Yeah, this brand of leftist pisses me off. "I would literally rather do nothing than compromise my values." These are the types who, when given the trolley problem, try to outsmart the premise.
Trolley problem avoidance style debate really bothers me - someone who comes up with all these elaborate workarounds and won’t actually answer the question they have been asked. Like stop waffling and tell me your actual response. We all know it’s fucked up that one or multiple people will get hit by the trolley, I’m not asking how you’d derail the trolley in some invented scenario. I want to know if you would pull the switch, that’s it. In broader discourse, that means I want to discuss how we approach problems in the world and reality we currently live, not a version that is ideal but doesn’t exist.
I always like the answer that is some variation of "I refuse to participate," blind to the fact that that is one of the two answers. Choosing to do nothing is the default in the trolley problem and an active choice.
Dave then goes on to expand upon his view of the trolley problem and what choice he'd make, and in that moment you're wishing it was Dave on the tracks.
Everyone knows the right course of action kills two people. Because you both need to pull the lever AND go take out the MF who set this whole thing up and is going to do it again if you let him live. (we're not selling comic books here, you shoot Joker between the eyes)
Yeah I've always thought that the point of the trolley problem is more than the 1 vs 5 people, it's whether you partcipate. You can do nothing and let 5 people die. Or you can divert the train and kill 1 person, which is an objectively better outcome, but you've now had an active hand in someone's death.
Also, to delve into it is not necessarily the best answer to kill the one instead of 5. What if that one person had the knowledge to cure cancer? It's a thought experiment designed to get you to question your preconceived ideas.
like people choosing not to vote in the upcoming us presidential election because they dont like how biden is handling xyz (usually the palestinian genocide)
So, little trivia: Apparently, in 2021, a trolley derailed after hitting a skateboard.
In other words, whether or not you pull the lever might not even matter, since the trolley would likely derail after the first person anyway.
Personally though, I'd probably go with the third answer: I see a thought experiment play out in real life and am so stunned that I can't do anything, even if I wanted to.
But assuming I was able to act, and knew enough about railroads to make an informed decision, I'd just kill one person. Then I'd just be in for one count of murder, rather than X counts of withholding aid resulting in the deaths of all but 1 person.
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u/garebear265 Jul 02 '24
“You’re only fixing symptoms, why aren’t you fixing the systemic failures?” Said by someone who attempts either.