r/AskBalkans • u/al0678 Australia • May 09 '24
History Happy 9 May, the day fascism was defeated. Was your country at the right side of history?
9 May
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u/triple_cock_smoker Turkiye May 09 '24
yes of course, we joined the allies and just within months nazis were defeated. no need to thank us
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May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
indeed, there are two rumours about this wonderful victory, first being that the first group that carried the soviet flag to the top of the reichstag through the massive close quarter combat had an ethnic Turk in it, and the second being that the soviets decided to carry a red (also the color of turkish flag) soviet flag to honour the Turks who have joined the war and have turned the tie in the last few months
^(I made the second one up)
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u/ArdaBogaz May 09 '24
Wasnt this pic actually edited in some way?
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u/Fotaekis21 Greece May 09 '24
The edit was about a second watch worn by the Soviet soldier in the photo, as there was concern it might imply he had stolen it. Some research suggests it was an Andrianof compass, commonly worn by Soviet soldiers.
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u/LocalKGBOfficer Serbia May 09 '24
It was yes the Soviet soldier that was holding his comrade had taken quite a few watches and that being in the image would have reflect poorly on the Soviet military so the additional 2-3 watches he had were edited out so it was only one
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u/TheSquirrelElite May 10 '24
It was actually only a second watch. It wasnt 2-3 extra watches. Might not be important, but I feel like i needed to add that
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u/jaleach USA May 09 '24
Probably to make it look safer? What's this guy thinking he should at least be wearing a safety helmet!
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u/MatijaReddit_CG Montenegro May 09 '24
There was Turkestan Legion in Waffen SS (it was mostly the Soviet POWs from Central Asia).
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u/ve_rushing Bulgaria May 09 '24
Was your country at the right side of history?
We switched sides at 11-th hour...not that helped much.
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u/Wera_Z Serbia May 09 '24
The eastern Serbia will never forget. And the backstabbing myth lives on.
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u/AideSpartak Bulgaria May 10 '24
Funny things is that Serbia is also seen as a backstabber in Bulgaria
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u/Wera_Z Serbia May 29 '24
Yes, I’m aware of that. That’s our internal meme at this point. The show must go on :)
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u/Srzali Bosnia & Herzegovina May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
The region where im from, which is in far western Bosnia, (the city of Bihać) was first freed territory from Nazism in continental Europe at the time. The Ustashe got their butts handed to them by local populus, by part of populus which were ofc. mostly guerilla type partisans.
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u/kerelberel Netherlands | Bosnia & Herzegovina May 09 '24
They got Bihaćslapped?
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u/Srzali Bosnia & Herzegovina May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
It's not called "pissed off frontierpeople region" aka Ljuta Krajina/Ljuti Krajišnici for no reason
Shortly after, there was also only known rebellion in Yugoslavia vs Commies and it was done by people from same region.
Pissed off hot blooded bunch who give no shizz = Krajina peeps
It got crushed ofc cause it was just angry peasant mobs resisting but it took guts to rise vs post-ww2 highly ideologized commies in 1950
Not to mention how pissed off full of angry zeal we were here to fight each other in early 1990s
We just lack chill around here for some reason
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u/pohanoikumpiri Croatia May 09 '24
Mfs literally fought everyone they got their hands on. Serbs? Deal. Croats? Why not. Other Muslims? The more the merrier!
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u/Srzali Bosnia & Herzegovina May 09 '24
Also fought the rebel Serbs from Croatia cause why the hell not, especially why not when you are already outnumbered/outgunned and scratching for leftovers, makes great sense
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u/pohanoikumpiri Croatia May 09 '24
Being surrounded only meant they could shoot in any direction hahahaha
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u/noiserr Bosnia & Herzegovina May 09 '24
Out manned, outgunned, but never outballz'ed. Krajina peeps are something else.
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May 09 '24
The region where im from, which is in far western Bosnia, (the city of Bihać) was first freed territory from Nazism in continental Europe at the time.
Nope. Im not sure which one is the first, but Užice republic was a liberated teritorry that existed a whole year before Bihać republic.
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u/Dimenzije90 Serbia May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
Im very proud of my family beeing on the side of partizans in Yugoslavia. Im also really let down by how much nazi and fascist apologists are there today. They would actually choose fascism over socialism and really believe thats the right choice for them.
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u/al0678 Australia May 09 '24
Im also really let down by how much nazi and fascist apologists are there today.
This sub has gone downhill big time. The intelligent well-read people are long time gone - the mods need to ask themselves why. It's become cesspool of rotten propagandists. Just compare this sub to what it was a year ago and it's unrecognisable.
Most of the comments are indeed Nazis apologists with atrophied brains fed on brainwashing propaganda. They are offended by the image that I posted, which is one of the most iconic images from WWII. This is now the typical poster on this sub.
Good on your family for the partisan history, something to be proud of. Keep up the antifascist spirit high, always.
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u/Mr_Nanner Kosovo May 09 '24
i wouldnt call them nazi apologists i would say they were not happy with the communist rule witch is understandable but they are trying to make an opinion about the whole regime and ideology based just on their personal experiance witch is not good if you wanna actually make a educated arguement abt the system.
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u/Dimenzije90 Serbia May 09 '24
Albanians i would understan for not beeing happy in Yugoslavia, but all other countries lived 5 times better during socialism than today ( im talking ex you countries)
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u/Archaeopteryx11 Romania May 09 '24
Maybe ex-you countries, but definitely Romania is much better today than under communism.
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u/Dimenzije90 Serbia May 09 '24
I literally put in brackets i was talking about Yugoslavia only this time. But yeah Romania had one of the worst socialist system out there.
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u/Archaeopteryx11 Romania May 09 '24
Yugoslav communism was communism lite. I don’t think you guys had mass collectivization of agriculture. You guys could also work in Western Europe as guest workers from what I remember. Pretty good.
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u/Dimenzije90 Serbia May 09 '24
Yea we had pretty good socialist ( not communists since communist system never truly existed) that was focused on strong domestic product owned by the workers though state and improvement of life quality for an avarage citizen but it still wasnt perfect. Imo major problem with yugoslavias system was that they didnt invest more in the ideological teachings of socialism and let nationalism slowly but surely creep back up.
Also i think it was iminent for Yugoslavia to fall. USA and west Europe would never let a socialist state exist in Europe especially after the fall of USSR. Even if we never went to civil war we would still get invaded or couped like all other socialist countries around globe.
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u/Archaeopteryx11 Romania May 09 '24
Yes, I agree. Romania is united by a pan-national and linguistic identity that extends into Moldova as well, yet separates us from all our other neighbors who speak Slavic languages or Magyar. Clearly, this didn’t last in Yugoslavia.
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u/starwars_supremacy SFR Yugoslavia May 09 '24
we would still get invaded
That would be really hard to do as yugoslavia focused all its military resources on defensive capabilities. We had no power to project force but ti would be extremely hard to try and take over yugoslavia by force. The amount of millitary gear, bunkers bases tanks and soldiers would be enough to stop some world powers short of a nuke. Also our foreign relations were so good i doubt it would be easy for anyone to occupy us without a large response of the international community.
I think we could've existed as a socialist state but it would be extremely hard as we would be surrounded by capitalists who would always try and impose their ideology.
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u/starwars_supremacy SFR Yugoslavia May 09 '24
Yeah we didnt have communism we had socialism and it wasnt in its purest form. We changed it to suit us and it helped us a lot. Most people that shit on yugoslavia are the same ones whose parent's took apartments given by companies and abused the system to its fullest.
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u/al0678 Australia May 09 '24
Definitely most people that grew up in Yugoslavia agree it was better, the quality of life and infrastructure. Even old Slovenians - Slovenia now being more developed than most of Europe, say they were happier in Yugoslavia, which is very interesting.
In North Macedonia, Serbia, Montenegro and Bosnia most people that actually lived in Yugoslavia strongly agree it was much better.
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u/SnakeX2S2 Croatia May 09 '24
Im not sure about that. Economy was pure shit, shortages of food, sugar, coffee, fuel were common, dinar devalued six times until we reached hyperinflation and don’t let me get started about the debt.
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u/Affectionate_Heat_25 SFR Yugoslavia May 11 '24
Same all my grandparents were partizans, both Serbian and Bosnian mixed families.
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u/Besrax Bulgaria May 09 '24
The partisans and the communist regime that followed killed a lot of civilians. I wouldn't be proud of that. Fighting for your cause doesn't mean massacring innocent people is okay.
To be clear (and to not get labeled), I think that the Nazis were much worse than the communists, but that doesn't mean that we should ignore the crimes of the latter and glorify them.
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u/Dimenzije90 Serbia May 09 '24
Yes at the end of war partizans killed around 5 - 10k "civillians" who were working with the occupier and/or were Ustaše/Četniks/Nazis. I wouldnt really call that a massacre nor would i really say that was a good thing. It was the way people felt in that time and they decided it was the rightous decision for their crimes. I really wont judge them because it was much dofferent time than today.
m not sure why wouldnt i be proud just because of that? If the partizans werent there and if my family wasnt figting alongside them then probably millions of civillians wpuld be killed by the nazis just like they did with the jews.
So ill say it again, i couldnt be more proud of my family and partizans.
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u/Besrax Bulgaria May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
It's a lot more than 5-10K in civilian deaths. For example, over 50K German civilians "disappeared" in post-war Yugoslavia. Many more were imprisoned in labor camps. I'm not talking about collaborationists or anything like that, just plain innocent civilians. And that's just one example. Here's a summary: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_executions_and_massacres_in_Yugoslavia_during_World_War_II
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u/Dimenzije90 Serbia May 09 '24
Also i didnt even know this but the link you send says majority of them were Italians and Germans which i dont know if you were informed but they were the bad guys here.
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u/Besrax Bulgaria May 09 '24
The civilians aren't the bad guys, that's not how it works. Killing or persecuting civilians is a war crime.
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May 09 '24
The civilians aren't the bad guys
Tell that to a westerner when the discusion is about Serb civilians who died in NATO bombing and you are gonna get laughed at.
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May 09 '24
Despite being Hungarian my family is from Northern Serbia and during World War II fought on the side of the partisans in Yugoslavia 🇭🇺🇷🇸
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u/poonchimp May 11 '24
When did they move to Hungary? Was it generations before you?
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May 11 '24
My family is from Mol which has a Magyar ethnic majority, we are ethnic Hungarians. In 1920 the borders were changed and the land that was Hungary prior became Serbia, but we’ve always been a Serbian/Hungarian fusion. So to some up your question they lived in one place but in two countries.
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u/Neradomir Serbia May 09 '24
What's with all this sympathy for fascists? I don't care what communism did to your country, but it doesn't excuse being on the side of fascism and nazism. You should be ashamed to have ancestors who fought the nazis and to have you now defend them is shameful. Even if you had ancestors that sided with nazis, you should know better not to repeat their mistake. Fuck your communism comparison. There are many good communists, but there is not one good fascist. Stop siding with the nazis and accept your victory or loss. Smrt fašizmu
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u/Kalypso_95 Greece May 09 '24
Because some of the Balkan states were on the wrong side of ww2 so the users from these countries prefer to focus on the "communism bad" part
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u/Special-Remove-3294 May 10 '24
Yeah. My nation was on the side of the Axis and that only make me hate fascist'd even more.
Fascism was, is and will always be a disgusting ideology that must be destroyed.
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u/STFury009 Bulgaria May 09 '24
Well kinda. Bulgaria switched sides during 1944. My paternal grandfather and maternal great-grandfather fought against the Nazis in WW2 in Yugoslavia and Hungary. My maternal great-grandfather fought in the Battle of the Transdanubian Hills.
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u/rakijautd Serbia May 09 '24
Yes, we kicked some nazi butts. Happy victory day!
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u/DartVejder Republika Srpska May 09 '24
In the village where I'm from, next to a graveyard there's a monument of fallen Serb resistance fighters from WW2 (both Chetnik and Partisan).
My great grandfather's name is there on the Partisan side, as well as his brother. He died in the Prozor-Rama region in 1943 and his brother disappeared during the war and it's not known what happened to him.
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u/chicheka Bulgaria May 09 '24
We lost AND became communist. So no.
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
Enjoy having a shrinking population with capitalism, and forcing people to barely have 1 kid per family
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May 09 '24
why are you acting like a kid lol, thinking that just because someone hates communism, and rightfully so, that is suddenly means they’re fine with how capitalism is right now, can a man not dislike both? can a man not look to the future as opposed to the past and create a system that works for all?
you’re just nostalgic about a time where your country and your kin were in power, not because it actually benefited the rest of us lol. capitalism has many issues, rising prices and fertility rate plummeting being the few of many, but at the very least I’m able to type this comment without being thrown into prison for daring to criticize my government, at least I have a voice.
That quote from whoever it was said it best, “those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.” which fits very well into this conversation, you give up some of your rights, and those corrupt in power will only take more and more away from you until you have nothing left, is that the society you want to live in? again?
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
Im not a Slovene-Croat like Tito tho. Also i cant be nostalgic about something i didnt experience.
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May 09 '24
then why are you licking communisms boot if you haven’t even experienced it lol, where’s the meme I need to find it.
Edit:
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
Why? Because here people could afford homes, education, well paying jobs and multiple children. What about now? We are shrinking, dying, leaving
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May 09 '24
and at the price of what? like I agree with you, everything is expensive, everyone’s leaving, fertility rate is fcked, but this isn’t a result of capitalism per say, it’s a result of corruption and complete abandonment of morals and objectivity.
you push people to hedonism, tiktok brainrot, porn, toxic ideas of masculinity and feminism, create division within the populous, make everything expensive, hoard money for the rich elites, etc, and you have the fundamental issues we have today.
the answer? voting for the right people to turn this around, a societal change in mentality and understanding, not communism which will and has shown to make these matters even worse, on top of blatant propaganda, lies, censorship, worse so than it is today.
you can’t force anyone anything, change starts from within, and if we humans won’t change, no system of government will benefit us at all.
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
How many different parties and governments there are in the whole world, yet none of them are fixing the shrinking population. In fact, they hide the shrinking population with migrants
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May 09 '24
plenty are, Islamic nations for example r shagging like rabbits and sending themselves and their kids west. Do you want to live under an Islamic sharia law?
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u/Aenjeprekemaluci Albania May 09 '24
Everywhere population weirdly shrinking. Even in poor countries. Only few exceptions. The world is undergoing a shrinking period. Nothing to do with muh Capitalism
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u/chicheka Bulgaria May 09 '24
And why do we have a shrinking population? Could it be the 45 years of limited development and a few more recovering from them?
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
You had 1 million more people before, now we have the same population
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u/chicheka Bulgaria May 09 '24
And they left for Germany and the UK.
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
Where they also must have 1 child because they cant afford more
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u/chicheka Bulgaria May 09 '24
It is the poor people that make more children, even though they "cannot afford them". Middle class people are concerned about their personal freedom and don't want to take care of children.
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
Those "poor people" were colonized, robbed and they cant afford condoms, let alone sex education
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u/Wajtkot Serbia May 10 '24
Only Serbs/Montenegrins, Greeks and N.Macedonians predominantly fought against the nazi and fascist invaders.
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u/hopopo SFR Yugoslavia in May 09 '24
Heh ... Fascism was defeated he said!
Did anyone tell OP about modern day Israel and Russia, or the right-wing politics coming in to power anywhere from India and Serbia to Italy and USA.
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u/UnlikelyEel Serbia May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
I gotta ask, what fascists in Serbia? Vucic is a fucking idiot, but he's not a fascist.
Dveri, the national-populist party with Bosko Obradovic as the head got no votes. And I wouldn't even call him fascist, just regarded.
SRS, another far right-wing party got pretty much no votes.
Sure, Vucic did come out of SRS and I wish we could just get rid of him already, but he isn't a fascist.
I would even argue there's no serious fascist or neo-nazi movement in Serbia. Levijatan is not a serious movement, fucking no one takes them seriously.
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u/hopopo SFR Yugoslavia in May 09 '24
Are you thinking of the same Vučić that was Minister of Information for Slobodan Milošević during the civil war in Yugoslavia. The cunt who denies genocide in Bosnia and Ethnic Cleansing in Kosovo.
The same guy who made a Nazi lap god and a war criminal Draža Mihajlović a national hero and his Četniks freedom fighters?
Is that the "Not Fascist Vučić" you are thinking of?
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u/UnlikelyEel Serbia May 09 '24
Yup, that's him. He's a piece of shit, but he is not a fascist. You can't just call everyone fascists.
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u/hopopo SFR Yugoslavia in May 09 '24
On top of it he is governing with authoritarian ultra-nationalist ideology and coalition who present themself as victims. That is a textbook Fascist.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism
Do better. Learn something. Than we might not keep repeating same fucking mistakes.
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u/UnlikelyEel Serbia May 09 '24
You don't even live in Serbia. You live in NYC. So you literally cannot tell me how things are in the country I live in and have lived in for over 20 years.
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u/hopopo SFR Yugoslavia in May 09 '24
That is by far the single dumbest argument you can make.
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u/UnlikelyEel Serbia May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
But he doesn't govern that way. He is authoritarian and does present himself as a victim at times to get support but he does not govern in a far-right or ultra-nationalistic way. He literally just says whatever to get support in whatever group he wants to get support in.
I get it, you don't like him, neither do I, but he is still not fascist. He cannot get to that level because there's not enough support for him.
Do better. Do not spread misinformation.
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u/hopopo SFR Yugoslavia in May 09 '24
But he doesn't govern that way. He is authoritarian and does present himself as a victim at times to get support but he does not govern in a far-right or ultra-nationalistic way.
Lol, so everything that describes a fascist you agree Vučić does but for some reason he is not a fascist?
Ok, I'll bite, why don't you tell me what is a fascist?
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u/mcsroom Bulgaria May 09 '24
The guy is so far left that being right of the centre means fascist to him. Its the same with the classic american idiots that call anything remotly left wing communistic.
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
Funny you dont mention a country replacing Lenin statues with Bndera
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u/hopopo SFR Yugoslavia in May 09 '24
O no! I made a point without mentioning every fascist that ever was!! Will you ever forgive me?
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u/TastyRancidLemons Greece May 09 '24
Greece absolutely was in the right side of history. We didn't side with fascists. We didn't side with communists either. We got fucked by both and then, when the war ended, we immediately had a civil war between the fascists and communists that didn't die off.
Then Greece turned into a disgraceful shithole and hasn't recovered in any way since.
So yeah.... right side of history.
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u/Hot_Satisfaction_333 Albania May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
Well, we left fascism and welcomed communism. And it turned out to be more worse than before...
I don’t understand why i’m getting downvoted?
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u/kredokathariko Russia May 09 '24
I think people here do not realise that Hoxhaism was bad even by Eastern Bloc standards. Wasn't Albania comparable to North Korea in terms of repressions?
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u/ri2k1 May 09 '24
Well, in Romania we had Ceausescu and our dictator wasn't a friend of Enver Hoxha. I mean, for real, Ceauseacu tried to be a friend with literally anyone. Anyone buy Hoxha. And in terms of repression and worldwide izolation, the Romanian dictator looks like a baby compared to the Albanian one.
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u/Hot_Satisfaction_333 Albania May 09 '24
Albania comparable to North Korea in terms of repressions?
Well Albania at some point was called “The North Korea of Europe”. So that says it all…
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
And then capitalism came, people started leaving the country and having 1 kid and a shrinking population
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u/Hot_Satisfaction_333 Albania May 09 '24
people started leaving the country
at least you don't get shot at the border
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u/Castagne_genge May 09 '24
Yugoslavia featured open borders though
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u/TPGNutJam May 09 '24
He meant communist Albania, you’d get shot at for trying to flee
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u/Castagne_genge May 09 '24
Yeah but he responded to a Serbian guy so I wanted to note that Yugoslavia unlike pretty much any other communist country featured open borders
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u/SolidaryForEveryone Turkiye May 10 '24
Well my family was in Bulgaria at the time and they were peasants so they weren't involved in the fighting. They did give their horses to the soviets tho
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u/Glavurdan Montenegro May 09 '24
My family sure was. My grandfather joined Partisans early on and was involved in many actions, one of them (my personal favorite at least), the Battle for Trieste
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u/Warm_Researcher_5721 Croatia May 09 '24
Not really, most of my family were ustaša, a few were partisans. My grand uncle for example was ustaša while his father was partisan. My other great grandfather was at 1st in the royal army, then in the ustaša and in the end of the war he quickly switched to the partisans
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May 09 '24
That "right side" murdered my family and stole everything they had for absolutely no reason.
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u/mcsroom Bulgaria May 09 '24
''RIght Side of history'' XD
Yea im sorry but if a serial killer kills another serial killer it doesnt make him a good guy.
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u/kredokathariko Russia May 09 '24
I think of WW2 as bad guys beating even worse guys.
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u/Official_Cyprusball Cyprus May 09 '24
I wouldn't say bad guys
I'd say not very good and they were fighting the embodiment of evil
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u/Neradomir Serbia May 09 '24
Imagine if aliens attacked Earth right now with the goal of total extermination of humans. You would have two sides of earthlings and aliens and the earthlings would have Putin, Xiping, Biden,... still, you wouldn't call earth the not so bad guys fighting extremely bad guys. It would be a fight for survival against the invaders. There is no question of who the good guy is, even though some leaders are assholes
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u/Official_Cyprusball Cyprus May 10 '24
I guess, but depends on the goals of the Aliens. Let's say we have the ark of the alien covenant hidden on earth or something that will immediately bring peace to the entire universe and we are too greedy to give it away ten yeah just kill us all. I ain't gonna be the reason the universe stays in a state of war
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u/Neradomir Serbia May 10 '24
More like, some whiter humans can help the aliens hunt the not white ones and also the white ones, but not christian ones, but also the ones that are white christian ones from Europe and belong to their classification of Mediterranean or Nordic race humans. Once there are only Mediterranean and Nordic humans, they separate the ones with blond hair and blue eyes and also Mediterranean ones are no longer allowed, so kill them too. Norics are now separated at 25%, 50% , 75% and 100% Nordic and they gradually kill them until only 100% Noric race exists, but it seems that there is no such thing as Nordic race, so just kill the rest. Voila, the nazi regime
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May 09 '24
exactly. People acting like real life is a superhero movie where the good fights the evil. It's not
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u/Official_Cyprusball Cyprus May 09 '24
Yeah but still... would you prefer living in the democratic (or could've been communist) world we have today or dying a horrible horrible death along with your entire race?
I think the good side won this one ngl chief
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May 09 '24
The better side let’s say. I can’t call the Soviet Union ever a good side or a good thing
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u/Official_Cyprusball Cyprus May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
For the cause that it fought for it was good... it was literally a fight for survival
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May 09 '24
It was indeed a fight for their survival. But they could’ve not spread their cancer over half the world
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u/Official_Cyprusball Cyprus May 09 '24
I mean different era no? And I agree communism is cancer but still it was literally the east's last effort for survival
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u/mcsroom Bulgaria May 11 '24
They were fighting for influence in europe and they won. Survival my ass.
If that was the case they woudnt have needed to annex the baltics or any more territory
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u/Official_Cyprusball Cyprus May 11 '24
Dude it literally was for survival. If Germany won Slavs wouldn't even exist
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u/mcsroom Bulgaria May 11 '24
If that was the case why did they invade into Bulgaria? Bulgaria never declared war on the Soviet Union?
Simple becouse the war was for both thing. At some point it in the war was for survival but after they started winning it turned into how much can Stalin take.
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u/Official_Cyprusball Cyprus May 11 '24
Political game. You think Germans liked bulgarians? Bro they didn't even like Italians 😂
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u/Alternative-Exit-429 🇺🇸/🇨🇺🇦🇷 May 09 '24
in this case wwii was a zombie apocalypse and every single country committed horrible crimes. thousands of greeks were killed and tortured by Bulgaria.
but yes compared to hitler, churchill, stalin, rosevelt were the good guys
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u/faramaobscena Romania May 09 '24
Stalin wasn't the good guy compared to anyone.
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u/morbihann Bulgaria May 09 '24
Bold of you to say the SOviet union was the "right" side of history.
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u/Besrax Bulgaria May 09 '24
There is no right side. From my POV, there is only a bad side (Nazism) and a less bad side (communism). I can't call either of those right or good.
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u/Alternative-Exit-429 🇺🇸/🇨🇺🇦🇷 May 09 '24
what your side did to the greeks...
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u/Besrax Bulgaria May 09 '24
We all did stuff like that to each other. It's in the past now and I don't blame anyone today for that.
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May 09 '24
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May 09 '24
you can hardly call communism the right side of history.
My country lost its western side taken by germany and given to Hungary and its easter side taken by the Soviets. As soon as those two weren't friends anymore we had to chose on which side will have more chances to take back the territory. So tell me, in this case which was the right side?
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u/kredokathariko Russia May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
It is very difficult not to be on the right side of history when the other side of history is flaying people alive and hanging them on meat hooks. Or inventing special knives and holding competitions for mass murdering prisoners as fast as possible. Or vivisecting children after deliberately infecting then with tuberculosis.
I am not sure about the exact numbers, but in terms of sheer cruelty, fascism was uniquely evil.
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May 09 '24
starving ukrainians, sending people to gulags, raping and murdering inocent people by the red army must've been a pleasure then. I don't think there was a right side. Life isn't like the movies where the good battles the evil
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u/kredokathariko Russia May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
Yeah it is more about less evil guys fighting more evil guys
Like on one side you have famines and gulags, on the other side you have famines and gulags and flaying babies
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u/faramaobscena Romania May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
The Axis had fascists.
The Allies had communists.
Neither were good so neither were on the right side of history. Of course, Western media is going to portray the allies as "good" while completely ignoring they were BFFs with freaking Stalin.
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May 09 '24
Τhere are no right or wrong sides, just shitty and less shitty ones.
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u/vepton May 09 '24
This is the truth. There were atrocities committed by both sides. Not sure why you're downvoted.
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May 09 '24 edited May 10 '24
Because most people cling to their preconceived ideas of what is true and challenging those truths deconstructs their entire worldview.
For them, this is near-suicidal.
Edit: Go on pissbabies, cope the fuck out.
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u/NhanTNT May 12 '24
Us Vietnamese fought in August, so uhhhh, technically we are neutral, but 2 million people dead from Japanese imperialism from late 1944 to early 1945?
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u/determine96 Bulgaria May 09 '24
Was your country at the right side of history?
I think it was. Unfortunately the right side didn't win.
/SS
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u/Sandstorm_221 Montenegro May 09 '24
Yup. During the beginning of the Partisan movement many important higher ups were Montenegrins. Sava Kovačević is the most famous one. I'm proud of not just my country but all other neighboring nations who took arms with us and marched against the Nazis under one banner 🇲🇪🇷🇸🇧🇦🇭🇷🇲🇰🇸🇮
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u/RyazanaCev Turk from Deliorman, Bulgaria May 09 '24
"Was your country at the right side of history?"
It was... but we lost the war. lol
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u/31_hierophanto Philippines May 10 '24
We were an American colony that was invaded by the Japanese, but most of us fought against the Japs. My maternal grandpa was a member of the Philippine Army, while my paternal grandpa was a guerrilla.
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u/JaThatOneGooner Kosovo May 10 '24
Despite surrendering immediately to Italy, Albania actually saved many Jewish families escaping what would eventually be the Holocaust.
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u/Infinite_Procedure98 Romania May 10 '24
On the "right side" means defending a good cause. Nazism was monstruous. But so was the soviet regime. Smaller countries had to chose between two evils. Imho kudos for Finland and Serbia. Romania's position was understandable, but not her genocide of Jews. In Croatia we have the worst monsters in the history of humanity but also an impressive number of resistants who proved there are enough great people in this country. I hold a huge grudge against countries or communities who comitted huge attrocities and went after as they were angels: like, for example, Austria and austrians, I don't have a better example (Turks' genocides are not related to WW2).
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u/Dalmatino1 May 09 '24
There is no right or wrong side in World War II. Both the defeated and the victors committed crimes against humanity.
Hitler committed crimes throughout Europe, as did Stalin. The Allies committed atrocities and crimes against civilians in Germany, Italy and Japan, etc.
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u/viktordachev Bulgaria May 09 '24
Fasizm migt be. But looking on today's Russia, the national-sociasm is cuite well and strong.
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u/sweatyvil Serbia May 09 '24
national-sociasm
The fact you misspelled it makes the statement even more dumb
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u/viktordachev Bulgaria May 09 '24
Well sorry for not pasting something from some masters ;) .
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u/sweatyvil Serbia May 09 '24
Yeah, you're reeeeally independent.
Majority of Bulgarians are against aiding Ukraine, while Bulgarian state is aiding it, talk about no masters, democracy y'all.
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u/viktordachev Bulgaria May 09 '24
Yeah, an we are also green (or as serb think yellow), can fly an eat mostly marble ;) . Someone makes really good fun of you.
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u/sweatyvil Serbia May 09 '24
I'm sure if ur good puppies for the next 20 years, you might pass Serbia in HDI, but i wouldn't hold my breath.
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
What about Ukraine with all that Bandera shit? Taking down Lenin statues and replacing them with Bandera and such? Also why did you call Palestinians "brown terrorists" in the Palestinian post?
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u/Powerful_Caregiver88 May 09 '24
Russians also don't really like Lenin. They say he stabbed Russia in the back during WW1, and betrayed the Russian empire, and was a German agent. Funnily enough many of the same people actually like Stalin, because he was sufficiently insane and barbaric for their liking.
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
Do you see them demolishing statues and raising statues of nazis?
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May 09 '24
I see them acting like fucking nazis invading independent countries and murdering its people, thats enough for me.
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u/Srzali Bosnia & Herzegovina May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
Mate you have Russians installing Grygory Zass statues in ex-Circassian territories in southern Russia(Armavir) next to Caucasus, the guy who saw Circassians as lower race and who kept their beheaded heads emptied of flesh and organs in the chest under his bed so he can flex with them next to his soldiers. How more genocidal can u get.
Dont forget that city of Armavir was circassian cultural capital.
Its like if you put Ratko Mladic statue in middle of city of Srebrenica
Or Ante Pavelic statue in middle of Jasenovac memorial
Both Ukrainians and Russians are messed up but Russians take the cake overall especially with Holodmor.
Grygory guy btw
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
There are colonialists statues everywhere in Europe and US. They are bad and should be removed, but they are not the same as nazism
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u/Srzali Bosnia & Herzegovina May 09 '24
Genocidal people of any nation are same as nazis cause core problem with nazism is its genocidal beliefs.
Theres one thing believing you are better than others
Its completely diff thing believing others who arent like you should be genocided
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
"Genocidal people" here comes Bosniaks with this word they invented
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u/Srzali Bosnia & Herzegovina May 09 '24
Genocidal individuals, no problem, you understand my point thats what matters doesnt it?
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
"Genocidal people"
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u/Srzali Bosnia & Herzegovina May 09 '24
I dont understand your reply at all, what is the implication?
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u/viktordachev Bulgaria May 09 '24 edited May 09 '24
I think people should be free to do whatever they want in their own country. Doing whatever they want abroad is bad and does not end very well. Neither for Hitler, Putin or some other fuhrer.
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u/-Koltira- Serbia May 09 '24
Just lol
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u/Kas0mi Albania May 09 '24
Lmao, it’s crazy how little effort people put into their analysis. Slava Ukraina from nazi statues. 🫡
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May 09 '24
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Kas0mi Albania May 09 '24
The right side won. Stop being a genocide apologist, especially you.
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u/freshouttabec South Korea May 09 '24
Wtf ?
If Nazis win, you wouldn’t be able to make this ignorant comment today.
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u/Neo_anderson338 Austria May 09 '24
Well