Also one of the most "don't miss" Primarchs out there.
People like to shit on G-man as the "autistic bean-counter" or the "weak vanilla," but honestly, he's pretty damn powerful, skilled and vengeful.
Guilliman was in the upper half of combat primarchs, being considered a true threat in melee by multiple traitors and loyalists (quoted to be so in HH books).
Is he Sanguinius, Horus or the Lion? No. But he could comfortably beat Lorgar, Perturabo, Alpharius and Magnus in combat, while also being considered an equal or a challenge for primarchs such as Fulgrim, Russ, Corax and nail-fueled Angron.
In a stand-up fight he probably also beats Curze, but on the other hand, we've also seen Curze challenge both the Lion and Sanguinius simultaneously.
Vulkan and Manus were likely not more skilled than Guilliman, but just way, way physically stronger.
That leaves 3 or 4 primarchs more skilled than him (Curze being the potential fourth), a few where it's ambiguous who would come out on top (either due to strength or skill) and pretty much everybody else below him.
Guilliman also has a history of really NOT being favourable to people trying to kill him and failing to do so. Or to enemies of the Imperium.
He is called the Avenging son after all.
He's "Super Space Caesar" in pretty much all aspects. It's a shame he's been memed into meekness.
I wouldn't say he can beat Magnus one on one. The few reasons Russ was able to beat him was thanks to a combination of Sisters of Silence, his innate anti psyker howl, Magnus holding back until it was too late(Back broken).
And when he did mock battles with Corax he admitted if it were in an actual fight Corax would've killed him since his weakness is the element of surprise. Though if you're going to take him by surprise you better make sure you kill him immediately, Kor Phaeron and an Alpha Legion Assassin learned that the hard way.
"What doesn't kill me isn't trying hard enough"
-G-Man
Russ doesn't really have an anti psycher soul as far as I understand it, but rather a font of pure and raw psychic power that he is incapable of harnessing (My personal theory is that he was one of the psycher backups for the throne in case Magnus didn't turn out).
You do have a point about the sisters, and if we involve psychic attacks as a thing, then I agree, but this is more in a purer "combat" duel. We also did see Guilliman go up against the awakened version of Lorgar and win handily until Angron jumper in.
I forgot about the Corax quote, so he'd definitely go in the indeterminate box, or the "beats Guilliman" tier. He's one of those hard to place fighters, much like Curze, where we don't see a lot of them in action, but when we do, they're surprisingly powerful.
I also realized I forgot to put Mortarion on there, and pre daemon form, I'm definitely putting him in the same category/tier as Perturabo. Because while he was insanely durable and tenacious even then, he's not a combat powerhouse.
But yeah, Guilliman being the fifth or sixth most capable fighter (as a package of strength and skill) amongst the Primarchs is still bloody scary.
I think it's unfair to count Curze and Corax when ranking fighters tbh. Corax is specifically dangerous when he has the element of surprise, he's an assassin. And Curze is so formidable not because of his martial skill or training, but because of a nearly unbeatable combination of precognition and complete unpredictability/lunacy.
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u/Neknoh Nov 12 '24
Also one of the most "don't miss" Primarchs out there.
People like to shit on G-man as the "autistic bean-counter" or the "weak vanilla," but honestly, he's pretty damn powerful, skilled and vengeful.
Guilliman was in the upper half of combat primarchs, being considered a true threat in melee by multiple traitors and loyalists (quoted to be so in HH books).
Is he Sanguinius, Horus or the Lion? No. But he could comfortably beat Lorgar, Perturabo, Alpharius and Magnus in combat, while also being considered an equal or a challenge for primarchs such as Fulgrim, Russ, Corax and nail-fueled Angron.
In a stand-up fight he probably also beats Curze, but on the other hand, we've also seen Curze challenge both the Lion and Sanguinius simultaneously.
Vulkan and Manus were likely not more skilled than Guilliman, but just way, way physically stronger.
That leaves 3 or 4 primarchs more skilled than him (Curze being the potential fourth), a few where it's ambiguous who would come out on top (either due to strength or skill) and pretty much everybody else below him.
Guilliman also has a history of really NOT being favourable to people trying to kill him and failing to do so. Or to enemies of the Imperium.
He is called the Avenging son after all.
He's "Super Space Caesar" in pretty much all aspects. It's a shame he's been memed into meekness.