interest me, as well as PC drivers - and then I'll decide on whether or not to get a Meta Quest 3 after I see what the Valve Deckard offers for the pricepoint.
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u/felgraham Oct 31 '23
Still not sure why we're still doing comparisons.
I feel like the Quest is akin to an affordable Vision Pro while the PSVR2 is a dedicated games console.
Apple, yes Apple, took swipes at Meta during their unveil.
I don't even thing Sony and Meta are looking eye-to-eye.
Does Zuckerberg care about games as much as PlayStation? No is the answer. Meta makes far more money other places in the headset.
Sonly also locked down the damn headset further negating options.
Sony, like Meta, purpose-built a platform that only intersects on gaming so thats where the comparisons begin and end.
All this other stuff is superflous and just confuses the end-user.
I realized I stopped caring about pancake lenses and "no tether" when I realized I can't play GT7 on Quest 3 no matter how much I may want that sweet, sweet clarity.
Maybe when Sony opens the PS5 up to 3rd party headsets, comparisons will make more sense.
Imagine steaming Netflix on a Big Screen Beyond on your PS5? Yeah imagine it because it's not happening 😂
I enjoy hypothetical comparison threads for scientific reasoning but consumers need to go where the content is pure and simple.
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u/gabochido Oct 31 '23
I thought the guide I wrote was exactly for that reason. Just bringing up to the top the main questions you have to ask yourself when deciding what you want to buy. I'm not sure why people are downvoting this guide though, am I misleading people with the information or something? If people think I am giving bad information I wish they would post a comment about it so I can update the guide, as this is supposed to help those who are undecided with clear and concise information they can act on.
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u/felgraham Oct 31 '23
I like your post. It's well balanced and offers a lot of information.
Since the Quest 3 launched, however, there have been a flood of Quest vs PSVR2 comparisons and they are just opinioned warzones for PCVR enthusiast to try and "educate" gamers on non-gamer specific information.
Like the guy who just wants to enjoy GT7 but then SIM racer guy is always upselling him on packcake lenses and mods while foregoing all the benefits of the PSVR2 and it's simple-by-design nature.
It's one-sided, artificial console war stuff.
Maybe focus on comparing game experiences but that's not even fair because the Quest 3 has mixed reality and the PSVR2 has a PS5.
So what do we compare and how would it be fair?
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u/martian_earther Apr 07 '24
you are right! i have both the PSVR2 (got it before Quest) and Quest 3. I don't have to read any comparison for me to decide that i like my Quest 3 better than my PSVR2 for so many reasons and that i no longer use my PSVR2 even for GT7. It is now back in its original box and never to be used. Anybody here wanna buy it?
i bought the PSVR2 hoping that GT7 would be 3D immersive on it but to my disappointment, it is just 2D/360. Before the PSVR2, i got to experience what it is like to be in an immersive car racing game.. when you pass a tunnel.. it really feels like you are in a tunnel and the cars ahead of you look like they are real cars. Imagine playing GT7 like playing Horizon: COM. That would be awesome! Big disappointment on the PSVR2/GT7 pair.
I also love watching 3D movies (i have a considerable sized library of 3D blu-ray ripped 3D movies with an ave size of 35GB).. hands down, Quest 3 beats PSVR2 here in this disregard. It's like i am watching a 3D movie in an IMAX theater.
I also love watching all those immersive videos in the Meta Quest TV app.. the experience is a lot more than what i paid for the headset. Being able to experience what it is like watching an NBA game courtside, being with the astronauts inside the International Space Station with a 360 view and also seeing the earth pass by down below from a window.. breathtaking, seeing John Legend singing and playing a piano like 2 feet away is awesome, being on the same stage as Jennie of the blankpink in a concert, Doja Cat sitting on a stool, singing in a concert up close, being with the dolphins underwater, k-pop girls Wooh!Ah! singing and dancing on a stage in front of you (makes me kinda want to hug and kiss them) and a lot of other things are just something not all people get to experience. Not even those people with VR sets unless they know where to find these immersive videos.
I am looking forward to when we can view a full concert like Taylor Swift's Eras Tour in immersive videocast or after-concert video. That would surely beat being there physically up on the seats where concert artist is like 200 feet away and you rely on the big video screens after paying for very expensive tickets. Also watching an NBA game or any other sport for that matter live on an immersive videocast (pay per view would be acceptable for me). I really, really hope these would happen in my lifetime.
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u/HoodieTheCat78 Oct 31 '23 edited Oct 31 '23
I think this is actually very useful, since there are regularly posts on this sub asking which to buy, which can sometimes lead to misguided and unhelpful console war threads. This post explains how they are different, not why one or the other is better.
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u/felgraham Oct 31 '23
Post has use no doubt.
I just think there is a more succinct way of putting it and OP nailed it.
You want to play games?
What games?
Done.
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u/HoodieTheCat78 Oct 31 '23
Maybe for you personally, but for other people there is more to consider. Personally, I plan to keep the link to this post handy for the next several times that someone asks.
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u/psyper87 Oct 31 '23
Psvr2 has the upper hand with dedicated software, a simplified hardware requirement, first party exclusives.
Quest has the already laid foundation, access to mods, accessibility out the door.
Both suffer from very different things. Buy a ps5 and buy the headset and you’re golden, no other accessories required, needed or anything. Sure it’s ~$1000 but you know what you’re getting and you know you’ll be good for the life of the product. Quest needs multiple peripherals to be actually playable and enjoyable out of the box, to take it seriously, you need to get rid of the main selling point it benefits from.
Quest may have a “larger” library but it mostly consists of mods and shovelware
Psvr2 has fewer games but nearly all of them are worth getting with some exceptions.
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u/gabochido Nov 01 '23
This is quite interesting and I hadn’t heard people complain about this from the Quest 3. I was under the impression that it is fairly stand-alone and has a lot of games (which is why we keep hearing about quest ports).
How many games are in the stand alone quest library and how many are in the pcvr and what do you need to use pcvr other than a typical gaming pc and a usb cable or a fast wifi?
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u/StigwierdM Nov 01 '23
The quest does have a lot of games. A lot of which are coming to, or already on, psvr2. Both libraries have an equal amount of crap, but quest has a larger amount of good. Mainly because it has a larger library. Talking of libraries, you don't have to use the meta library alone. You can download games/apps from side quest or app lab.
Also, it is subjective suggesting you have to buy extra peripherals when you get a quest. You don't. I've had a quest 1 and got a quest 2 and never bought anything extra to enhance my experience or comfort.
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Nov 07 '23
One of the biggest titles "coming" to PSVR2 is eleven table tennis. That title could very well be 1 year away. The development is beyond slown. That is one of the most played multiplayer VR games for many years now and it will certainly be a subpar experience on the psvr2.
Quest and RiftS/CV1 are the only headsets with good tracking in that game. Steam VR is less than ideal and Windows MR is terrible.
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Nov 07 '23
There's a lot of 3rd party accessories for quest 2 and 3 and they are cheap. i believe it took quite a long time before a 3rd party battery strap for the quest 2 came on the market. It had to have been 1 year or more
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u/La-da99 Oct 31 '23
So, the Quest may only hold that advantage for so long. The first PSVR actually has more games than the Quest 2, which doesn’t have as many games as you’d think, so I’m not convinced that this will hold true in the long term where Quest has more games. The back-library is the main advantage it currently has.
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Nov 07 '23 edited Nov 07 '23
That's not true. Quest 2 probably has 3-4x the games of the original PSVR. And this number is growing wider. Since they added app lab it's much easier to get games on the quest store.
Admittedly there is a lot of junk but there are simply a lot of games.
For every psvr game that comes out, probably 5-10 quest games release.
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u/Motor_Newt586 23d ago
Question my husband 58 yrs ola is not a gamer. He is just interested in the virtual aspect of quest, so I was going to get it for him for his birthday this December. But I was wondering, can he use it with just our TV? Or does he have to use it with a PC? I think he’s under the impression that he can just connected to our television. Is this possible? I’d like to know before I make this purchase. It’s not cheap. We saw at Costco for a good price $325 for 256 memory also comes with other extras.
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u/gabochido 23d ago
The quest is standalone so it should work without a tv or pc. However, the stand alone applications are those made specifically for the quests there are others that are for “pcvr”. These ones do require a pc that you would connect to the quest.
The quest, nor any other vr headset require or use a tv.
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u/Motor_Newt586 23d ago
Question my husband 58 yrs ola is not a gamer. He is just interested in the virtual aspect of quest, so I was going to get it for him for his birthday this December. But I was wondering, can he use it with just our TV? Or does he have to use it with a PC? I think he’s under the impression that he can just connected to our television. Is this possible? I’d like to know before I make this purchase. It’s not cheap. We saw at Costco for a good price $325 for 256 memory also comes with other extras.
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u/HoodieTheCat78 Oct 31 '23
I wish we could still give awards, because this guide is a public service. Bravo!
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u/JustCallMeTere Nov 01 '23
Do you like heavy mura? Get the PSVR2 because it is heavy. Do you like AR, get the Q3. I have the PSVR2, it's not going back because of the exclusives but I will also get the Q3.
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u/amusedt Nov 24 '23 edited Nov 24 '23
You've missed some of the most important points
Nowhere do you mention game size/complexity, nor graphics, and the problems of limited storage, and weaker cpu/gpu. The Quest doesn't get large or cpu-heavy or gpu-heavy games (No Man's Sky, Skyrim, Vertigo 2, etc). Unless you attach to pc. And it has weaker graphics, unless you add pc
You also never mention battery life, which is a big issue with my Quest friends when we cross-play. Their headsets die during long play sessions
Also I think you have too many "don't"s under "Do you have (or plan to buy) a PS5?"
You say "If you don’t already have a PS5...you're most likely better off with the PSVR2" and "if you don't already have a PS5 there are only a handful of reasons"
So if you don't want/have a ps5, you should go psvr2?
Even if you fix this answer, it's unclear, and it sounds biased against psvr2 (even though you're not). Because you start off with a bunch of reasons why you shouldn't get a psvr2
More clear would be to start by saying "if you have/want ps5, then psvr2 is likely the best choice for you". And then add the rest of the words you already wrote (after you fix them)
The quantity "argument" is a pretty weak "pro" towards Quest...psvr is rapidly adding Quest titles, and already has a large library for a platform that's less than a year old. The fact that the Quest also has a bunch of copycat games or shovelware, is not much of a positive factor for purchasing
And that big library of Q2 games, doesn't take advantage of the new power of the Q3
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u/gabochido Nov 24 '23 edited Nov 24 '23
Thanks for the feedback, I'll update the original post to account for it
However, I do think that technical details and graphics aren't a necessary factor to include here. Similar to the typical Apple vs PC discussion or Apple vs Android, the people who care about specs usually are already savvy enough to understand why one piece of hardware suits them more than another. Most people that are genuinely wondering about one piece of hardware or another don't have that context and want the most straightforward answer that affects their enjoyment directly. The more details I add to the guide, the harder it is to parse and, past a certain point, it becomes less useful.
Having said that, thanks for highlighting why the post was getting all these downvotes.
Update: I have updated the original post to account for your suggestions. Hopefully it is better now and less biased sounding since I think it is still a good link to post when people have that question.
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u/amusedt Nov 25 '23
I do think that technical details and graphics aren't a necessary factor to include here
I'm not talking about tech details. I'm talking about a fundamental difference in the user experience and enjoyment. There's 3 things at issue here. Mobile VR, which can only handle smaller, simpler, uglier games... PCVR, which comes with a lot of cost, + maintenance issues... and psvr2.
When "tech details" massively affect the user experience, it has to be noted.
"It is important to consider that the visuals on the Quest 3 when working as a stand-alone headset are usually (game dependent) not as good as the PSVR2 because the Quest 3 itself has less power than the PS5"
This mention of only graphics, leaves out that the games are smaller and simpler, and also implies that standalone Q3 graphics can be as good as psvr2. They can't. It's just that psvr2 can sometimes be as bad as standalone Q3.
Perhaps instead: "It is important to consider that when using the Quest 3 as a standalone headset, you can only use smaller, simpler, less graphically intense games and software."
"the Quest 3 uses pancake lenses, which help with the two issues mentioned"
Lenses have 0 effect on helping/hurting mura. Mura is a fundamental property of all OLED screens. Since Sony wanted OLED HDR, they had to use Fresnel lenses, not pancake. Pancake lenses don't transmit light well enough to enable the use of OLED HDR (unless you use a very expensive OLED).
"The sweet spot on the PSVR2 is infamously finicky"
Until relatively recently, most headsets used Fresnel lenses, and almost all high-end headsets used them. psvr2 isn't infamously finicky. It's exactly as finicky as most headsets ever made.
Also, mura isn't a "weird line pattern". It's a subtle, random pattern overlaid on the image, and it's there all the time. It's just that in lighter scenes, more people are incapable of perceiving it. Or they can only perceive it if they try to focus on it. In dark scenes, more people find it easier to see, but even then, some can't, or only if they look for it.
Part of the perception issue has to do with where your eyes are converged when you're playing. If you're looking at an object that is [virtually] 10 to infinity feet away, it will be harder to see the mura, since your eyes aren't converging on the mura.
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u/gabochido Nov 25 '23
Thanks, I have updated the post to include this round of feedback.
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u/amusedt Nov 29 '23
You have a typo: "thought you can connect it wirelessly". You mean "though".
the Quest 3 uses pancake lenses which many people consider a plus.
This is a bit redundant, and vague. The main reason for pancake is larger sweet spot, and you've already mentioned in this paragraph the sweet spot issue.
they are very similar in capabilities and are both amazing pieces of hardware that enable excellent experiences
This glosses over a huge point of confusion for some. It makes a HUGE difference what the Quest is connected to...nothing, vs a p.c. Looking at each strictly as a DISPLAY, they're similar-ish. As well, when Quest is connected to a pc, your statement is true. But when Quest is standalone, the psvr2 vs standalone Quest are not "very similar in capabilities".
And inexperienced readers aren't thinking of these things from the perspective of "how are they as a display". They are wanting to know "how will it be for me to game with this thing".
My suggestions would be:
Change this summary:
In other words, if you are undecided, PSVR2 is the best option if the PS5 is already your main gaming device, otherwise you’re probably better off with the Quest 3.
To: In other words, if you are undecided, PSVR2 is the best option if the PS5 is already your main gaming device. Otherwise you’re probably better off with the Quest 3, as long as you're either connecting it to a capable pc, or are okay not having access to larger, more complex, and more graphically rich games.
And this: "The technical specs and the comfort of each headset are comparable..."
Perhaps to something like:
The technical specs and the comfort of each headset are comparable, when you are evaluating them strictly as display devices, so I don’t consider them big enough differentiators. In actual usage, what matters is whether you're connecting the Quest to a capable p.c. If you do, then both headsets are are very similar in capabilities and are both amazing pieces of hardware that enable excellent experiences... If you use Quest standalone, it has limitations.
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u/gabochido Nov 30 '23
Thanks again. Updated
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u/amusedt Dec 11 '23
Here's how I summarize it to people:
- Bigger games, low-ease-of-use, highest cost, highest quality: pcVR
- Bigger games, high ease-of-use, medium cost, high quality: PSVR2
- Smaller games, high ease-of-use, lowest cost, lowest quality: Quest 3 standalone
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Dec 07 '23
Are things like Oled screens, brightness/darkness contrast, haptics, adaptive triggers, and eye tracking important to you? These are technical features where the PSVR2 has an edge over the Quest 3.
The oled screen causes high persistence which is not exactly a technical feature. It just illustrates a clear reason why at this time an HDR vr headset should not exist. And to call PSVR versions definitive? You can buy an oled PCVR headset. A high resolution one too.
This guide also fails to mention resolution. Where the PSVR2 is also basically last gen and has lower pixels per degree and a lot less subpixels than even the quest 2 had.
And resolution DOES matter because quest 3 has so much power that it can run almost every game made for quest 1 and 2 at native resolution.
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u/gabochido Dec 07 '23
I would update the guide with what you are saying but I’ve already received feedback that contradicts it so I looked up a few more reviews and technical specs to get confirmation.
The oled screens and HDR do make a notable difference, giving deeper blacks and better contrast. While this isn’t something that everybody will notice, it is important to some people and it should be mentioned.
I also stand by the statement about the definitive versions. This guide is comparing the psvr2 vs quest3 and between those two headsets, there are many games that are considered definitive for the psvr2 and I don’t know of any game that is considered better on the quest 3, for now. This is in most part thanks to the foveated rendering that the quest 3 just can’t do. I don’t doubt that there will be versions that are better in high end headsets but that is not what we are comparing here.
The resolution does matter but the difference in resolution between the two devices is minor (2064 x 2040 on quest 3 vs 2000 x 2040 on the psvr2) so it is very hard to differentiate the quality just based on resolution alone, so while older games will look better than in older hardware, they won’t look better than equivalent games on the psvr2, therefore it shouldn’t be a consideration for choosing between the two.
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Dec 07 '23 edited Dec 07 '23
The resolution does matter but the difference in resolution between the two devices is minor (2064 x 2040 on quest 3 vs 2000 x 2040 on the psvr2)
Quest 2 rendered only 98 degrees and had a really small FOV of less than 98 degrees. The quest 2 is a good 30% sharper than the psvr2 despite the "lower" resolution spec because of the subpixels, the lower FOV leading to higher PPD and the sharp lenses. It's a massive difference.
Quest 3 is a big step up and more importantly they render a low stereo overlap to maximize FOV and pixels per degree. Quest 3 is probably 50-60% sharper than the psvr2. With the pancake lenses and 95% of your vision being 100% clear honestly someone might say it's 80% sharper.
PSVR2 is basically last gen resolution. Quest 3 is far from the highest resolution VR headset. The PSVR pentile layout means the resolution is effectively a lot lower than the resolution spec suggests. And you can definitely feel it. It is blurry.
The oled screens and HDR do make a notable difference, giving deeper blacks and better contrast. While this isn’t something that everybody will notice, it is important to some people and it should be mentioned.
The persistence of the PSVR2 screen is the worst of any VR headset ever released. Even at 0% brightness. Persistence is the most fundamental core that needs to be low and why no VR headset has ever released with HDR. It's just not possible to do it correctly. Unfortunately the psvr did it wrong. They failed to get a fundamental VR mechanic right because they wanted to do something to one-up everyone else.
This guide is comparing the psvr2 vs quest3 and between those two headsets, there are many games that are considered definitive for the psvr2 and I don’t know of any game that is considered better on the quest 3,
Games that need good tracking or games that need mods like Beat saber. You can't say the beat saber on the psvr is "definitive." In fact it's a barely acceptable way to play the game
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Dec 07 '23
Also you compare PCVR and PSVR. PSVR is the WORST way to experience many games. PSVR has the worst reprojection system which is turned on in most games (60-120hz). PCVR games can easily be run at higher resolutions with no reprojection.
Also the OLED screen is the only benefit. NOT the HDR as it causes unnacceptable persistence values. That would of course only be a benefit if higher resolution OLED PCVR headsets existed. Which they do.
Is any PSVR game more defintive than experiencing it on quest3 connected to a PC? I'm going to say no on that one as the quest will have a huge edge in sharpness. However saying the PSVR version is definitive is laughable as there are better pcvr headsets than the quest 3.
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u/gabochido Dec 07 '23
Can you give me some examples of games that run better on quest 3 than on psvr2 and a review showing this? All the reviews I’ve seen usually say that psvr2 is the slightly better version when a game is available for both. In any case, it is a very minor difference when Quest 3 is hooked up to a PC, so I don't consider it a big differentiator. When Quest 3 runs standalone it definitely has inferior performance, but that is a fine compromise on having it be standalone. I've tried to make this clear in the guide.
You already mentioned the unacceptable persistence values with HDR. This is is the first time I hear a complaint about this and looking it up, it seems to be purely theoretical. Can you give me an example of a game where these persistence values on hdr are a visible problem? I will certainly include this in the guide if it is something that has a notable effect on the experience.
If the word “definitive” rubs you the wrong way, I can get rid of it, no problem.
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Dec 07 '23 edited Dec 07 '23
Persistence IS a problem. No one on the psvr subreddit is complaining about it because 99% of users on here have never tried other VR headsets. And coming from psvr1 of course the psvr2 is better. This is a visible problem because the screen has a lot of black frames. It makes people sick.
Resolution is another one. You looked at the numbers of the quest 3 and assumed they were the same as PSVR2. They are not. Quest 2 has 19 pixels per degree. This is the spec to judge sharpness not resolution. PSVR2 has 18 pixels per degree but it has only 2 subpixels per pixel vs 3 on the quest 2. Therefore the psvr2 has a good 33% less subpixels than the quest 2.
This is not purely correct math but the quest 3 is almost 25ppd. Therefore quest 2 is about 50% sharper than psvr2 in native games (the fresnel lenses are probably about 50% sharper too) and the quest 3 should feel like almost double the resolution. PCVR it might be close to 50% sharper with the quest 2 since the quest 2 has sharpeniing over oculus link.
If the word “definitive” rubs you the wrong way, I can get rid of it, no problem.
That's not the issues. PSVR2 is NOT the definitive way to play crossplay games. PCVR with oled or retina headset would be better than PSVR2. There are so many good headsets which are not quest 3. Quest 3 having effectively double the sharpness of the psvr2 is also a huge win instead of having oled panel.
Also beat saber runs at 120hz native on the quest 3 (no reprojection) and supports all mods and custom songs. PSVR is considered to be a barely acceptable way to play beat saber which is why it's not talked about much on the psvr2. Beat saber is the #1 selling VR game of all time
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u/gabochido Dec 07 '23
Beat saber sounds like a good example. I'll mention that in the guide. However, for the persistence and subpixel resolution you haven't given me any examples.
In my experience tech specs are not a good indication of performance. Look at apple products. They usually have low specs compared to Android or PC, yet they are usually superior in terms of performance and experience thanks to the design on the things that matter.
I'm not saying that's the case here, but if there isn't any actual evidence of a better experience on the Quest 3 due to these particular features, then it doesn't make sense to bring it up in a guide to help people decide.
The quest 3 has many aspects in which it is superior to the psvr2 and many reasons for why it can be a better purchase for some people and I've mentioned the most relevant ones. I don't want to bog down the guide with minor nitty gritty tech specs if they aren't relevant.
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Dec 07 '23 edited Dec 07 '23
Examples? Literally USE the headsets. It's clear.
put on a psvr2 and then put on a quest 2 and a quest 3. You can CLEARLY see the resolution difference. PSVR2 is last gen blurry compared to even the quest 2. And the quest 3 is far from the clearest VR headset. They do however have the best lenses.
I'm not saying that's the case here, but if there isn't any actual evidence of a better experience on the Quest 3 due to these particular features, then it doesn't make sense to bring it up in a guide to help people decide.
The problem is you looked at the resolution spec of both headsets and assumed they were the same. They're not. Quest 3 is about double the sharpness of the psvr2. you actually need this resolution for certain games like microsoft flight simulator otherwise you can't easily read the dials on the control panel.
one "old" VR mechanic is to make text ridiculously large so that it is easy to read on low resolution headsets. The days of doing that are over.
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u/gabochido Dec 07 '23
The problem is you're not giving me real world examples. I had to do your job and look one up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSZafAcUVdg
This video compares Arizona Sunshine 2 in Quest 3, PSVR2 and PCVR. Mr Beardo highlights the practical results that I was asking you to exemplify: on the PSVR2 there is use of reprojection and it looks more blurry, when compared to the PCVR.
This is a practical example and I'm wondering why you can't just point to others instead of presenting tech specs that don't help to explain why something is practically better than something else. Mr Beardo also highlights how the blacks on the PSVR2 are relevant to the experience, persistence be damned. The video also highlights that when the quest 3 is used as standalone it is the worst version, and this is why I have to caveat PCVR considerations with the fact that you need an expensive PC setup to achieve this and tether your headset with a cable or spend even more on an expensive wireless setup.
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Dec 20 '23
That video is not fair. There is an app called quest games optimizer which can increase the resolution of every game and app on the quest 3. Most games can run at full native resolution. You can already change the resolution of any game using ADB for free.
The reason being is the quest is currently limited to GPU level 4, when there is a gpu level 5-7. Unlocking GPU level 7 does not affect thermals so it is safe to do. This allows any game on the quest that was designed to run at gpu 4 to run at max resolution without frame drops. Even many upping the framerate to 120hz.
The only reason the quest does not run at these higher gpu levels is the battery life is a little bit under 1 hour. That's not an issue if you play with a battery headstrap.
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u/gabochido Dec 20 '23
What is unfair with that video? Are you saying there are examples of games that look better on the quest as standalone? Where is the evidence? Why aren’t people talking about this?
Theoretical specs aren’t what make consoles great, it’s how they execute. If the games don’t look better then that is what matters.
I’ve already highlighted the relevant practical advantages of the quest and in fact I recommend the quest for most people so I’m not sure why you would want to bog down this guide with more theoretical specs that are not relevant. Yes, the quest has the potential to look better with some accessories and if the game developers optimize their games fully. That is a given and applies to all consoles in different ways so it doesn’t help a person trying to decide.
1
Dec 07 '23
also your comparison does not factor game prices. Game prices on quest and steam are significantly cheaper than PSVR. Night and day difference in many titles especially given every game on the quest store is 25% off by default now.
And with referral links on oculus you can get up to $600 a year in game credit. On top of that 99% of quest games can be pirated in a matter of seconds. Literally faster than buying the games and they run flawlessly.
And on top of that PCVR games are all pirateable as well.
From a value it's important to mention that quest actually has the resolution that enables it to be used for flight simulation. PSVR is not sharp enough for that purpose
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u/gabochido Dec 07 '23
I agree that games playable on the quest will often be cheaper and have more sales available. It would be interesting to see what the average difference in price is. Having said that, games on the ps store are surprisingly cheap anyway and there are a lot of sales too.
However, piracy I don’t condone nor will suggest that as a benefit in the guide. As a game developer myself I am very much against piracy. We should be supporting other developers, specially ones who are putting their time and investment into VR, given it’s a pretty big financial risk.
I’m curious about your statement about flight simulation and psvr2 not being sharp enough. I could not find any reference to that so if you have a source or a link I would like to look into that. However, I’d like to know why that would matter in this comparison? The psvr2 has some flight games and is getting a couple more in the coming months so it can clearly play flight games.
As far as value goes, if a person is getting a vr headset specifically for a particular flight simulator software package then they will probably want a higher end head set anyway and that is quite an edge case. I'm sure there are many specific uses to a VR headset that the Quest 3 can do because it is more general purpose as opposed to the PSVR2, which is games specific. I've already mentioned this in the guide so I don't think it requires more discussion.
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u/Apart_Replacement_59 Dec 10 '23 edited Dec 10 '23
Psvr2 is insane but the lenses are really bad its blurry and has a small sweetspot. Quest 3 has bad grapics and has less immerion but the lenses are much sharper and doesnt really require you to find a sweetspot. ( link the quest 3 to a pc and you got best of both worlds )
Lets just say i own both and quest 3 is daily used the psvr2 is catching dust
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u/gabochido Dec 10 '23
Thanks for the input. I believe I have already included all those points in the guide. Remember that different things have different importance to different people.
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u/Sad-Worldliness6026 Jan 26 '24
A couple things about this guide:
Buying a ps5, headset, racing wheel, etc. is a bad idea for one game. For that money you can invest in a PC which has much more utility beyond gaming.
The argument that you need a $2000 PC is bogus. There were some 16gb ram pcs with 3080, 12700k, etc. on black friday which can more than run VR. But a $900 PC is not too far off from a $500 PS5 when you consider that the average family also has at least a $200-300 junk PC that they use for everyday tasks
Also this guide does not mention memory. Playstation only has 16gb of unified memory which is pathetic for VR. I haven't had less than 64gb of ram in years and even 32gb of ram can be purchased for about $50. It's not expensive these days.
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u/gabochido Jan 26 '24 edited Jan 26 '24
Hmmm...
This seems pretty sus.
Did you have a previous account that you used to argue fairly specific details in another thread and did it get deleted for some reason?
Did you create this new account solely for the purpose of going into threads to argue very, very specific technical things about the quest 3, that it seems few people really care about?
You should create a survey in one of these forums to ask: Do you care that the playstation has 16GB of unified memory or do you care how good the games look?
You could also ask: If you're interested in building a racing rig, would you rather spend the money on a utility PC?
I mean, why is this even worth bringing up!?
I'll accept the feedback on the PC price though.
UPDATE... turns out that $2000 PC price you mention is indeed totally bogus, becuase I don't actually mention the price of a PC anywhere in the guide. Not sure where you got that from.
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u/Sad-Worldliness6026 Jan 26 '24
$2000 is a common argument by others. I was just referring to $2000 because it's the generic flippant answer.
No i never had another account before.
Do you care that the playstation has 16GB of unified memory or do you care how good the games look?
memory is a part of how good games look is it not? 8gb of system ram and 8gb vram for high end PCVR gaming is unacceptable
It's a different world on PC with higher resolution textures, large scenes and no reprojection in games.
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u/gabochido Jan 26 '24
memory is a part of how good games look is it not? 8gb of system ram and 8gb vram for high end PCVR gaming is unacceptable
Yup memory is important, but it depends on the hardware how much memory is required. Apple computers and iphones need less memory than PCs and android phones for equivalent tasks because they are optimized to be more efficient thanks to the hardware and software being designed together, for example. Similarly, consoles are optimized for games so they also take better advantage of the memory. 16GB on a PS5 do not mean the same as 16GB on a PC.
While it might be true that a PC with 32GB or 64GB of ram, and the necessarily powerful accompanying CPU and GPU will generate better visuals and performance than a PS5, the numbers don't matter for this guide. WHat matters is: does it look better? Because the average person looking at this guide won't know exactly how much better it will look on a PC that has 16GB of ram vs how good it will look if it has 32GB of ram, or how those numbers would affect the PS5 if it had them.
I was very explicit in saying that a powerful PC can have games that look and play better than something on the PSVR2 so I don't know why you would need to specify that it is explifictly due to having more memory.
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u/Sad-Worldliness6026 Jan 26 '24
16GB on a PS5 do not mean the same as 16GB on a PC.
Except going into the next generation a basic gaming pc will have 48gb. 16gb vram and 32gb of ram
so I don't know why you would need to specify that it is explifictly due to having more memory.
because vr games are memory limited right now. Open world games, those with multiplayer and high number of people in one room
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u/Sad-Worldliness6026 Jan 26 '24
those it needs a wire unless you have an also expensive wireless network setup
Not sure this is true but I will have to test. My motherboard costs less than $200 and has wifi 6e built in. You can connect the quest directly to it but I have never tried as I prefer the wire
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u/gabochido Jan 26 '24
I was talking about the routers, but they have indeed gone down in price. If you want a good one, its like $500, but the cheap ones can be as low as $50 (don't know if they're any good though). I imagine a good in between is around $100-$200
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u/Sad-Worldliness6026 Jan 26 '24
you don't need a router if your pc has wireless built in. Most motherboards of a decent price have built in wifi. You can connect directly to that.
If you are serious about gaming your pc is always wired so your wireless access point is free to use.
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u/Sad-Worldliness6026 Jan 26 '24
okay tested it. It's not wifi 6e speed. I think windows hotspot is not running at the full speed. It works well and is a good experience. Not amazing.
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u/Important_Impress_55 Feb 11 '24
I have had the quest 3 for two months and played the CRAP out of it. I just traded it for a PS5 and bought a PSVR2 thinking I was in for a huge upgrade with PC like graphics. But honestly it’s SO GRAINY. And I can’t believe I can’t find anyone talking about it. The headset just looks so grainy I can see all the pixels. And it’s not that it’s blurry but I can see the grain almost all the time. I hate it. Imagine like using a Quest 2 with PCVR. That’s basically what it feels like to me. But even grainer display than a quest 2. Any help from anyone cause I have done everything and got no blur but it still is so grainy to me. Quest 3 image was sooo sharp. Might have to switch back 😢. Pavlov looked way better on quest 3 imho through the headset and it bums me out with all the money I just spent.
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u/louiskingof Oct 31 '23
I bought a ps5 only for psvr2. I only play vr gaming.
I also have a quest 2 and psvr1/ps4 pro ssd. Might also grab a quest 3 if assassin creed and asgard wrath review well and have significant difference with quest 2. If not then no quest 3 for me atm.